Frustrated

So... making BLM comparable to SCH: Get Mythic and melee... got it.

was that pre or after successive MB nerf? if you have a mix of BLM and 2 SCH for SCing you have to consider that the BLMs will always land the first nuke while the SCH are still stuck in aftercast animation from closing SC. assuming the 2 SCH cycle SC chances are that at least 50% of their nukes run into MB wall so this type of parse comparison is misleading.

If it was in the Dyna-D era, it was no doubt after the "resist wall" changes.

Irrelevant in alliance setup.

I don't see 6 SCH in an alliance being more efficient than 2 SCH + 4 BLM. When you alternate strats and 1hr/WC during downtime you can keep MB coming none stop for a REALLY long time. Do you even need need 1hr/WC with 2 SCH? So having anything more than 3 is just a waste of DPS slots.

I mean, 2 SCH max per alliance has been the standard practice for blm setup since forever. I don't get why people suddenly pop on the forum claiming BLM should be replaced or something.



There is no point comparing the alliance DPS using only SCH v.s only BLM. The optimal setup has always been having both jobs in the same alliance. Missing any one of them DPS will gimp. Why would you compare jobs when they are not being used optimally?

If you are going to compare the alliance kill speed using 6 SCH v.s 2 SCH 4 BLM, I can tell you the alliance with 4 BLM will definitely kill faster just by rewatching video above. Even if SCH only pt has 4 DD SCH that never start MB and just nuke the entire time, they will not do more DPS than BLM.

1) Not all MB burst 99k as stated above. Most of the time only first 2-3 nuke after each MB hits 99k the rest gets lower. When you don't BLM should have higher dmg per nuke.

2) DDs actually continue to free nuke without MB, when they do BLM should do higher damage per free nuke. All these "SCH MB for 99k too" argument is irrelevant during free nuke between MB.

3) When adds pop BLM were the one that spams ja/ga III to kill them, SCH doesn't have such option. Therefore the kill speed should decrease if alliance has 0 BLM.

I just don't get why people insist SCH(hybrid job) can compete with BLM(DD). It sounds like misinformation to me.

Already considered it. But my point initially was to disprove someone's "everyone MB for 99k so SCH DPS can compete with BLM" talk.

I mean, if your dmg got cut off because of resist wall, that means majority of your nukes will not hit 99k in endgame setting.

So their claim is wrong either way.

According to wiki BLM has 5 tiers of MBB but SCH has 3. This trait isn't subject to gear caps. BLM also has higher macc(I think?) which matters in endgame. Unless I'm terribly missing something not seeing SCH winning parses in endgame either way.

Not to mention I'm pretty sure those SCHs are benefitting from a BLM's Burn and its -63INT potential with proper gear.


....but I'd be remiss if I didnt' make a joke at your last comment in your prior post <3



Oh, you mean like COR(hybrid job) vs RNG(DD job)?

RNG is a better DD, obviously :P

As always, all the luv, Afania. I wouldn't have even taken COR seriously if not for runnin w/ ya.

Who said anything about meleeing? Nuking gives massive TP. No reason to melee at all. Sure, you will be in melee range, but hey, that is what Manawall is for. If you can be that close up, then you can even use the +15% dmg belt and pray for weather procs :D

no need to "pray for weather procs" if all us BLMs and SCHs can be friends^^

Ima just say that if you want to play a job you find fun and if you can clear content with said job all power to you. This game is not only old but really easy and gear creep has only made content more trivial. That being said the point of this thread was discussing the viability of blm in the current meta, and the point stands that it had much to he desired. Aside from the video you posted with the atrocious clear time there is hardly any content where

A: blm does notably more damage than sch (I saw a bursted helix in the video, not sure how the parse tracks that but doesn't matter)
B: and this is the important part, where nuke damage is an optimal strategy in the first place. Not magic damage, nuke damage.

Already mentioned was how blm offers very little to the group besides nuke damage (questionable tanking and stat down spells aside), and how a party / alliance needs to be catered to blm specifically for it to function. You can replace every single blm in that alliance with a rdm for example and it will only improve your run, be it a faster run or more complete run. During this statue crusher campaign my group cleared every single statue, as well as every red eyes NM, the wave 2 boss, and every volte mob and we still had over 20m on the clock and that was with 4 jobs doing 90% of the damage. I've sold wave 3 clears to ten buyers and killed the wave 3 boss in less than ten minutes using only 8 players, at least a third of which where automated. None of these runs contained blm and if they did they probably wouldn't have worked out.

Again, if you really want to play blm, and have sufficient knowledge and skill and are willing to build groups around it, go for it and have fun. But as it stands blm is the worst job in the game. Not even by a little bit, but by a lot. Nin and bst look like cor and rune next to a blm.

Already mentioned how BLM setup being one of the best choice for Lilith VD. BLM+SCH can clear VD in 1-2 min without having to deal with fetter. Just because how little nuke damage feed TP, it becomes possible to absorb TP spam to keep fetters away.

If you use another ranged magic DD like RNG or cor to do the same, they will probably feed more TP than nuke damage during TP phrase and ended up killing slower due to TP move and ***.

I'm aware that MNK can kill just as fast fetter-less, or Sam DRK with SP can skip TP move ***. Outside of these 3 jobs I don't know if other jobs can accomplish 1-2 fetter less VD runs.

So strategy wise I don't think nuke damage is completely useless. It's safer than melee magic damage, and feeds less TP than ranged magic damage. I'm not even sure if ranged magic damage beats nuke damage in longer fights when you can't chain triple shot.

The issue is that community bandwagon the most popular setup so they wouldn't experiment blm setup in content to begin with. Its like how people bash MNK and RDM 3 years ago lol.

Even if BLM is a more ideal choice in certain content most people wouldn't know if nobody play them. I only know BLM is this effective in Lilith VD because a BLM addict (?) made VD parties for it. So I do think that if someone is really into the job and experiment they will discover things that it is best at.

He meant to use Orpheus's and get random chance (33%) to get weather proc, instead of using Obi.

BLM can get off just as many MBs as a sch can with higher tier nukes. SCH doesnt cast their spells faster than other jobs anymore due to wide access to fast cast cap presets.

Yes, sch provides more utility. Thats literally its thing. Same with RDM. Neither come close to the damage output of a BLM. Theyre physically not meant to.

"Grimoire: Spellcasting time -XX%" is separate from Fast Cast. So yes, they are the fastest casters in the game.

I think Blm setup has a lot of potential but harder to pull off well for noobs parties. That's why they are unpopular.

Back in 2016-2917 I watched a trio of 2 Blms and a Sch just nuke their way into most of the content like geafetes with a trust tank and a healer. They just pop, trust tank and stand far away to MB the nukes. It was slow but very controlled.

would think BLM, or general nuke setups would be easier, you're limiting TP feed considerably, giving far less hate, have less people to heal in most cases

The only part of a BLM strat more complicated than anything done via melee/ranged DPS is patience, which certainly doesn't vibe with today's parse-addicted playerbase.

A little bit of the problem is elements. A mob may resist 7/8 elements, but rarely does weapon type really matter. And for those, Tomahawk is a thing, but there's really no magical equivalent. You're kinda stuck with one element at a time.

Like you can stack all the ***you want, you're still not really nuking Garuda with wind.

But yeah, speed is king.

Well there is. Rayke with 3 runes lowers SDT by 3 tiers and skillchain lowers it by 1 tier.

Not really the main point of this, but while we're talking about improving BLM, can SE stop being stubborn and put them on EX staff weaponskills? SMN too.

Why I need to sub WHM to use Cataclysm is beyond me, it never made sense. And yeah, drop the AoE and Magic Burst damage walls, those are archaic and don't belong in the game anymore. I'd say they should move that AoE damage reduction to their new content instead of the 90% damage reduction it is now but at the very least just remove the damage wall BLM/GEO suffers from using aga/ara spells.

Its not so fast that youll get a whole new spell off compared to blm.

It totally is.

I think the reason SE did this in the 1st place is because it requires minimal effort on their part, it obviously isn't old to them because they have hard coded it into everything that was released since it was implemented so I dont think its ever going to go away. That is why I suggested to implement this into weapon skills because I dont think they can be assed to properly balance this game, they just won't. If people want other jobs to be desired besides the 8 jobs people use for everything the only fix we would probably see is another damage wall which to me seems fair given how things are atm for jobs like blm, smn and even rng (it's not really fair for some jobs to get a dmg wall and not all jobs) and we probably won't even see that. If we did see some attempt at balance that would be the route they go I'm sure because its easier for them to just nerf something down to the levels of other jobs than actually fix it at it's core. Just for the record I think dmg walls period are stupid and destroy the mechanics of the game, but when you do something like that nerf everything not just a few jobs or people will never want to use those jobs for anything ever again.

If you would make a WS wall, you wouldnt balance anything, you would drastically promote few jobs that can achieve super high damage with white damage and WSing on 3000TP, like Ukonvasara WAR, Armageddon RNG, Twashtar THF and Veret MNK and Empy DRK. Those builds lose almost no DPS by holding TP to 3000 and most gain dps holding TP above 2000 (Veret loses the most probably not spaming Vsmite during Impetus, but it would still be super high DPS doing RF/Howling/Tornado at 3000TP. AM3 Armageddon during double shot maybe even lose dps WSing at all..). You would only kill melee jobs that DPS is based on spamming WSs. So you would still have BLM far below, but with tons of melee jobs/setups and few above mentioned builds being GOATs.

inb4 you will suggest to nerf white damage then too. I hope you wont, because I might facepalm myself too hard then..

EDIT: Oh also you would completely destroy the mechanic of multistep skillchain, which is like fundamental for this game. Is that you mr Tanaka?

I already suggested nerfing massive crits when I 1st posted my idea a few pages ago,as far as multistep skillchains it would give mages more oppurtunities to mb and make up for the damage they cant do now. Anyways was just an idea, I can't think of any other way. I don't really like it either it just seems like thats what SE does anymore so I tried to think of something they might actually do. I'm fully aware this would make alot of players unhappy, and they wont do it anyways but how else would you propose they do something about it, if they even ever do?

Whats exactly impossible in taking away a nuke wall? You suggested its not old, because you believe they hardcode it in every new content. You dont even know if they hardcode it in every new content. For me its more like its hardcoded for some fundamental base calculation.

1. They should take away nuke wall
2. Give BLM ability that massively boosts MAB for Tier I nukes, so the end result is ability to spam 15-30k Tier I nukes.

I never said it was impossible but I don't think they will. The damage wall seems to be in place for everything I've done since it became a thing and they are constantly adding new things like AOE nerfs even on some weapon skills already in newer content like DI and odyssey so I don't think its going away. I do like your idea for blm it reminds me of the old yorcia skirmish where you kill the dens but blm isn't the only job that is suffering.

You can say that WS wall is already in place tho, but its only for exactly same WS used and I honestly doubt they will change it to whatever WS used.

I think the most fundamental problem with the game design has always been that melee, mage, and pets all require completely different buffs and that buffing became more and more essential as the game got older. Admittedly, even if they all shared buffs/debuffs, BLM would still be far behind in the game's current state, but that has always seemed to me like it was the biggest issue driving the divide between party set-ups. It doesn't really make sense to have divided the buffs so decisively if they had initially designed the game to require coordination between physical and magical damage.