Confectioner's/Patissiere's Ring Effects

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Confectioner's/Patissiere's Ring Effects
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By Homsar 2021-11-11 16:50:10
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Any easy way to tell if the rings only work while equipped vs when the food is consumed or are we going to have to wait for testing?
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By Valefor.Prothescar 2021-11-11 19:31:44
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There is no easy way. You'll have to wait for someone to craft bot the necessary number of samples to know for sure 'cause I doubt anyone is gonna sit there and do it manually.
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By Seun 2021-11-11 20:56:05
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What is the downside to just leaving them on during crafting?
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By Valefor.Prothescar 2021-11-11 21:14:48
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cause if you can unequip the ring, you can use craftsmans and orvails, too.
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By Siren.Dekoda 2021-11-11 21:16:31
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You wouldn’t be able to wear a different ring instead, like craftmaster/craftkeeper/artificer or orvail.

If I had to guess, I would assume it needs to stay on based on rice ball equipment. Is there any other equipment that enhances food effects for comparison?
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By Seun 2021-11-11 21:30:03
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Valefor.Prothescar said: »
cause if you can unequip the ring, you can use craftsmans and orvails, too.

Ok, thank you. I wasn't sure the Adoulin ring and craftmaster's stacked. I craft mostly to keep myself fed, but it's good to know.


Siren.Dekoda said: »
Is there any other equipment that enhances food effects for comparison?

Thanks as well, yes there is gear that enhances rice balls for SAM, but it's 'enhances effect' rather than 'effect +1' so probably requires what Prothescar suggests
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By Homsar 2021-11-12 01:46:09
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Siren.Dekoda said: »
I would assume it needs to stay on based on rice ball equipment

This was my guess as well, which sadly dramatically reduces their usefulness.
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By Valefor.Worlace 2021-11-12 16:20:11
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Did some crafting with Confectioner's Ring equipped.

On 72 crafts on a supposedly T2 HQ synth - using Rusk, Craftmaster's Ring, and Ionis - I HQ'd 30 times or a 42% HQ rate. That should be a 29% rate without it? Could be random luck and 72 is not a big enough sample size, but figured I'd share what appears to be some kind of benefit. Will be keeping track for awhile and report back after I hit 1000 of these synths.
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By Valefor.Worlace 2021-11-22 11:59:12
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Valefor.Worlace said: »
Did some crafting with Confectioner's Ring equipped.

On 72 crafts on a supposedly T2 HQ synth - using Rusk, Craftmaster's Ring, and Ionis - I HQ'd 30 times or a 42% HQ rate. That should be a 29% rate without it? Could be random luck and 72 is not a big enough sample size, but figured I'd share what appears to be some kind of benefit. Will be keeping track for awhile and report back after I hit 1000 of these synths.

After doing more than 500 synths of supposed T2 HQ, the HQ rate remains close to the initial run, at 40% now. I'm keeping track through 1k synths to see if there is any meaningful shift in the percentage. Perhaps other crafters can chime in.
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By Lakshmi.Avereith 2021-11-22 13:11:28
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Inb4 the rusk + effect is actually making everything one hq tier higher

And inb4 the macaron + effect makes it impossible to break synths
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By waffle 2021-11-22 13:21:35
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Homsar said: »
Any easy way to tell if the rings only work while equipped vs when the food is consumed or are we going to have to wait for testing?

For what it's worth, at the very least this one question was answered in the delayed freshly picked. Just like "enhances rice balls", these two effects are only active while the gear is equipped. So you don't have to wear it while eating the food, but you do while crafting.
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By Lakshmi.Avereith 2021-11-27 20:46:09
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585 shivite (T2) synth attempts with ring on and rusk up resulted in around a 27.6% hq rate with all the other +skill and +hq crap on as well

Skip the confectioner's ring I guess unless you really just want to finally ditch your orvail ring for another adoulin ring
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By Lakshmi.Elidyr 2021-11-27 23:22:10
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I don't know if I ever posted publicly, but if anyone want's to test for me. Wrote this a long while back but it got side tracked with some issues and information needing to be corrected on Windower side.

It is an addon that will track your craft results based on multiple things like weather, day, etc. I have not used it in a while.
The information should be correct, but if anyone wants to test and let me know be willing to update if it could be useful.
Forgot the Link to the Add-on!

If this isn't helpful then please ignore me. :)
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By Ragnarok.Blindphleb 2021-11-28 13:39:48
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Lakshmi.Avereith said: »
585 shivite (T2) synth attempts with ring on and rusk up resulted in around a 27.6% hq rate with all the other +skill and +hq crap on as well

Skip the confectioner's ring I guess unless you really just want to finally ditch your orvail ring for another adoulin ring

Valefor.Worlace said: »
Valefor.Worlace said: »
Did some crafting with Confectioner's Ring equipped.

On 72 crafts on a supposedly T2 HQ synth - using Rusk, Craftmaster's Ring, and Ionis - I HQ'd 30 times or a 42% HQ rate. That should be a 29% rate without it? Could be random luck and 72 is not a big enough sample size, but figured I'd share what appears to be some kind of benefit. Will be keeping track for awhile and report back after I hit 1000 of these synths.

After doing more than 500 synths of supposed T2 HQ, the HQ rate remains close to the initial run, at 40% now. I'm keeping track through 1k synths to see if there is any meaningful shift in the percentage. Perhaps other crafters can chime in.

That's a pretty wide difference in these two tests. What's going on here?
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 Lakshmi.Avereith
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By Lakshmi.Avereith 2021-11-28 15:21:46
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What was his recipe? Maybe it wasn't t2

(or maybe they have 10 confectioner's rings on the AH)
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By Chimerawizard 2021-11-28 16:10:25
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1: small sample size.
2: lack of concrete numbers.

Gotta know synth, skill level, mat loss-, HQ+?, relevant buffs, active effect, HQ3 HQ2 HQ1 NQ Break & Mat.Loss data.

Need at minimum a 1k synth sample size.
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By Lakshmi.Avereith 2021-11-28 16:22:50
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Shivite - level 81 synth

Skill - 124 (body/head/neck/mog/shield/support)

Hq+ - Rusk / rusk ring, orvail +1, shield

Shield - yes, and enchantment used

Ionis - yes

So yeah, no miraculous increase. It probably just makes it +1 food for 1 extra hq+ and 1 less success rate-
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By Lakshmi.Elidyr 2021-11-28 16:36:14
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If you go back to craft exploit thing. I think we posted some number in there to show how much HQ+% (from rusk) is equal too.
I may have to look to see what it was. Was on at least a sample of almost 10k Synths.

Didn't realize I think it is on BGwiki now.
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By Valefor.Worlace 2021-11-28 18:49:23
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Ragnarok.Blindphleb said: »
Lakshmi.Avereith said: »
585 shivite (T2) synth attempts with ring on and rusk up resulted in around a 27.6% hq rate with all the other +skill and +hq crap on as well

Skip the confectioner's ring I guess unless you really just want to finally ditch your orvail ring for another adoulin ring

Valefor.Worlace said: »
Valefor.Worlace said: »
Did some crafting with Confectioner's Ring equipped.

On 72 crafts on a supposedly T2 HQ synth - using Rusk, Craftmaster's Ring, and Ionis - I HQ'd 30 times or a 42% HQ rate. That should be a 29% rate without it? Could be random luck and 72 is not a big enough sample size, but figured I'd share what appears to be some kind of benefit. Will be keeping track for awhile and report back after I hit 1000 of these synths.

After doing more than 500 synths of supposed T2 HQ, the HQ rate remains close to the initial run, at 40% now. I'm keeping track through 1k synths to see if there is any meaningful shift in the percentage. Perhaps other crafters can chime in.

That's a pretty wide difference in these two tests. What's going on here?

I agree, mine never made sense to me. I must have got a really lucky streak. I was doing tropical crepe and sublime sushi synths. Ionis, HQ ring, and rusk as stated, at 122 craft level.

Also having done marine stewpot synths I don’t think it is raising an HQ level, because I went 0/108 on HQ so far. Will start using that addon though, much easier than my excel spreadsheet.
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By Sylph.Excalin 2021-11-28 20:19:04
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Keep coming back to see if anyone unlocked the secret...I kind of want to guess +1 rusk effect is "Rate of synthesis material loss -2% High-quality success rate +1" since that is the difference between each rank of rusk...*shrugs*
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By Asura.Poweraid 2021-11-28 21:29:10
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For what ever this is worth, here's some data with and without the ring.
Would love to know some other crafters' thoughts on the data set.
Synth: https://www.bg-wiki.com/ffxi/Sublime_Sushi *(Recipe #2)
Cooking Skill: 124
Status Effects: Ionis, Coconut Rusk, and Artisanal Knowledge

Data: https://imgur.com/a/KrpPWgN

Edit for clarification:
All synths were done with the status effects listed as above. The "no confection ring" is with a https://www.ffxiah.com/item/28586/craftmasters-ring in Ring1 and the https://www.ffxiah.com/item/27591/orvail-ring in Ring2.
The only change between the two data sets was swapping the Ring1 full time from craftmasters to confectioner.
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By Valefor.Worlace 2021-12-01 06:56:56
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Lakshmi.Elidyr said: »
I don't know if I ever posted publicly, but if anyone want's to test for me. Wrote this a long while back but it got side tracked with some issues and information needing to be corrected on Windower side.

It is an addon that will track your craft results based on multiple things like weather, day, etc. I have not used it in a while.
The information should be correct, but if anyone wants to test and let me know be willing to update if it could be useful.
Forgot the Link to the Add-on!

If this isn't helpful then please ignore me. :)

I tested this with some recent craft runs and the << to the side does not track historical synths. Also, it is too sensitive to the changing weather. Meaning, that if it goes from "Firesday (Cloudy)" to "Firesdays (Sunshine" it's a whole new batch of synths.
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By Siren.Dekoda 2021-12-01 09:20:41
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Lakshmi.Elidyr said: »
If you go back to craft exploit thing. I think we posted some number in there to show how much HQ+% (from rusk) is equal too.
I may have to look to see what it was. Was on at least a sample of almost 10k Synths.

Didn't realize I think it is on BGwiki now.

Link to this?

I've been curious about how HQ+ works and can't find any data on it and was going to test it myself. Thought maybe this was a good place to ask about this.

The page for crafting food on BGwiki says it is multiplicative. It may be outdated but according to update notes for September 2017:

Matsui said:
The forumula for the attribute "Increases the rate of high-quality item synthesis success"

We have changed the formula used to calculate the attribute which increases the success rate of high-quality item synthesis. With this adjustment, the overall success rate to synthesize a high quality item has been increased. You may have noticed that we had in-game food items called Rusk which didn't display any food effects. The reason why it didn’t display the effects for these items was because we first wanted to make this adjustment.

https://forum.square-enix.com/ffxi/threads/53191-Freshly-Picked-Vana-diel-35-Digest

I don't see any confirmation of what they did anywhere, only speculation. Do we know if this made all HQ+ additive? Ie: HQ rate of 25% with HQ+5 in food/gear becomes 30% instead of 26.25%?
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By Lakshmi.Elidyr 2021-12-01 15:07:17
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Valefor.Worlace said: »
I tested this with some recent craft runs and the << to the side does not track historical synths. Also, it is too sensitive to the changing weather. Meaning, that if it goes from "Firesday (Cloudy)" to "Firesdays (Sunshine" it's a whole new batch of synths.
Yeah. I need to add some kind of filters to combine it. I made it for someone specifically and asked if I could add it in, then immediately felt the same way about it.

About it being a new batch of synths, yeah wouldn't that be the entire point of separating the data though. It would only track based on specific parameters. This would allow you to compare results from Fireday with days of different weather effects. If you just cram them all together you wouldn't be able to compare no? If you wanted to compare based on certain things you would still have to manually gather from results of that item.

I'll see about adjusting, it definitely needs filters. I did add food and shield buff tracking to separate results yesterday though. Ill see about tweaking and updating. Any other info will be appreciated. ^^

Quote:
Link to this?

I've been curious about how HQ+ works and can't find any data on it and was going to test it myself. Thought maybe this was a good place to ask about this.

The page for crafting food on BGwiki says it is multiplicative. It may be outdated but according to update notes for September 2017:
I actually did and the person I had the conversation with, I no longer have the chat history. If I find any mentions where I sent to someone I will let you know.
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By Lakshmi.Byrth 2021-12-01 21:17:25
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Not useful now, but before the Rusk change I did a ton of testing showing basically no measurable effect of using a Rusk. I'm pretty sure they were broken for a few years.

back in my day
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By Phoenix.Dabackpack 2021-12-07 19:01:31
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Asura.Poweraid said: »
For what ever this is worth, here's some data with and without the ring.
Would love to know some other crafters' thoughts on the data set.
Synth: https://www.bg-wiki.com/ffxi/Sublime_Sushi *(Recipe #2)
Cooking Skill: 124
Status Effects: Ionis, Coconut Rusk, and Artisanal Knowledge

Data: https://imgur.com/a/KrpPWgN

For the control group, did you replace the Confectioner's Ring with anything else? Or was it simply an empty ring slot?

The evidence I've seen suggests that this ring just adds a bonus tier of the food effect you have, i.e.:

https://www.bg-wiki.com/ffxi/Category:Crafting_Food

So a "tier 3" rusk (Coconut) + Confectioner's Ring would result in you having eaten a "tier 4" rusk (which doesn't exist as an item), and thus a cumulative material loss-8% and HQ rate+5.
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By Asura.Chiaia 2021-12-08 03:34:56
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Lakshmi.Byrth said: »
Not useful now, but before the Rusk change I did a ton of testing showing basically no measurable effect of using a Rusk. I'm pretty sure they were broken for a few years.

back in my day
I don't think they were broken I just think they are multiplicative of whatever tier you're hitting. Additive always seem like it be way to broken.

Assuming a 25% rate at T2 and +4 total HQ(Rusk + Craftmaster's Ring)

So we'd see a 26% HQ rate at T2 (25% * 1.04)...
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By Asura.Poweraid 2021-12-15 11:48:51
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I edited my original post for clarification on the response. Hard to equate it to luck being the dataset is almost 1,000 on one and 1,400 on the other, but I was getting a pretty solid 5% increase in HQ rate. Unfortunately due to the massive amount of effort, I didn't keep track of item consumption vs loss in the breaks/successful synths. So yes, only break/HQ numbers and nothing related to item loss.
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By Asura.Apebasher 2021-12-23 13:51:13
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Who knows?
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By Valefor.Worlace 2021-12-23 15:47:40
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Asura.Poweraid said: »
I edited my original post for clarification on the response. Hard to equate it to luck being the dataset is almost 1,000 on one and 1,400 on the other, but I was getting a pretty solid 5% increase in HQ rate. Unfortunately due to the massive amount of effort, I didn't keep track of item consumption vs loss in the breaks/successful synths. So yes, only break/HQ numbers and nothing related to item loss.

I'd agree with this takeaway. My first 500 round of synths must have had a really lucky run to get a 40% number. But it's certainly higher than 27%. Thanks to the craftstats lua I'm seeing the results across multiple moon phases to see if that makes a difference vs just keeping track in a spreadsheet.
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