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FL Bill Would Imprison TSs for Using Bathrooms
By fonewear 2015-02-10 17:50:38
Related conditions
The following conditions may include dysphoria as a symptom:
Major depressive disorder (unipolar) and dysthymia
Bipolar disorder and cyclothymia
Premenstrual syndrome
Premenstrual dysphoric disorder
Stress
Adjustment disorder with depressed mood
Anxiety disorders such as Post traumatic stress disorder
Mixed anxiety-depressive disorder
Gender dysphoria, sometimes diagnosed as "gender identity disorder" (the latter term and its identification with gender dysphoria is controversial)
Personality disorders such as borderline personality disorder, dependent personality disorder and antisocial personality disorder
Substance withdrawal
Body dysmorphic disorder
Akathisia
Hypoglycemia
Schizophrenia
Sexual dysfunction
Body integrity identity disorder
Insomnia
Chronic pain
All fall under physical duress, and are recorded in the current DSM-5 as side effects of certain mental disorders.
I only have like 9 of those disorders.
With terrorism and Obama we are all depressed and anxious !
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By Shiva.Onorgul 2015-02-10 17:57:50
Even though my physical appearance is human, I know that I'm really a god so everyone should stop treating me like a human and worship me instead. We have laws protecting schizophrenics, so don't worry.
You guys kill me with this argument. It's "special treatment" to get to go into a bathroom stall and evacuate one's waste. One of the most basic human functions, asked to be performed in a way that puts one in a least-harm situation, and it's conflated to some hysterical ***. Transgender people don't want to be singled out, that's the whole point, but you guys keep arguing that they're apparently running around in the streets with their genitals flapping everywhere.
In context, it almost makes people who protested so loudly about gays seem sensible. I actually do walk down the street and kiss my boyfriend in public. I'm observably gay. And we've already decided that's acceptable, alongside inter-racial relationships and women wearing pants and all sorts of other irrational things that people waste their time fretting over.
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By Leviathan.Comeatmebro 2015-02-10 18:06:23
~4 halfassed responses implying you're right and i'm wrong with no basis in evidence and a tone of condescension Moving along..
Quote: This is opinions... 592 more words about how your opinions are better than mine The fact of the matter is, someone can feel they were born the wrong gender. That doesn't mean they were. Without scientific evidence, you're blindly following political correctness as much as I'm blindly following my interpretation of the situation.
Congratulations on your ability to make a 2 sentence thought appear to be pages long, though. It makes you remarkably obnoxious to interact with.
Lakshmi.Saevel
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By Lakshmi.Saevel 2015-02-10 18:06:51
Otherkin and Genderqueer
They keep adding "special" categories to further outline how "diverse" they are.
By fonewear 2015-02-10 18:20:12
I'm pretty diverse I used to have a black friend in jr. high school !
By fonewear 2015-02-10 18:39:54
Your ideas intrigue me. I'd like to subscribe to your newsletter !
By Jetackuu 2015-02-10 18:47:20
Prove that Gender Dysphoria isn't all just in the mind (whether a choice or a mental illness), and then we'll have that discussion. Prove that it is. You have an assertion to make, you go ahead and prove your assertion.
I'm not going to wait, though. You're going to dodge as usual. The burden of proof isn't on us, but nice try, and nice deflection. Actually, the burden of proof is on you for making the assertion or claim that
1. they *shouldn't* be a Woman recognizable by law, despite living and identifying as one,
2. that it's purely mental (in the head, either by choice or mental illness) despite there being evidence of causing physical duress to the body due to being wired as a female. No, for #1: that's literally HELP I AM TRAPPED IN 2006 PLEASE SEND A TIME MACHINE. How they live is irrelevant, and this is what people are talking about when they say *** want people to pander to their whims.
#2: No, the burden of proof is on you that it isn't, and the physical manifestation can be caused by the mind as well, not to mention like chaos said: citation needed.
Prove that Gender Dysphoria isn't all just in the mind (whether a choice or a mental illness), and then we'll have that discussion. Prove that it is. You have an assertion to make, you go ahead and prove your assertion.
I'm not going to wait, though. You're going to dodge as usual. The burden of proof isn't on us, but nice try, and nice deflection. Wrong.
NEITHER SIDE can claim definitive evidence.
You're playing a game of "Well, since I reject your point-of-view, you're just going to have to agree with mine." Wrong. There is an absence of evidence on both sides and that means that neither assertion is well-supported. If you want to claim your assertion is correct, you have to prove it. Your assertion has no more potency to suggest that your beliefs trump others when all are made in the absence of evidence.
Which is why I've side-stepped your little pet theory and aimed at no-harm as a guiding principle instead. Again with this ***about a "pet theory" what the *** are you talking about?
I made no assertion, but nice try. The burden of proof is on you and your ilk, if you want a group of people to get special treatment, you need to prove that they deserve special treatment.
By Jetackuu 2015-02-10 18:48:14
Otherkin and Genderqueer
They keep adding "special" categories to further outline how "diverse" they are.
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Leviathan.Chaosx
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By Leviathan.Chaosx 2015-02-10 19:13:41
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Ragnarok.Nausi
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By Ragnarok.Nausi 2015-02-10 20:02:08
Its funny you say that, I think they keep expanding their classification so eventually they'll encompass everyone.
If Q is questioning, well *** who hasn't questioned their sexual orientation before?
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By Odin.Jassik 2015-02-10 20:07:04
I made no assertion, but nice try. The burden of proof is on you and your ilk, if you want a group of people to get special treatment, you need to prove that they deserve special treatment.
I'm curious what special treatment you think people are advocating for. Without this law, they are subject to the same gender norms as anyone, male or female. The only difference is that supporters of the law are basically saying that anyone who doesn't fit neatly into either box is a criminal by some standard. If nothing else, they should get the same treatment as any androgynous person would, the benefit of the doubt. You see an androgynous person walk into your gender's restroom and you assume that they are supposed to be there, you don't require them to drop their pants to prove that they have the correct equipment. You just make your deuce in peace and move along.
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Leviathan.Chaosx
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By Leviathan.Chaosx 2015-02-10 20:18:45
Its funny you say that, I think they keep expanding their classification so eventually they'll encompass everyone.
If Q is questioning, well *** who hasn't questioned their sexual orientation before? You should check out this Huff Post article.
Here's an excerpt:
Quote: So the idea of a gay fascist seems ridiculous. Yet when the British National Party - our own home-grown Holocaust-denying bigots - announced it was fielding an openly gay candidate in the European elections this June, dedicated followers of fascism didn't blink. The twisted truth is that gay men have been at the heart of every major fascist movement that ever was - including the gay-gassing, homo-cidal Third Reich. With the exception of Jean-Marie Le Pen, all the most high-profile fascists in Europe in the past thirty years have been gay. It's time to admit something. Fascism isn't something that happens out there, a nasty habit acquired by the straight boys. It is - in part, at least - a gay thing, and it's time for non-fascist gay people to wake up and face the marching music. The Strange, Strange Story of the Gay Fascists
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By fonewear 2015-02-10 20:32:35
Gay and fascism I died and went to heaven !
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By Jetackuu 2015-02-10 20:42:19
I made no assertion, but nice try. The burden of proof is on you and your ilk, if you want a group of people to get special treatment, you need to prove that they deserve special treatment.
I'm curious what special treatment you think people are advocating for. Without this law, they are subject to the same gender norms as anyone, male or female. The only difference is that supporters of the law are basically saying that anyone who doesn't fit neatly into either box is a criminal by some standard. If nothing else, they should get the same treatment as any androgynous person would, the benefit of the doubt. You see an androgynous person walk into your gender's restroom and you assume that they are supposed to be there, you don't require them to drop their pants to prove that they have the correct equipment. You just make your deuce in peace and move along.
I understand that you don't get it, and your statement here is evident that you probably will never get it.
You still think that this bill is adding discrimination, when it isn't.
Garuda.Chanti
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By Garuda.Chanti 2015-02-10 21:46:53
....
You still think that this bill is adding discrimination, when it isn't. I think this bill is legislating discrimination.
By Jetackuu 2015-02-10 21:58:27
....
You still think that this bill is adding discrimination, when it isn't. I think this bill is legislating discrimination. Of course, by it's nature any bill segregating bathrooms is discriminating, but the point was that it isn't increasing that discrimination.
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By Odin.Jassik 2015-02-10 23:06:31
....
You still think that this bill is adding discrimination, when it isn't. I think this bill is legislating discrimination. Of course, by it's nature any bill segregating bathrooms is discriminating, but the point was that it isn't increasing that discrimination.
A bill that does nothing to address any real problem and serves only to criminalize one group simply for existing... yeah, I sure don't get it.
By Jetackuu 2015-02-10 23:12:29
....
You still think that this bill is adding discrimination, when it isn't. I think this bill is legislating discrimination. Of course, by it's nature any bill segregating bathrooms is discriminating, but the point was that it isn't increasing that discrimination.
A bill that does nothing to address any real problem and serves only to criminalize one group simply for existing... yeah, I sure don't get it. Yet neither of those are accurate, that's why you don't get it.
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Bismarck.Snprphnx
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By Bismarck.Snprphnx 2015-02-10 23:24:26
Let's just convert all bathrooms nationwide into co-Ed restrooms and be done with it.
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By Odin.Jassik 2015-02-10 23:34:17
....
You still think that this bill is adding discrimination, when it isn't. I think this bill is legislating discrimination. Of course, by it's nature any bill segregating bathrooms is discriminating, but the point was that it isn't increasing that discrimination.
A bill that does nothing to address any real problem and serves only to criminalize one group simply for existing... yeah, I sure don't get it. Yet neither of those are accurate, that's why you don't get it.
By all means, educate me.
Lakshmi.Saevel
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By Lakshmi.Saevel 2015-02-11 04:39:42
I made no assertion, but nice try. The burden of proof is on you and your ilk, if you want a group of people to get special treatment, you need to prove that they deserve special treatment.
I'm curious what special treatment you think people are advocating for. Without this law, they are subject to the same gender norms as anyone, male or female. The only difference is that supporters of the law are basically saying that anyone who doesn't fit neatly into either box is a criminal by some standard. If nothing else, they should get the same treatment as any androgynous person would, the benefit of the doubt. You see an androgynous person walk into your gender's restroom and you assume that they are supposed to be there, you don't require them to drop their pants to prove that they have the correct equipment. You just make your deuce in peace and move along.
This is a preventive measure. The LGBTGQO lobby did the worst thing they could do when they took that bakery to trial over their refusal to bake a homosexual wedding cake on religious grounds. They showed to everyone that they were willing to use the law to offend and attack ordinary citizens and force them to do things against their religion. To those of you already on the left, you think there is nothing wrong because you are operating under the false assumption that "you are right". To those of us who are neutral you just announced, loud and clear, that not only did you simply not care about anyone else's feelings or beliefs, but that you were going to actively pursue legal action against anyone who disagreed with you.
The smartest thing those people could of done was walk away and give someone else their business while spreading the knowledge of that bakery's prejudice and bigotry. Instead they took ensured that everyone else now operates under the assumption that its "when" and not "if" some LGBTGQO person decided to push their agenda and start suing anyone who disagrees. Laws like this wouldn't would be passed unless there was a sizable population who believed that at some point in the future someone was going go to into their city / county / state and start demanding everyone accommodate them or else they will get big daddy government to bust down your door and hold a gun to your head and force you to.
Currently the LGBTGQO lobby is no different then the ultra religious lobby. And if you can't see this then your too invested in a political ideology to be an objective neutral party.
By Voren 2015-02-11 07:09:18
To play devil's advocate for a bit, Saevel, take out LGBTGQO and replace it with Black. It's the 1960's all over again.
You'd think that everyone would have learned their lesson by now and instead of hiding their bigotry behind religion, politics, personal opinion they'd instead come to terms with the fact that not everyone else is going to feel how they do about a particular group of people.
The LGBT community (and yes I redacted it to four letters sue me) did exactly what has been done in the past. Unfortunately law makers have gone full swing batshit crazy and decided to retaliate with something that borderlines obscene.
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By fonewear 2015-02-11 08:31:55
You who is responsible for all of this...the Jews !
Jews hate public restrooms always have always will.
Lakshmi.Saevel
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By Lakshmi.Saevel 2015-02-11 09:32:41
To play devil's advocate for a bit, Saevel, take out LGBTGQO and replace it with Black. It's the 1960's all over again.
You'd think that everyone would have learned their lesson by now and instead of hiding their bigotry behind religion, politics, personal opinion they'd instead come to terms with the fact that not everyone else is going to feel how they do about a particular group of people.
The LGBT community (and yes I redacted it to four letters sue me) did exactly what has been done in the past. Unfortunately law makers have gone full swing batshit crazy and decided to retaliate with something that borderlines obscene.
Except it's comparing Apples to Oranges. Blacks were historically oppressed and underrepresented, LGBTGQO on the other hand have not. Homosexuality has been present in the ruling ultra elite for several thousand years of recorded human history. What they did is wrong, they forced their own personal agenda onto someone else and forced them, at gunpoint, to violate their religious beliefs. Getting the government to do anything for you is by definition using lethal force because all government actions are enforced by the governments near monopoly on justified homicide.
You obviously don't respect people's religious beliefs (regardless of how bigoted it might be) and so can't possibly comprehend the level of animosity that was generated. You might as well of held an event where tens of thousands of bibles were publicly burned with little crux-fixes were being handed out as pop-sickles. Even those of us who aren't particularly religious yet aren't so far up the progressive lefts a$$ that we can't see right from wrong, can see how aggressive the LGBTGQO on left has been these last few years. It's done nothing but polarize people against you and once that starts to happen you get dumb sh!t like this. You are not a discriminated oppressed people, the center of LGBTGQO activity isn't some economically challenged ghetto ridden city but one of the most expensive most affluent cities in the world.
Every time I hear about "oppression" in a first world nation this comes to mind.
It's become an Oppression Olympics which the gold medalist being whomever can claim the most oppression points. You f*ckers don't know oppression. Oppression isn't some religious bigot making rude comments about you or refusing you service, oppression is death chambers, forced labor camps, public executions and witch hunts. There are places in the world, one not so far away from me, where real oppression happens every day with the body count still rising and you people have the gall to claim "I'm being oppressed!", as though your somehow special and we should give a damn about your feelings.
Compare someone not baking a f*cking wedding cake to this, then come talk to me about oppression.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/world/south-korean-report-details-alleged-abuses-at-north-koreas-prison-camps/2012/05/09/gIQA794LDU_story.html
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By Jetackuu 2015-02-11 09:47:02
Yeah, no. Sorry but forcing a business to not discriminate against it's clientele is not violating their religious beliefs.
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Garuda.Chanti
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By Garuda.Chanti 2015-02-11 10:56:03
....
You still think that this bill is adding discrimination, when it isn't. I think this bill is legislating discrimination. Of course, by it's nature any bill segregating bathrooms is discriminating, but the point was that it isn't increasing that discrimination. Of course not. It neither increases nor decreases existing discrimination, it mandates discrimination and has a mechanism to punish those who do not discriminate.
You who is responsible for all of this...the Jews !
Jews hate public restrooms always have always will. True fact: In Chicago during the jazz era, many establishments had three bathrooms.
The labels were White, Colored, Jewish.
By Jetackuu 2015-02-11 11:18:13
....
You still think that this bill is adding discrimination, when it isn't. I think this bill is legislating discrimination. Of course, by it's nature any bill segregating bathrooms is discriminating, but the point was that it isn't increasing that discrimination. Of course not. It neither increases nor decreases existing discrimination, it mandates discrimination and has a mechanism to punish those who do not discriminate. That's what I've been saying the whole time...
I don't agree with the need to separate bathrooms in the first place.
Cerberus.Wonton
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By Cerberus.Wonton 2015-02-11 12:01:03
I made no assertion, but nice try. The burden of proof is on you and your ilk, if you want a group of people to get special treatment, you need to prove that they deserve special treatment.
I'm curious what special treatment you think people are advocating for. Without this law, they are subject to the same gender norms as anyone, male or female. The only difference is that supporters of the law are basically saying that anyone who doesn't fit neatly into either box is a criminal by some standard. If nothing else, they should get the same treatment as any androgynous person would, the benefit of the doubt. You see an androgynous person walk into your gender's restroom and you assume that they are supposed to be there, you don't require them to drop their pants to prove that they have the correct equipment. You just make your deuce in peace and move along.
I understand that you don't get it, and your statement here is evident that you probably will never get it.
You still think that this bill is adding discrimination, when it isn't.
Exactly; it's the same way California's Prop 8 wasn't discriminatory. It was reinforcing a gay man's right to marry a woman.
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Ragnarok.Nausi
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By Ragnarok.Nausi 2015-02-11 12:41:37
To play devil's advocate for a bit, Saevel, take out LGBTGQO and replace it with Black. It's the 1960's all over again.
You'd think that everyone would have learned their lesson by now and instead of hiding their bigotry behind religion, politics, personal opinion they'd instead come to terms with the fact that not everyone else is going to feel how they do about a particular group of people.
The LGBT community (and yes I redacted it to four letters sue me) did exactly what has been done in the past. Unfortunately law makers have gone full swing batshit crazy and decided to retaliate with something that borderlines obscene.
You cannot dissolve the distinctions between X and Y discrimination by equating them. Discriminating on race is different than by gender identity.
florida_bill_would_imprison_trans_people_for_using_public_bathrooms Slate
Quote: Gay marriage has been legal in Florida for a month now, and at this point, even the state’s hardcore conservatives seem increasingly resigned to the fact that marriage equality is here to stay. Accordingly, Florida’s more bigoted legislators have decided to turn their ire toward another maligned, disfavored minority—trans people—by proposing one of the most viciously sadistic, hypocritical bills the legislature has ever considered.
The basic purpose of the bill is quite simple: to forbid trans people from using the public bathroom that matches their true gender. According to the bill’s text, any trans person who enters a “single-sex public facility” that doesn’t match their “biological sex” is guilty of a first-degree misdemeanor. A “single-sex public facility” includes bathrooms “maintained by an owner of public accommodations, a school, or a place of employment”—basically, any public bathroom in the entire state. Any trans person who violates the act could be sentenced to one year in prison.
It gets much, much worse. Any non-trans person who discovers a trans person using a bathroom that doesn’t align with their “biological sex” would be permitted to sue that trans person under the act. (If sued successfully, the trans person would have to pay their accuser’s attorney fees.) And, in a final turn of the screw, an “owner of public accommodations, a school, or a place of employment” who allows a trans person to use the bathroom of their true gender is liable for a civil suit. In other words, if a store owner does not actively prevent trans people from using her bathrooms, she can be sued by other customers. And of course, if the trans-friendly store owner is found to have allowed a trans person to use the bathroom, she’ll not only have to pay damages to disgruntled customers—she’ll also have to pay their attorney’s fees.
The obvious intent of this bill is to humiliate trans people by opening them up to criminal and civil liability merely for performing the most basic of bodily functions. Trans people already face harassment, discrimination, and sometimes violence while attempting to use the bathroom. This bill would effectively give anti-trans harassers the state’s blessing, while providing them a new avenue through which to shame trans Floridians—the court system. Many trans people are already anxious about using public bathrooms; some are afraid to leave their homes given the risk of verbal and physical abuse they face in public facilities. With this bill, the state would effectively legalize anti-trans harassment, sending a resounding message to trans people that they are not welcome in public life.
But perhaps the galling component of the bill is its astonishing interference into private businesses. For years, conservatives have been complaining that LGBT non-discrimination ordinances impede the liberty of business owners. These businesses, conservatives argue, should have the freedom to conduct their affairs however they so choose—even if that means kicking out gay customers who want to buy their products. With the tables turned, however, Florida’s right-wing legislators have changed their tune, arguing that private business owners should be forbidden from letting trans customers use their bathrooms. This intrusion into the autonomy of businesses is as hideously hypocritical as it is unsurprising. Most conservatives are only willing to defend business owners’ rights so long as they’re exercising their right to discriminate against LGBTQ people. When businesses wish to tolerate LGBTQ customers, conservatives have no problem passing a law restricting their liberty.
It is probably too soon to tell whether Florida’s bill will pass—though given this legislature’s track record, any bill designed to demean a sexual minority has fair odds of becoming law. Either way, the mere existence of such a mean-spirited bill sends a blunt message to the state’s trans community that they are not welcome here. It was probably inevitable that, once the marriage equality debate settled down, those who dedicate their lives to promoting hatred would set their sights on trans people. But the maliciousness and celerity with which Florida’s legislators have zeroed in on the trans community suggests the next battle for LGBTQ rights will be a brutal one.
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