Irrational fears of public toilets?!
Cue the Pen & Teller: *** theme song!
Damn I miss that show.
FL Bill Would Imprison TSs For Using Bathrooms
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FL Bill Would Imprison TSs for Using Bathrooms
Jetackuu said: » Odin.Jassik said: » Jetackuu said: » Odin.Jassik said: » Jetackuu said: » Aside from the spin placed on it by certain posters and the opinion article, it looks like the purpose of the bill is to punish those who are in the wrong restroom, regardless of them being "trans" or not. It's not discriminating, if it were written as such to where it only targeted transsexuals, then you'd have a point, but it isn't. However as I've said many times: they should just improve privacy in restrooms and stop segregating them based on sex and or gender entirely. It's specifically discriminatory toward trans because they're basing gender solely on genitals and their caricature perception of men in drag. I don't see anyone basing gender at all. Well unless you mean people in this thread, because then who cares? The wording of the bill is such. They use "biological" gender. Someone also brought up the people who carry xxy chromosomes. The law is specifically discriminatory to anyone who doesn't fall squarely within the gender norms of male and female exclusively. You know as well as anyone that laws have no hope of passing with the Herman Cain approach, but don't think that because the law doesn't have a bunch of redneck words that it isn't driven by exactly the same line of narrow thought. But it isn't, and again we aren't talking about gender, but about sex. Sex in the sense of physical gender or the act? If you're trying to separate physical gender from gender identity, don't bother, I have no interest in having a conversation over the semantics of gender identity as it applies to gender paradigms. Jetackuu said: » Shiva.Onorgul said: » If I cook the numbers and present a theory that, say, black men predominantly attracted to white women are displaying signs of mental illness, does that mean I can outlaw inter-racial marriage again? This is very important to me because it in no way affects my life. We're talking about pissing in a hole. Explain to me why it matters what set of genitals you do it from in a certain room. I'm not concerned with arguing why someone is transgendered, that's well outside the scope of this law. Again, we are discussing a law that brings criminal charges against people. We are talking about something that encroaches on someone's freedom. Explain to me why it is necessary and right. Comparing unlike things, in your scenario it would be discriminating against people for no good reason. What you're proposing is that we give a group of people special treatment, when there's no evidence that they deserve any. These are unlike things, despite what you believe. Valefor.Sehachan said: » Blazed1979 said: » my bedroom. or in the car.. actually anywhere, public toilet included. I'd rather do it in the middle of the restaurant/dancefloor/whatever than in those god forsaken places! and a public bathroom, here still don't wanna make some babies, seha?
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Odin.Jassik said: » Sex in the sense of physical gender or the act? If you're trying to separate physical gender from gender identity, don't bother, I have no interest in having a conversation over the semantics of gender identity as it applies to gender paradigms. Know what kind of law I'd make for public toilets?
When they open in the morning they're pristine clean, then every person who goes in has to use aptly equipped cleaning products and use them to disinfect the environment completely before leaving. Some poor guy with no better job will sit there making sure people do the cleaning after they're done. Will this make lines longer? Yes. But don't care. Shiva.Onorgul said: » Explain further. Don't quip at me, explain why this needs to be enshrined in law and, moreover, how we forgot to do so over the past 250 years. I personally don't think it needs to be in law, as I've stated already, I find the concept of segregated bathrooms by sex ridiculous, and from what you've stated earlier we agree on that point. We haven't forgotten to put it into law over the past 250 years, as I've also stated earlier. Blazed1979 said: » Valefor.Sehachan said: » Blazed1979 said: » my bedroom. or in the car.. actually anywhere, public toilet included. I'd rather do it in the middle of the restaurant/dancefloor/whatever than in those god forsaken places! and a public bathroom, here still don't wanna make some babies, seha? Jetackuu said: » Shiva.Onorgul said: » Explain further. Don't quip at me, explain why this needs to be enshrined in law and, moreover, how we forgot to do so over the past 250 years. I personally don't think it needs to be in law, as I've stated already, I find the concept of segregated bathrooms by sex ridiculous, and from what you've stated earlier we agree on that point. We haven't forgotten to put it into law over the past 250 years, as I've also stated earlier. Valefor.Sehachan said: » Know what kind of law I'd make for public toilets? When they open in the morning they're pristine clean, then every person who goes in has to use aptly equipped cleaning products and use them to disinfect the environment completely before leaving. Some poor guy with no better job will sit there making sure people do the cleaning after they're done. Will this make lines longer? Yes. But don't care. I'm going to the gas station to get some smokes. I'm gonna film this...this..public toilet for you and upload it onto youtube. then share the link. You haven't seen filth yet. Jetackuu said: » Odin.Jassik said: » Sex in the sense of physical gender or the act? If you're trying to separate physical gender from gender identity, don't bother, I have no interest in having a conversation over the semantics of gender identity as it applies to gender paradigms. I know what I mean, I say gender because that's what I mean. If you're going by legal definitions, there are plenty of trans people who are legally recognized as their identified sex and not their assigned sex. IE: Federal ID states they are female but they have a wang. What specific permutation of the idea of gender or sex are you trying to employ? The answer is: Whichever supports your feelings. That's fine, but I have no interest in further discussing it with you. Blazed1979 said: » I'm going to the gas station to get some smokes. I'm gonna film this...this..public toilet for you and upload it onto youtube. then share the link. You haven't seen filth yet. Oh, whoops, there I go off on my own personal tangent. Hey, let's nip that in the bud, shall we? Shiva.Onorgul said: » pet theory 
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Verda said: » ... Not to like, ignore your entire paper of a response, but I don't care to defend the autogynephilia theory. I said that it could be wrong. I don't personally believe it to be adequate, much less absolute. That said, the few studies I've seen that attempted to indicate a biological component to transexualism have all been pitiful in sample size, methodology, and conclusion. I can't disprove it, but at this point you may as well just be doing Carl Sagan's dragon in the garage bit. If you have a credible source indicating a biological component, then I'll agree these people deserve special privileges and sympathy. If not, they deserve therapy and a medical system that has the backbone to stand up and say "NO" to hormone therapy and genital mutilation. Leviathan.Comeatmebro said: » If not, they deserve therapy and a medical system that has the backbone to stand up and say "NO" to hormone therapy and genital mutilation. I find it odd that you say, "I don't actually believe a thing I posted, but it's slightly better than what you've said (in my opinion), so I have the upper ground." That kind of honesty isn't going to win you any arguments when it clearly indicates you're arguing exclusively from bias. But let's go ahead and look at what autogynephilia is: it's a paraphilia. Indeed, I do not deny that this paraphilia exists because, on the list of paraphilias, it's a long, long way from the weirdest. Blanchard's theory proposes to explain why one small group of people who have this paraphilia may choose to act on it in an extreme way, but it isn't remotely close to a complete enough explanation to use as justification for anything. The theory that autogynephilia leads to transsexualism in certain bio-males doesn't begin to account for MTF who are exclusively attracted to men nor any kind of FTM. You said that you'd have more respect if someone could show there was a biological component, but then you wholesale reject the (admittedly scant) data suggesting that in favor of latching onto a psychological hypothesis that covers only a small fraction of the community as a whole. You're honest enough to say that Blanchard's theory is barely better than a puff of methane, so perhaps you'll be honest enough to note how poor an argument this is. But back to the subject of paraphilia. You know what else is a paraphilia? Getting sexually aroused at the sight of female breasts. That covers a ridiculous proportion of heterosexual men, to say nothing of a substantial proportion of non-heterosexual women. Just because something is a paraphilia (also called a fetish) doesn't imply it's something deviant that must be purged. Though, if we're going to talk about paraphilias and public bathrooms, the desire to view oneself as female, whether acted on cosmetically or surgically, simply doesn't make a difference. If one were engaged in exhibitionistic behavior, well, we already have laws against that and for valid reasons. It doesn't matter what shape the genitals are. When it comes to paraphilias and public bathrooms, though, another prominent paraphilia is sexual arousal to urine. How about we ban anyone who thinks golden showers are sexy? They're almost certainly among the people pissing on every flat surface in some bathrooms, up to and including the goddamn ceiling. As with the bill that punishes someone for having the wrong genitals compared to their chromosome, we'll have to invent a magical detector than can spot these deviants and prevent them evacuating their bladder anywhere. Base laws in things that matter. The question of "why is someone transgender" is not important unless their being transgendered equates to an increased probability of causing damage to property or other people. As it does not, the question is irrelevant. Can't wait until we do genital checks, and the people who feel restroom use based on parts discover that some women are better endowed than they are.
Shiva.Onorgul said: » Jetackuu said: » Shiva.Onorgul said: » Explain further. Don't quip at me, explain why this needs to be enshrined in law and, moreover, how we forgot to do so over the past 250 years. I personally don't think it needs to be in law, as I've stated already, I find the concept of segregated bathrooms by sex ridiculous, and from what you've stated earlier we agree on that point. We haven't forgotten to put it into law over the past 250 years, as I've also stated earlier. Odin.Jassik said: » Jetackuu said: » Odin.Jassik said: » Sex in the sense of physical gender or the act? If you're trying to separate physical gender from gender identity, don't bother, I have no interest in having a conversation over the semantics of gender identity as it applies to gender paradigms. I know what I mean, I say gender because that's what I mean. If you're going by legal definitions, there are plenty of trans people who are legally recognized as their identified sex and not their assigned sex. IE: Federal ID states they are female but they have a wang. What specific permutation of the idea of gender or sex are you trying to employ? The answer is: Whichever supports your feelings. That's fine, but I have no interest in further discussing it with you. Obviously you don't, or you would realize that you're just being ridiculous. As to the ID thing: yeah, that's politically correct being taken way too far, along with this other nonsense that people keeping spouting that want special treatment for ***. We've been separating bathrooms by sex for many years, not gender. Despite what you want to believe. Jetackuu said: » So you're going to continue to ignore reality in favor of your desire/need to be politically correct, got it. My desire is to not have my country's law books clogged up further with irrelevant ***. Tell me how someone being transgendered affects your life and I'll start giving a damn about why they are that way. I live here in reality, by which I mean I'm concerned with the practical. Jet annoyed with PC gone too far?! What's next, KN and LG agreeing on banking practices?
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Shiva.Onorgul said: » Jetackuu said: » So you're going to continue to ignore reality in favor of your desire/need to be politically correct, got it. My desire is to not have my country's law books clogged up further with irrelevant ***. Tell me how someone being transgendered affects your life and I'll start giving a damn about why they are that way. I live here in reality, by which I mean I'm concerned with the practical. Your attitude and avoidance and your accusations are pretty pathetic though.
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Leviathan.Chaosx said: » Jet annoyed with PC gone too far?! What's next, KN and LG agreeing on banking practices? I've never been one for political correctness, you know that. Caitsith.Shiroi said: » Should make a bill to jail people who are too loud while taking a dump.
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Bloodrose said: » Caitsith.Shiroi said: » Should make a bill to jail people who are too loud while taking a dump. Or who try to take a flying dump (i.e. not touching the seat) and end up splashing fecal matter all over the stall. You'd be surprised how often this happens at my workplace. |
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