13 is pretty close to 12 so kinda hard to say that's 100% accurate. Must be something else going on like only counting VE maybe to tell who is 2nd, WHM sure seems to pull hate easy if taking a lot of DMG if DD's have Dirge.
Edit: How close did you get to killing Ongo with PLD Tank?
Assuming had a RUN too?
Odyssey R25 Confirmed ATM Now Maybe 30?...
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Odyssey R25 Confirmed ATM Now Maybe 30?...
Bahamut.Lexouritis said: » Mischief: "Ongo's Tulfaire hate is 100% NOT second person on hate list." Pikohan: "My first Libra shows PLD 98%, me 13%, Mischief 12%. Add hit me right before my first Libra. He did multiple libra and the add would go after people who were not 2nd in line with enmity. (took a PLD with the plan of controlling Ongo's Tulfaire and the thing was all over the place) We had a d/c, it may have affected ***? Anyways direct quotes above lol /shrug Now that you speak of ongo, we planned on having blm manawall tank the add while we kept dmging ongo. The *** decided to go after the corsair when on previous blm burn fights add always went after blm. Also gonna need a real person on sch and brd now. It aint easy tanking and handling sch and brd duties >_> Mrxi said: » 13 is pretty close to 12 so kinda hard to say that's 100% accurate. Must be something else going on like only counting VE maybe to tell who is 2nd, WHM sure seems to pull hate easy if taking a lot of DMG if DD's have Dirge. Edit: How close did you get to killing Ongo with PLD Tank? Assuming had a RUN too? We had RUN & PLD. First run we did, there was no erratic behavior. But around 50% ish, the BLM d/c. Then the PLD died to fetters, so tulfaire went to the SCH, as expected. When the BLM came back, things returned to normal but we had already lost time with the d/c and running around with an add. Second run was the bad one. Ongo was on the RUN. Ongo popped Sforzo, so SCH immediately sat down to interrupt his nuke. Tulfaire popped and immediately went for SCH (Piko) as he healed. Then it turned and hit the BLM (Misc). Piko hit Libra. What's not in the quote Lex typed is that the RUN was at 100%. BLM ran in to enmity douse Ongo and the Tulfaire still followed him out. It wasn't until the PLD hit Invincible that Ongo then turned to the PLD and the Tulfaire to the RUN. It stayed for a few minutes until it started doing its thing again. From all of Piko's Libras, RUN and PLD were highest, so not sure what happened.
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Bahamut.Shozokui said: » Mrgrim said: » we planned on having blm manawall tank the add So the plan was to just manawall tank it and have the blm run in with the COR when going in for Random Deal / Wildcard to get get rayke/Gambit back to get Manawall back also. But then it went for the COR so we just had the RDM do it's thing on the add. Another weird note to add is that on the Chapuli I was the target of the add when it spawned (I was more than likely 2nd on enmity). we just bound it and ignored it but at 1 point I died. The interesting part was that after I got up which should of wiped all my enmity. The chapuli add was still on me. It would turn on the spot (bounded) to face me. Even though I shouldn't of had any enmity after dying. Shiva.Mewtwo said: » It would turn on the spot (bounded) to face me. Even though I shouldn't of had any enmity after dying. Im not 100% sure, but I think bound enemy will turn to whoever is closest. Same as (this Im 100% sure) it will hit whoever is in range, when the target with highest enmity is out of range. Bahamut.Xiutaru said: » What's not in the quote Lex typed is that the RUN was at 100%. If RUN was at 100% and PLD at 98%, then PLD was trying too hard :) Maybe they were both at enmity cap with even enmity and then add would run to 3rd person on list treating both PLD and RUN as 1st (with same enmity score). Or maybe it's something connected with what Shozouki wrote Bahamut.Shozokui said: » Whenever you gain hate on the boss, your cumulative enmity on the add is set to 0. I would just keep PLD around 70% of RUN, so it won't ever pull hate on Ongo. Just keep PLD enmity well above 3rd person, but also well below tank. did a few atonement 2/1 without RDM and just with BLM using crowd control, break completely resists, bind lands, but it becomes a circus pretty quickly, bind would last 15-45 seconds. When you are trying to hit MBs consistently and bind + move the party around, it becomes a task, We won all our attempts but on A3 Ongo when every MB counts to get it down, its gonna be tough to crowd control the add on BLM, IMO
I'm sure we'll try tho :) SimonSes said: » Shiva.Mewtwo said: » It would turn on the spot (bounded) to face me. Even though I shouldn't of had any enmity after dying. Im not 100% sure, but I think bound enemy will turn to whoever is closest. Same as (this Im 100% sure) it will hit whoever is in range, when the target with highest enmity is out of range. Had to recheck the recording I took. What made me realize this was when he became unbound he started to come after me again. I was just stood behind the whm to the left awaiting to be unweakened yet he ignored the tank/BRD that were closer to it. Also ignored the WHM that was also closer to it. I moved out it's way but this was still weird. Short video going over the last few pages of what people had discovered as well as what I discovered on my first Solo V20 run. That add bounced all over the place!!! Anyway thought this may be helpful for some who don't want to read the last 6 pages.
YouTube Video Placeholder
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SimonSes said: » If RUN was at 100% and PLD at 98%, then PLD was trying too hard :) Maybe they were both at enmity cap with even enmity and then add would run to 3rd person on list treating both PLD and RUN as 1st (with same enmity score). Or maybe it's something connected with what Shozouki wrote Bahamut.Shozokui said: » Whenever you gain hate on the boss, your cumulative enmity on the add is set to 0. I'll also add that as BRD, I was getting hit as well, moreso than the COR. My direct actions on Ongo were maybe two threnody casts. All other actions were party buffs. It was on the tanks at some point, then I used Pianissimo and it came to poke. Have we tested if the hate works like Dazzling Dolores? Where chance of pulling hate is functional of how far you are, or something like that?
Bahamut.Xiutaru said: » I'll also add that as BRD, I was getting hit as well, moreso than the COR. My direct actions on Ongo were maybe two threnody casts. All other actions were party buffs. It was on the tanks at some point, then I used Pianissimo and it came to poke. It looks like there is some hate reset going on. Maybe add hits lower enmity toward Ongo or something. I guess we need more data. Anyone have any experience on Ongo with RDM? Possible to get frazzle on (w/o Stymie)?
Asura.Toralin said: » Anyone have any experience on Ongo with RDM? Possible to get frazzle on (w/o Stymie)? No experience here, but if you make Rayke with 3xTenebrae and make darkness skillchain, then you should be fine. Can try to use this Rayke window to spam Leaden too I guess. SimonSes said: » Asura.Toralin said: » Anyone have any experience on Ongo with RDM? Possible to get frazzle on (w/o Stymie)? No experience here, but if you make Rayke with 3xTenebrae and make darkness skillchain, then you should be fine. Can try to use this Rayke window to spam Leaden too I guess. This is just a terrible idea. Edit: The Tenebrae rayke idea not the replacing (probably geo) with rdm idea. Rayke windows are the vast majority of your damage, there's other ways to get the macc you need. You probably would want one or two MND etudes and a Dark threnody from your Bard, if you're bringing one. Otherwise, I'm not sure you could land it so easily
Honest question here, frazzle is black magic, so is it INT or MND that affects its macc? I know MND affects the potency but I believe INT affects its macc.
Edit: Also burst it on a grav sc to improve your chances of landing it. Guyford said: » Edit: The Tenebrae rayke idea not the replacing (probably geo) with rdm idea. Rayke windows are the vast majority of your damage, there's other ways to get the macc you need. I'm not gonna say I'm 100% right, because I don't know that for sure, but afaik darkness SDT on Ongo is so low, that if you won't use Rayke and Darkness/Gravitation SC to reduce it to 60%, you are guaranteed to get at least 50% resist on it. I'm not sure what 50% resist on Frazzle will do tho. Cut duration by 50%? It will be also super hard to land it at all. You will probably just need to spam it with 5% floored chance to land it and it costs 90MP, so not exactly spam friendly spell, but I guess with Refresh III and 2x SV ballads it shouldn't generally be a problem. SimonSes said: » Guyford said: » Edit: The Tenebrae rayke idea not the replacing (probably geo) with rdm idea. Rayke windows are the vast majority of your damage, there's other ways to get the macc you need. I'm not gonna say I'm 100% right, because I don't know that for sure, but afaik darkness SDT on Ongo is so low, that if you won't use Rayke and Darkness/Gravitation SC to reduce it to 60%, you are guaranteed to get at least 50% resist on it. I'm not sure what 50% resist on Frazzle will do tho. Cut duration by 50%? It will be also super hard to land it at all. You will probably just need to spam it with 5% floored chance to land it and it costs 90MP, so not exactly spam friendly spell, but I guess with Refresh III and 2x SV ballads it shouldn't generally be a problem.
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Guyford said: » Honest question here, frazzle is black magic, so is it INT or MND that affects its macc? I know MND affects the potency but I believe INT affects its macc. Edit: Also burst it on a grav sc to improve your chances of landing it. You're probably right. I assumed mnd because of the modifier. You'd likely already have sage/logical etude anyways due to the black mage First T3 down, Kalunga basic *** too unfortunately.
Did SAM, COR, BRD, RDM, WHM, RUN Songs were - HM, 3x Minuet, Dirge, everything else was standard. First attempt we did got him to 1% but had some "teething issues" trying out, second attempt was a 5 minute clear remaining wit the RUN dying to a 3k tp move. We ran the Add 40 away from Kalunga so that the RDM can keep an eye on the boss and players and when the add awoke. We had 3 sets of fetters on the first attempt 2 on the second. RDM did - Standard Sleep/Bind for first sleep, Chainspell Sleep2 for second sleep, Stymie sleep 2 for third sleep. This seemed to work well, after a point of sleeps resisting we just went with the add asleep near us rather than kiting away. Know this one has been said but just giving more information to help those about to do Kalunga. On Tier 2 NM's also today I tested Shadowstitch as a BRD DPS, it landed after the mob had been bound a few times, haven't tried it on a T3 yet since I was the SAM, but will be giving it a go for the "oh ***moments" where I'm brd. Bahamut.Shozokui said: » With PLD and RUN at 100% and 98%, my assumption is that even if Ongo didn't physically turn, a tick calculation had them swapped at one point and reset the PLD's cumulative add enmity to 0. SE, and computers in general, are bad at rounding, so who knows. Once those two are zero'd, the add would bounce between the backline because they're all within 1% enmity of each other. Bahamut.Xiutaru said: » We had RUN & PLD. First run we did, there was no erratic behavior. But around 50% ish, the BLM d/c. Then the PLD died to fetters, so tulfaire went to the SCH, as expected. When the BLM came back, things returned to normal but we had already lost time with the d/c and running around with an add. Second run was the bad one. Ongo was on the RUN. Ongo popped Sforzo, so SCH immediately sat down to interrupt his nuke. Tulfaire popped and immediately went for SCH (Piko) as he healed. Then it turned and hit the BLM (Misc). Piko hit Libra. What's not in the quote Lex typed is that the RUN was at 100%. BLM ran in to enmity douse Ongo and the Tulfaire still followed him out. It wasn't until the PLD hit Invincible that Ongo then turned to the PLD and the Tulfaire to the RUN. It stayed for a few minutes until it started doing its thing again. From all of Piko's Libras, RUN and PLD were highest, so not sure what happened. I watched this happen in real time, soon as Piko rested I started laughing and first thing i said was "*** these mechanics"
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YouTube Video Placeholder Kalunga V20 Vid. Hopefully this will help some groups out. Idk if we're going to do any T3s today, the plan is to catch up a good portion of the LS through T2. Probably will be Ongo and Lion when we do try though.
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Does anybody think that SE made a mistake with the hate mechanics?
Because if there are two adds for V25, it will be brutally hard to control and/or survive. V25 probably wont happen before ML60 or even 80 and probably whole anniversary event and most likely Empy+3. Beside obvious powercreep, empy can have augments to JA that will turn what we can do upside down etc. I wouldn't be worried about V25 for now.
For the sake of farming, has anyone checked if v19 is no adds?
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