What Do Want In Prime Weapons?

I'm more concerned about how they are going to tackle what v25 fights are. I imagine I'm not alone in thinking the v20 concept of an uncontrollable add not meant to be defeated was just lazy on SE's part, a way to add difficulty without really considering the growth of the content beyond that point.

Speaking just for myself of course but PERSONALLY that approach with equipment always leaves a sour taste in my mouth, even if all the stats are good.

I'm left thinkin "meh, that <useless stat for job X> could've been something better!"

Like the Avatar level or Automaton Level on Bunzi or Mpaca feet for instance, but I could go on forever, those equipment really always leave a sour taste in my mouth :-(

its a tough call, and I think most can see the benefits of both sides, it just depends on our personal desires.

Multi-job weapons that get job-specific boosts on them, making them at the same time versatile and specific

OR

True 1 weapon, 1 job arrays where each weapon never has to balance multiple needs and can completely focus on enhancing one job

One benefits the grinder, one benefits the more casual.

Maybe low HP enemy, high defense/utility needed in player gear would be a "good" option.

Now this is an interesting thought. REMA made to be defensive. Dare I say, enhance weaponskills and stats that are defense or less used? (Scratch thy chin)

I second this! I have all REMA/Su5/etc for mine, EXCEPT Redemption because Chloris is no bueno. I can't even pay my friends to help me farm buds lol.

If it werent for the fact gear has been getting more and more defensive already it'd be an option, for example dyna mnk weapon regardless of path is a nice "defensive" h2h in that it boasts the high hp all the weapons do along with a nice 10 DT, but with all the ody sets being what they are, and perhaps emp following suit, theres not much left to build on that i would place a ultimate weapon around, though i would imagine pld/run minimum will get something defensive added on in the form of DTII or something

I really do hope they make it so each weapon is specifically made for enhancing that job. I don't think any job should share a weapon like I think someone mentioned the weapon should be made to improve the class drastically. I also kinda hope they don't have any hidden aftermath that or if they make it have an aftermath set it so you can keep it refreshed without it having to wear off. As these are the last weapons we more than likely gonna see of this level make them worth it.

I share the hope of each prime being tied to a single job. Augmenting existing (and unused) job abilities would be great as I posted above.

I disagree on aftermath tho, I think that dynamic works well for our top weps.

Further, since we are limited devs and they like to spend our money elsewhere, let's boost some already existing ws's that are often ignored....

For thf I've always loved the Shark Bite animation, (especially compared to the sadness I felt upon my first view of Mercy Stroke...oof)...give that ws the REMA treatment. How about raging rush? Blade: Ku or Ten?

Let's boost some select awesome looking ws's, well developed when the game was funded and staffed, along with augmenting useless JAs. This would create the horizontal style of adding items that makes this game what it is and not necessarily replacing (completely) what's been done before.

I'd like to see them go the opposite way with weapons this time. We already have 2-3 attack aftermath, level 4 skillchains, and occasionally double/triple damage. Nothing comes to mind on what they could add to compete with those options unless you just go the naegling route and superpower up a weapon skill.

I would love to see a weapon that augmenented your merit point options. Something like enhanced saber dance and fan dance for dancer for example. Saber dance turns into triple attacks instead of double and fan dance gives a stronger mitigation on damage. Summoner would get powered up 75 pacts out of it to focus on their magic damage. Etc... Just something unique for the jobs without having to make a bunch of different weapons. They could put "augments merits" and slap a renamed relic weapons kill on them and call it a day.

I want them to be available in 2 stages, one basic form where pretty much everyone can achieve by grinding out something repetitive, and an advanced stage that's ungodlily difficult to obtain and requires a total team effort just to get 1 person to complete.

so I guess I could have just said afterglow, which I assume they'll probably do anyway, but like make it mean something. Make people whine that it's too hard and call for nerfs/changes. Make the one guy on the server walking around with it a celebrity.

FTFY lmao

Assuming that these require a similar time and/or gil investment as other REMAs, it'd be disappointing if all they did was provide small improvement to a specific weapon skill or ability, especially ones that aren't normally used. That sounds like Ambuscade, Geas Fete, or early Su# gear and not exactly what comes to mind for "prime" weapons.

I'd be super annoyed if RNG's weapon was just a buff for Unlimited Shot, lol.

What if that buff for unlimited shot made the next WS aoe and lowered recast to 1 minute?

If RNG was going to be cleaving, it'd be hard pressed to beat Aeolian Edge with double max Malevolences, Accipiter, and Hauksbok ammo in a way meaningful enough to justify the time/cost of building the weapon.

Even reducing the recast from 10:00 to 1:00 still wouldn't cut it because RNG gets TP much faster than 60 seconds. At best, it'd be a gear swap for when Unlimited Shot comes off cooldown: build TP, use it, then switch back to your normal setup for the next 55-60 seconds.

Any discussion of Unlimited Shot in any fashion is meaningless until its timer is split from Double Shot, which should have happened when the Su3 gear was released.

If you want to legitimately discuss potential JA enhancement via a Legendary Weapon line and talk Ranger, let's be honest and realize that it would be some enhancement to either Hover Shot or Decoy Shot- some improvement to stances rather than one-off abilities.

And lastly, the Bonanza Weapon essentially does for Unlimited Shot what Yagrush did for Divine Seal, so I seriously doubt they'd just repeat themselves (and repeating a bad idea, at that).

JA enhancement weaponry can work, but you gotta get a little lucky in what JAs they pick to focus on. Yagrush, as stated, is job-changing on a level that can't be matched in terms of altering a job ability. Murgleis, by comparison, is now just a cheap party trick in terms of its JA altering (not its overall value, speaking on the way it changes a job ability strictly).

*ok, probably more accurate to say an expensive party trick lol...

I made a Murgleis when Dyna D was starting and it did an amazing job of making sleeps and accession break land very consistently.

My Crocea absolutely dunks on it. BUT I still use it as a macro piece to convert without any fear of consequences. If there is lasting benefit to the job then I don't see the problem.

But yeah not letting JA enhancements having a viable shelf life is honestly pretty mean. Like SCH or NIN mythics, that's just mean. Or like BLU su5, lololol here are those recast reductions you've always asked for. Cruel and unusual.

I've always wanted more offensive debilitating songs for brd:
Massacre Elegy
A high pitched screech that would stun
A 'brown note' for brd TH

Poor Tupsimati it deserved better.

Eh, changing a job ability in the right way could make it as playstyle-changing as Yagrush was. For example, imagine if an Aggressor enhancement made it give you 15% haste, or if a Scarlet Delirium enhancement made it so you couldn't fall below 1 HP one time.

That's staves in general, only nirvana really made it out okay from start to finish

Slightly on-topic question: are there any examples of items in the game that outright grant Job Abilities (not traits) to the player? I know there are "Enchantment" items like "Provoke", and items/armor with Spells you can use when it is equipped. I was envisioning a stat on Prime Weapons where they gave new JAs only when worn, but not sure if there is a technical limitation with that, because I can't seem to think of any off the top of my head. Kind of like how giving automatons specific attachments grants them JAs.

Not the same, but WS are gated behind weapons and spells behind gear.

Pet commands all change depending on avatar/familiar on the same job.

So long as they have the ability to add more job abilities to the game, they can enable/disable them based on equipment too. I assume they can add but I certainly don't know if they actually do.

You can literally only use Uriel Blade while wielding Griffinclaw and having the campaign buff (FOR NOW DAMNIT! GIVE ME THIS SE!). That's 2 different conditionals that have to be met in order to be able to select a WS.


Off topic: 20th anniversary and no new fireworks!?

Depending on how JAs are programmed, it's possible that conditional JAs could have issues that conditional spells or WSs don't. For example, it's conceivable that JA recasts might not be able to be tracked while the gear isn't on (meaning simply taking off the item and putting it back on would likely put recast to 0), for example. We already know their recasts are handled differently since changing jobs resets JA recast but not spell recast.

Only similar mechanics I can think of offhand are like you said- ones that enhance a job ability, of which there are many among the Su5 and Mythics in particular. Not to mention of course gear that may increase the duration, potency, or range of some JAs. As for an otherwise unavailable JA (either to that specific job, or to players in the game, period), I can't come up with any either.

It's not the exact same situation, but gear like Daybreak does add a spell with a recast on it and the recast on is preserved if you unequip and re-equip it. As such, it should be feasible for job abilities.

I have no idea how much difference there is between a spell and ability in terms of the code that tracks it, but the level of effort should be similar unless it was intentionally coded to be different. With gear that adds weapon skills (a subset of abilities, at least in the menu) and gear that adds spells with recasts, there should be enough information in the code to cut-and-paste it together.

Edit: Has anyone used the blurred ranged weapons? The additional effect listed is a job trait, not a buff, so I'm curious how that's rendered in game. Is it just an invisible decrease in aiming delay or does it show up as a status icon?

They do seem to be coded different. For example, JAs are reset if you swap jobs, while spell recasts are preserved.

I'd forgotten about it, but there is the Reviler's Helm with enchantment "Provoke" on it.

Obviously, they wouldn't be able to put an enchantment on the prime weapons if they plan for them to be augmented as well, but it would be possible to do something like the waist items for ranged weapons.

Snapshot is not a trait, it is like Fast Cast for ranged attacks in both where its processed (in the precast portion of an action) as well as its effects. Rangers and Corsairs do not possess it naturally (a trait). Velocity Shot is a job ability which also effects ranged delay, but is a unique part of the equation and does not effect the caps on Snapshot. And lastly, Rapid Shot is also not a trait/ability, but functions like Quickmagic (closes approximation I can give to non shooters).

While I have not used either of those Blurred options, its very safe to say that it would proc like the "haste" on other blurred weapons- that on certain hits you gain a Flurry Icon and a small amount of +Snapshot results, or if you are already receiving Flurry it doesn't matter. My guess is that these give Snapshot+15 like Flurry1, the same way the other Blurred+1 weapons give a Haste1 of 15%.