FFXIII: Lightning Returns

Then they can forget about XV. Seriously.

I mean, what got them in the hole last fiscal year? XIV and poor console sales over here.

Frankly, they might be better off, if this is correct, basically making XV the true _FINAL_ Fantasy and retire the franchise.

I can't see FFXV going badly unless they make some massively terrible errors with the game. From what I have understood about the game it's supposed to build on the same engine KH3 is running on, with somewhat similar gameplay and everything. KH is a massively loved franchise in its own right with the only thing bringing it down being the handheld spin-offs that did to expand the story, but its gameplay has always been great.

If they can bring that gameplay into a FF game with a more serious tone to it and everything, I can't really see FFXV failing unless people are deterred from it simply because of FFXIII/-2/LR/IV/ARR.

What is with the White Mage garb? It looks like a cheerleader going to a toga party.

Which is exactly what I see happening.

I'd remove ARR from that last bit, but the fact of the matter is that we are going to find out, when XV releases, just how much damage the Lightning Saga and XIV 1.X did to this franchise.

Could well be fatal.

While yes it was every other game they made them in the last 5 years with the Final Fantasy title, KH:DDD, Sleeping Dogs, Tomb Raider, and Deus Ex from what I know are all fairly good, I have only played Sleeping Dogs however.

In the end, saying the last 5 years of games isn't much in the respect that no one without an interest in MMO and a good PC would be playing FFXIV, and you could literally turn down FFXIII based on the first game and shared numbers alone. I don't know, I don't feel like FFXIII will have a lasting effect on the franchise since it at least was all under the same number, and I think XIV doesn't count as much since it isn't a standard game.

If XIII & XV both failed, 2 numbers, all branch offs, in a row and over a 8ish year span, I could see it doing that damage, but not when a single game has done most of the damage through itself & sequels.

Annnd reading the preview, this gets a bit wall-of-text-y. I rather liked the 13 series, with the exception of the last one, so I got a bit talkative on my reviews of pros and cons. I'll include a tl;dr at the end. D:!


I feel people are being a little too harsh on the game series, or at least for the first two games of the Lightning trilogy. Mind you, not all of the criticism is unfounded, as there were plenty of things that bothered people, plenty of things that could be done better.

13's biggest change was in its new battle system that feels like it was built off of the real-time system from 10-2 as a foundation, with free-moving characters and quick role switching to be ready for different situations. The difference was that instead of three characters that did one action at a time and then waited for the ATB bar to fill, you controlled one party member but could use that same ATB bar to chain attacks together of different types, which I felt was a really interesting battle system. My biggest complaint with it was obviously the single character control, but with how much you did with one, it would be crazy to queue commands for three different characters rapidly in an active battle. I'd have liked it to be an option for hardcore or dedicated players though, to turn off the AI on one or both party members.

And of course, 13's biggest issue was the linearity that hit you up until Pulse, which even then did not provide you a lot of free roaming. You had like... three? Four? Side areas. Besides that, the game was a line, and your movement was really how you navigated that line. That really made it a drag, but the storyline and the battle system at least distracted me from it. The storyline was definitely one of the game's strengths, even if its linearity was a huge turn-off.

13-2 took a lot of the prequel's systems and made them a notch better. For one thing, the role system was managed in a different way, allowing you to level it up in a different manner without penalizing you for going off the "main three" roles like they did in the original. Additionally, the battle system was tweaked, giving you two main characters to control, even if it was one at a time. This allowed you to swap between them if one went down, or if you needed to change how a strategy was handled. The fact that the death of your main character wasn't instant game over was a huge improvement, giving you two chances unless some huge AoE ate your face. The monster system was interesting too, giving you customizable monsters whose skills and passive abilities you could customize, giving them some nice tricks and allowing you to build some great teams... or some silly ones, like my all-chocobo team.

The two biggest hits to 13-2, in my opinion, were the storyline and the exploration. We'll start with the latter. The exploration was a step up from 13, allowing one to freely choose which areas to go to first, allowing branch areas and optional areas for gaining additional fragments or unique monsters, but at the same time many of the areas were small, didn't have much exploration variance. There were a few exceptions, Academia 4XX being one (I'd say 400, but... god, all the fighting) and the Archetype Steppe being another. They weren't nearly as bad as the straight-line of 13, but it still lacked the variability when you had the same map just colored differently with different areas blocked off. Mostly I'm looking at the Bresha Ruins and the Yashas Massif on that, but any map that repeated was practically a copy of the others. I think Augustus tower might have been an exception with some slight variances.

As for the story... ugh. I'm sorry, but 13 had gotten its closure. Cocoon was "saved," the ultimate sacrifice had been made, and family and friends were reunited. It was a nice, happy ending. I liked 13-2 for the most part, but it wasn't even necessary, given they had a solid ending for 13. But now, suddenly Lightning gets swept off to Valhalla without warning? There's a war against a goddess we've never heard of? Chaos? Nevermind all those Fal'Cie and such we've been dealing with up until this point, apparently they're the small-fry. And then we just toss in a distorted timeline and time travel and... ugh. They went way off the beaten path after 13. Don't get me wrong, the story ended up being put together fairly well with only a few hiccups. But it felt... unnecessary.

Story spoiler. I'm sure people have beaten 13-2, but just in case...

And then there's Lightning Returns. This one is fully deserving of its criticism and its low score, as sad as I am to say it. I spent three days going through it because I was snowed in and had nothing to do, so I pretty much sat down and beat it. The storyline isn't bad, but they give a lot of it to you in bits and pieces. Why was Lightning chosen to be the Savior? What was wrong with her that her emotions were messed up? Why was Hope a kid again? (They never really explained that last one, at least not that I noticed. I liked older Hope...) I felt like they just tossed you into the middle of the ocean and said to sink or swim on it, especially with a time limit ticking off.

Granted, the time system wasn't nearly as bad as I had thought it would be. The days were plenty long, and even with the hour-loss penalty from running from fights (or being forced to run, if you were getting your rear handed to you), I didn't feel terribly rushed except for time-dependent events, such as nighttime access to the Warrens or finding certain items, areas, or people for quests at specific times. But that's what Chronostasis is for, right? I wish we had gotten more than a single day for the Ultimate Lair, so I could kill more Last Ones and see if there was something at the bottom, but Earth Eaters and I don't get along and that one ate up most of my time. :(

The biggest criticism I have for this game is the changed systems. They took everything from 13 and 13-2... and scrapped it. Instead we have a new system that's not roles, but is closer to the Dress Sphere system from 10-2. Granted, I liked the customization, and had fun with it, especially since I could set aside 4-5 schemata for niche situations and swap them in if a boss or particularly tough enemy was giving me a rough time. But the fact is, they should have tried a "new concept" in a new game, not at the end of a trilogy that used the same general systems since the beginning.

Battle, they did the same thing; they completely revamped the stagger system, making it a lot more annoying for some enemies (Chocobo Eater/Juggernauts/Final Boss, I'm looking at you). Atop that, the four-command per schemata made you feel really limited and have to plan out your moves carefully. Do you risk having shield defenses on 1-2 Schemata instead of all three, and swap quickly? (I ended up only having it on one, but I had a physical-immune setup on another as well, so it was only for blocking magic.) Did you burn slots on debuffs, not knowing if they'd be resisted, or put in elements and pray they're not immune to them? At least the ability to not get a "game over" from battle made it easier to adapt to shifts in strategies (it helped for the final boss, whom I had to change ideas and schematas out six or seven times before I found a working combination).

Overall, I'd like to have liked Lightning Returns, and gave it a fair shot with an open mind. I'd still say the 6 is justified. There were things I liked about it, but unfortunately the list of dislikes piled a fair bit higher. Lightning Returns (or as I aptly name it, Side Quest: The Game) could have been a much better game, and while it wasn't a complete bomb, it was still on the low end of Final Fantasy's legacy. At least it's not Crystal Chronicles!


tl;dr - 13 wasn't bad, had an innovative combat system and a good storyline, but suffered from straight-line syndrome and limited interaction with more than your party leader. 13-2 took most of those systems and improved it, and the overall storyline was not bad at all, but the maps felt repetitive and in the end the game felt unnecessary after the "complete" game before it. Lightning Returns is unfortunately deserving of its low score, and by completely leaving the original systems of the 13 trilogy and branching out into such a strange set of systems while still being within that trilogy, it became a large turn-off.

The flans are in yusnaan. I hadn't been there yet to know the guards were on alert. I was talking about Luxerion where the guards are passive, but you can make them aggresive by slashing them. which can be handy when starting out. I know im going bomb this game though, too much exploring and such, 2 main quests down, 3 days in, starting day 4 in 1 minute.

You cant bomb it, it just starts NG+, all your stats and items carry over.

i pretty much cleared every sidequest available bar dead dunes with the exception of adornments bc the NPC only available during Main quest 2-2 -.-, that and the alchemy quests, Luxerion/Wildlands 100% done.
Im on Day 8
HP+5620
STR+633
MAG+594
Max ATB+30
EP Max Value/Item Cap both +2


Missing 7 green moss from chocobo eaters (they are such a pain) from canvas in wildlands and thats about it, about to head over to dead dunes!

Anyone know 100% for sure if the only time you can complete adornment quest is during 2-2?

No, you can do it after. She just moves outside the augur's quarter, and she's juggling. It's like in front of the hotel, and it might only be at night. I'm not sure, I just ran into her then after I finished the chocobo chick quest.

I'm currently in Yusnaan, doing the fireworks main quest, when I had to pause and go do something real quick. As its paused, I notice the Tour Guide nearby is playing "Clash on the Big Bridge" on what sounds like a gazoo xD

Just thought that was awesome lol.

ohhhhhhhh, all the guides i seen never said she moved out of augurs ><

Is it possible to do too many quests before the day is over?
Or is it possible to gain more than one day back if you've done more quests than needed?

Also why Lightning was chosenCopied from wiki because I was too lazy to type it out, lol.

Hope and Lightning, worst duo in FF history.

Anyone know if theres a list of how many of a species i have to kill for the Last Ones (Omegas)? i killed over 10 speciies, working on the Meonektons in wildlands at night and i killled quite a few and they still say common in bestiary :(

The guide book has one.

@Natenn
Another way to do it if your file is fairly powerful is just unlocking the Ultimate Lair with the "13th Day" by doing enough side quests, because you can fight every Last One there, and it automatically removes all the Last Ones you already killed. That way, you can eliminate a bunch and then finish the rest there, or if you're confident enough that you can deal with the big boys (I can't do Earth Eaters/Chocobo Eaters well. Or Dryad-type mobs. Freaking Gaunts!) you can just blaze through them all there. It's really up to personal choice how you want to do it, but it's probably a good idea to clear out as many of them as you can since time doesn't stop in the Ultimate Lair battles and you can't Chronostasis there.

Annnnd judging by the guide above, you prolly wanna fight the Meonekton in the Ultimate Lair. XD

@Taranis Umbra - I got why Lightning was chosen, I was being a bit facetious there, but thank you for that information on Hope. That actually makes sense. @.@

65,000? wat

i'm killing earth eaters now, have the wind aero garb w/ depro/deshell/Aerora, cloud w/ galestrike and and accessory that steals haste/bravery with heavy slash when he gets angry mode, and knight of etro w/ that sword caius drops that gives quick stagger. i steal the haste/brave asap stagger it with ele spells/strikes then do phys atks wich are doin x2 the galestrikes dmg(can use enaero potion for more dmg but im not atm)

Yeeeeeeah, the Meonekton are definitely intended to be done in Ultimate Lair.

no way its 65,000 lol

I keep doing quests but I never get more time, is there something i'm doing wrong?

The time gets added when Hope teleports you back to the Ark at 6AM every morning.

Missing Aeronite and Last ones sidequest, only chocobo eaters for the moss x8 and Lizard tails x20 for canvas of prayers. Do lizards respawn? i can find anymore QQ and does anyone have a working Aeronite strategy? i read its the hardest side quest in game, as for the last ones it cant be completed on first playthrough as 3 mobs only appear on day 13.

I can look in my guide book for the lizards for ya when I get home, will be bout 4 hours tho

They really should have done away with the encounter system for this title. The combat is the one thing that I would say they improved on this time around but it is hindered so much by the whole "run, see an enemy, hit them, load the enemy, fight them, load the loot screen, reload the world" thing.

With Lightning being the only character it could have been so easy to have a FF12 style-battle system where you fight the enemies you see on screen without loading and have them just drop items etc on the ground. Hell they could have even done it Kingdom Hearts style.