Exenterator

Well, I noticed that STR thokcha is the best option but I'm not so gil oriented atm. Out of those choices which one can I use until I can get aluh or STR?

Toss Lux away. Put Centovente in your satchel. You can pull it out for brewing or Aeolian Edge farming or something.
Asteria - obviously the best choice in Abyssea. Probably the better dps option for outside too although I haven't run the numbers.
Evasion Dagger - maybe for dynamis decent challenge mobs? Not sure if evasion is still capped on them in TP gear or not. The only dmg boost you get out of this is the agi for Exenterator when you're not using a stacked Rudra's so...
I dunno. Play around with those 2 and feel it out.

Asteria for the sparkles

Evasion's pretty decent. Did DCs last night in valkurm, and parsed at 74.06% evasion in TP gear.

Yeah, I just decided to use thokcha for dat AGI until I can get a better dagger. Asteria is pretty fun for sparkles only lol.

Oynos until aluh or str thokcha.

Looking for some suggestions on improvements ranging from easy, attainable items, perhaps AH and such, as well as more high end upgrades, such as Saio.

I'm not a hardcore thf, so I'm not looking to dump a lot of gil or time into gear, but I do like my jobs to be reasonably well equipped. Shooting for a middle ground.

Well, there isn't much higher ground to achieve from where you are. Saio/Justiciar's Torque/Myrmex Mittens/Crudelis Belt are found in top sets, which I assume you've seen. Prosilio Belt is another option for the waist depending on what you have in your other slots and what you're fighting. And there's some minor tweaks for SA/TA+Exent too.

You definitely need weapons. Can't even use the WS without them!
(being facetious for all you super serious people)

Blithe Mantle when Berserk is up?

What would be the best option out of theses for stacked and unstacked. Mainly using in Dynamis.

Raider's Armlets +2
Mustela Gloves
Athos's gloves (on the appropriate days)

Mustela Gloves
No difference really between stacked and unstacked sets. I think there are maybe 2 or 3 items worth swapping if I remember right. You can check back through this thread to see which ones.

^ This, but swap out:
waist Crudelis Belt
Head Skadi's Visor +1
Hands Skadi's Bazubands +1

Agree with the belt, but the head/hands?

Thaumas/Thaumas
Str+14
Dex+16
Agi+30
Atk+0 (7* adjusted for Str)
Acc+9 (17* adjusted for Dex)


Skadi/Skadi
Str+8
Dex+13
Agi+21
Atk+22 (26* adjusted for Str)
Acc+0 (6.5* adjusted for Dex)


Basic summary:
Thaumas/Thaumas
Str+6
Dex+3
Agi+9
Atk-22 (-19* adjusted for Str)
Acc+9 (10.5* adjusted for Dex)

Similar to the difference of Crudelis vs Anguinus. I would put my money on Thaumas/Thaumas.

If I had Skadi +1 hands, i think I would still use myrmex over them unless i was positive the accuracy was doing nothing for me. As for head, Im not sure how you got the +10 attack on skadi +1 visor beating +11str & +6 agi from Thaumas head(+16str & +9agi if you keep thaumas hands).

Edit: Beaten

Ive been wondering about this lately.. I am already 4 merits on Exenterator. Yet outside Aby.. my Evisceration still seems to be the ideal thing to use oddly. Granted Cor/Lux with its Dex, then my gear too is pretty dex heavy, I dont know if thats the cause, but been really starting to think Exen is not worth it other then a debuff ws for me.

Post your gear set for both ws's. I have pretty good sets for both ws's & Evis doesnt get close to what i do with Exen outside.

Well for Evi, I think I am around 40 Dex from gear. Ill try to get the set posted. However does sound like you are gear swapping fully for just a WS? What are your results if you are just in one set?

No reason not to swap gear fully.

Only 2 sets I have for thf anyways, eva/crit and acc/haste I have other jobs I keep on me too, I hate the whole MH swapping ideas lol.

I wonder if they will raise item cap come expansion..

eww.. well dont expect any help for your Weaponskills from here if you aren't willing to swap gear for your weaponskill. Evis profits more from DEX/Crithit, exenterator more from Agi. So if you are equiping a dex/cirt hit based set for a Agi based Weaponskill you for sure wont get good results. Scroll through this thread and others to see different gearsets for the weaponskill and you will see what equip makes them stronger.

In general looking at your profile your gear seem really bad, start with:
> Finish CoP Missions, pick up Rajas ring + Brutal Earring (Every Melee Job uses them) finish Sky, get a Suppanomimi.
> Go to Abyssea and optain Raider's +1/+2 and Ballerines (Abyssea) to have a good start with Thf TP Set.
> Stop useing a Evasion Set like this as a TP setup, make a TP Set with Haste as close to 25%(26) as you can get, and toss in TA, Double Attack, Dex, Str, Att (Acc when needed) where you can. Only equip a evasion heavy Set if you are somehow in danger.. which wont happen to often :x

Stop beeing lazy and use your Moghouse. This is no "Idea", swaping gear, carrying gear for the job you use currently, store stuff for other jobs you dont need for the Job you are playing at the time in your Moghouse is how this game work. You seem to be just lazy. If you dont like to change jobs and equip focus on one job 1st and make it good. Bettern then having 5 bad jobs because you dont want to move equip.

Use your Moghause and switch gear.. atleast for TP and weaponskill. This will enhance your play on any DD job.

Athos's Tabard beats Kudzu when uncapped Acc. Thaumas body (with 5/5 thaumas) beats both for uncapped/capped acc.

Justiciar's Torque beats Houyi's Gorget.

Crudelis belt is better if you don't need the acc from anguinus, but for damage (unless mad attack buffs) Crudelis is only very slightly ahead to the point where you might as well use anguinus just incase you're uncapped acc.

Ditto. Here's my Evis and Exenterator Sets for comparison:

Hct. Subligar has +3 Crit Rate. In abyssea I actually use Heca+1 hands with crit dmg/dagger skill/acc.

Outside, Exenterator stomps all over Evisceration for me. Aluh/Lux.

Don't bother with Ballerines unless you happen to pick them up free-drop whilst working towards something else. Ballerines suck.

The standard "Basic", non-Thaumas/Voidwatch TP set is basically this:
That should be your immediate goal. Epona's might be difficult to get, so in the meantime you you could use Demonry Ring. If you can't afford Nefarious+Rancorous, get Rancor+Atheling, it's only very slightly worse (and occasionally better).

Well I dont mind other gear sets for some of my jobs. Thing is, just for 1 WS I wont. Did some tests last night. Evi gave me 1-2k dmg outside of aby. Exen did 500-1k. Now granted. This Coruscanti may have something do to with the numbers on Evi.. Not sure. Still dont think anyones really figured out the "deals severe damage" part fully yet.

Also I have Suppanomimi. Not to mention my TP and TH7 set, so I guess I shouldve said, yes I seem to have more gear sets on THF then I do my other jobs lol. Haste, I have about 20% which I switch to that gear set. Just dont use it unless I am in alliance or endgame stuff. Normally just soloing around. (Thus the heavy in eva/crit)

How much agi do you have and whats the avg dmg on Exen? Maybe I am just missing out.

You are missing out :)
While it might seem like a big task to gear up fully like this, it enhances your dmg\performance by a huge amount if you do it properly.
Also the extra effect on Coru was figured out a long time ago:
http://wiki.bluegartr.com/bg/Coruscanti

"Severe Damage" caps Attack/Defense Ratio (subject to level correction) ~8% of the time on attacks with Coruscanti"

I use Corus/STR Thokcha & i very rarely see Exen go under 2k as dnc(unstacked). As thf, the gear sets are still the same but THF can stack Exen with SA or TA(more so TA due to the AGI mod on the ws and the ja) for a larger boost in damage. Basically, if you plan on sticking with 1-2 gear sets for a job you shouldnt worry about maximizing its potential. Should just drop Exen & spam Evis inside/outside abys. Although as many have said, with even a half decent set, Exen blows Evis out of the water damage wise & with the additional effect thats always useful.

How many merits do you have in Exenterator? Even just weaponskilling in full AF3+2 (except for feet; put those at Kacura+1 just so that there was literally no +agi in gear aside from Suppa) and other normal TP gear (I even left the neck as Rancor Collar, giving accuracy and crit rate that do literally nothing), it should still do substantially better than that. I would expect averages of around 1350 vs DC mobs, but you seem to be doing near half that.

Edit: Actually, forgot to drop food, too; that'll drop WS damage down to about 1050. And yes, in that same gear set (+51 dex, +2 agi), Evis will do better than Exen, at about 1250. If you made it +2 dex, +51 agi, Evis would be under 1000, and Exen at about 1375.

Also, what mobs were you testing on? And if you're just doing some quick tests to compare things, it's fine to do it in Abyssea; just don't get any crit atmas. Maybe get regen atmas for convenience, and the HP cruor boost (don't get the other stats), and just run through a bunch of mobs for a bit.

Coruscanti will have a small impact on Evisceration from the +crit rate. "Deals severe damage" boosts your attack up to cap; no idea if it works on weaponskills, but it's rare enough that it should show up as very occasional spikes, not a constant significant improvement.

Edit: Anyway, lots of extra variables here; you don't provide enough information to be able to properly judge the results. I may try putting together a minimalist balanced set later.

@Motenten

more on top he said he has 4 merits (at that time)


If you like Evasion so much you could just do an magian evasion dagger and equip more hastegear for your Solo setup.

Also there is some decent gear that has haste together with evasion. like Salvage II Sigyn's jambeaux (Or even still Ballerines) Athos's boots from VW and also ocelot trousers from abyssea. Should definitly change your Elusive earring to Suppa. Those 5Evasion wont make or break it

edit:


i think most Excenterator sets have like 70 AGI not sure. Mine had like 72 AGI. It wasnt best set, but Exenterator was not that often used so i dropped it.

Well, the spreadsheet says that exen 5/5 should do 822 average in Dyna DC with those daggers and totally naked w/o food. With my gear set it goes up to 1705 averages (still w/o food and keeping your daggers), so see the difference yourself of what gear can do.
Not to mention the -20acc additional effect (free extra evasion).

Notice we are talking about averages, not spikes like those 2k evis.

Yeah, 4/5 Exenterator would definitely have an impact, though I still wouldn't expect such a large difference as what he saw.


Putting together a theoretical set. Conditions:

1) No more than 5 gear swaps for a weaponskill (ie: what you can fit into a single normal macro; no Spellcast)
2) Main TP set wants a decent amount of evasion

Target evasion: A naked thf has within around 10-20 evasion (5%-10%) needed to cap evasion rate on DC Dynamis mobs, and is possibly entirely capped. More than about 50 evasion in gear is unlikely to be useful against any NMs you might consider soloing, so avoid excessive evasion beyond that.

Took your gear set from the other thread:


31 Agi/85 evasion [100 total]
40 Dex/13% crit rate/14 acc
14 Str/14 att
0% Haste/2% DA/1% TA


Tried to keep things reasonably accessible. Allowed Sigyn feet since they're pretty easy to get (only take 10 Umbrage plans). Thokcha is Agi. Other things are AH-buyable or simple Abyssea drops or normal quest rewards.



55 Agi/55 evasion [82 total]
48 Dex/5% crit rate/15 acc
14 Str/20 att
26% Haste/13% DA/3% TA


Drops 18 evasion compared to your set, but you'll get that back with Exenterator. Athos body would be an improvement on the Dex/Agi/Evasion front, but surprisingly the Store TP on Loki's may be worth more for total damage. Overall, not worth requiring a piece that may be a pain to get, but it's an option to consider for an improvement on total evasion.

Also considered Vassal back for a bit of extra evasion, but it didn't seem worth it compared to a piece that you'll already have for other jobs. So, for inventory savings, just went with Atheling. Still an option if you want it, though.

Gains 8 dex, but drops 8% explicit crit rate. This is a small loss on my set's side.

Same Str, minor gains in acc and att.

Gains 11% DA, 2% TA, and goes from no haste to fully capped gear haste. This line alone is about a 45% increase in damage output (more if you have outside haste buffs).

Only 3 slots are really open for substantial changes for weaponskills: neck, waist, legs. Just going to put in a bunch of attack gear here: Justiciar neck, Anguinus belt, Tumbler Trunks.

On the DC target, that puts Evis at 1200, Exen 4/5 at 1150, and Exen 5/5 at 1300.

Note that changing from Lux to Agi Thokcha improves the Exenterator DPS, while it worsens the Evisceration DPS. Excluding any SA/TA, Cor+Lux w/Evis is 143 DPS against a DC target, the same as Cor+Thokcha w/Exen. Changing it so that no gear swaps are used at all, they drop to 138 DPS.

Keeping the three WS gear swaps, Cor+Lux w/Exen is 142 DPS (compared to 143 with Thokcha) at the expense of the Thokcha's 28 evasion. If you don't want another dagger, Cor+Lux provides roughly the same performance using either Evis or Exen; Exen just provides you with the extra evasion if you were lacking. So you'd have (relatively) low evasion with Evis, moderate with Exen (or Cor+Thokcha using Evis, if you wanted to drop Exenterator merits, though DPS would go down a bit), or high if you swapped Lux to Thokcha and used Exen. All configs would give fairly similar damage performance.


If I change the Evis set to your gear and Cor+Lux, and use no gear swaps at all, I get a 78 DPS, 55%-58% of my set. Or, considered another way, it would take you almost twice as long to kill the mob, without any significant defensive benefits since you should have effectively the same or better evasion using the Exen/Thokcha build.

My gear set would also do better on SA/TA (again, assuming no gear swaps, though I'd certainly recommend using AF3+2 hands), given that it has higher dex, higher agi, and additional crit damage, though I didn't include SA/TA damage in my calculations above.

My extender set

ItemSet 293397

I see that i should drop the soil for crud belt and justicar's torque

I'm curious as to base upgrades, should i forsake everything for agi followed by attack? I only go thf for ADL and pop set farming so i've never been really worried about shelling out the gil for the top tier items, I have a Crud belt but should i just get more agi earrings/rings? and maybe the qilin necklace? or would the arctier's torque be better? No Athos body but i do have the loki's Kaftan to replace the thaumas if i'm forsaking da/ta.

also Working on the relic dagger, does extender stand a chance in hell against mercy stroke?