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The real cost of low wages
Server: Asura
Game: FFXI
Posts: 34187
By Asura.Kingnobody 2015-04-22 15:10:44
You guys are failing to see the underlying issues at work here. Not at all, corporate America *** everyone over but the stock holders and top of the companies, and then blames the poor people, and tells the people in the middle that it's all their fault.
Not to mention: outsourcing, and many other shotty practices that are detrimental to the American people. Whatever you say, Lordgrim Jet.
Server: Asura
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By Asura.Kingnobody 2015-04-22 15:12:35
But let's continue talking about how the poor want free ***, when all they want is the opportunity to keep a roof over their heads, and food on their table, and to be content, it's not really that complicated. If the poor wants the opportunity to keep a roof over their heads, and food on their table, why don't they work for it? You do know that there are many jobs out there that does not require a 4 year college degree and still makes $50k/year or more (depending on the area). But that's effort, and that's something you condone.
By EpicFantasy 2015-04-22 15:17:21
when all they want is the opportunity to keep a roof over their heads, and food on their table, and to be content, it's not really that complicated.
Exactly my point thank you.
This administration has proven it is doing the exact total opposite to foster this kind of goal.
Buy hey it's not obamas fault. He has done nothing to help the American middle class. That in turn, screws the poor by not giving them the chance to become middle class. All while accepting money from the rich to fund his campaign.
Leviathan.Chaosx
Server: Leviathan
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Posts: 20284
By Leviathan.Chaosx 2015-04-22 15:18:04
My point is, learn to manage your money better.
I'm buying up morgan silver dollars!
amIdoin'itright? Right now, definitely. Prices are down.
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Phoenix.Xantavia
Server: Phoenix
Game: FFXI
Posts: 449
By Phoenix.Xantavia 2015-04-22 15:22:11
My point is, learn to manage your money better. Not everyone has the luxury of having the spare money.
I've worked paycheck to paycheck, it blows, it's also why I went back to school, and while that's helped some, I just have more bills to pay. Maybe you should realize that managing money helps create spare money. You know, instead of buying the latest/greatest gadget, you actually save up to buy that home you want or that car instead of borrowing money to pay for it. Those little costs add up quickly.
But I wouldn't expect you to understand that. That requires responsibility, something you shown you don't have. What would you recommend for the situation I was in back in the mid 90's? I was making 4.35/hour, about 35 hours a week in fast food. After putting aside money for rent and student loans, I was able to put about $20 in my pocket each week. That $20 had to cover all other expenses, like food and laundry. I had no car, and used a pay phone if I had to get in contact with somebody. So please, enlighten me as to what I should have done to get out of that situation. I'll share how I finally did it. After I came home to an eviction notice on the door because my roommate decided to steal the rent, I moved back home at the age of 22
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Cerberus.Pleebo
Server: Cerberus
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Posts: 9720
By Cerberus.Pleebo 2015-04-22 15:28:23
That your brother-in-law is a bum and you condone it? How about everyone else who does it?
Are they all bums, or is it just because somebody who you don't like said it? I've never condoned gaming the system. Try again.
And I totally don't know who epicfantasy is so how could I not like him or her ^^
Leviathan.Chaosx
Server: Leviathan
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Posts: 20284
By Leviathan.Chaosx 2015-04-22 15:32:49
I spent the mid 90s learning computer programming at home while in high school on my 2400 baud modem. I remember the two Christmases where I got 14.4k and 56k respectively. Those were game changers.
Always feels like I wasted $80,000+ on getting two college degrees as I've never once needed them to get a job.
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Leviathan.Chaosx
Server: Leviathan
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Posts: 20284
By Leviathan.Chaosx 2015-04-22 15:36:00
Actually being the first person to have a CD burner come junior year of high school was nice. Charging kids $10 for a custom CD using mp3s. Those were the days. Then in college everyone was starting to know what mp3s were, so I had to move on to another business model.
Server: Asura
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Posts: 34187
By Asura.Kingnobody 2015-04-22 15:36:13
nvm
Cerberus.Pleebo
Server: Cerberus
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Posts: 9720
By Cerberus.Pleebo 2015-04-22 15:38:02
That your brother-in-law is a bum and you condone it? How about everyone else who does it?
Are they all bums, or is it just because somebody who you don't like said it? I've never condoned gaming the system. Try again.
And I totally don't know who epicfantasy is so how could I not like him or her ^^ You are right, you never condoned abusing the system. That's the problem right there.
Or do you not know what the word "condone" means? Like how you don't know what "hypocrite" means either. wat
Server: Asura
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Posts: 34187
By Asura.Kingnobody 2015-04-22 15:38:22
My point is, learn to manage your money better. Not everyone has the luxury of having the spare money.
I've worked paycheck to paycheck, it blows, it's also why I went back to school, and while that's helped some, I just have more bills to pay. Maybe you should realize that managing money helps create spare money. You know, instead of buying the latest/greatest gadget, you actually save up to buy that home you want or that car instead of borrowing money to pay for it. Those little costs add up quickly.
But I wouldn't expect you to understand that. That requires responsibility, something you shown you don't have. What would you recommend for the situation I was in back in the mid 90's? I was making 4.35/hour, about 35 hours a week in fast food. After putting aside money for rent and student loans, I was able to put about $20 in my pocket each week. That $20 had to cover all other expenses, like food and laundry. I had no car, and used a pay phone if I had to get in contact with somebody. So please, enlighten me as to what I should have done to get out of that situation. I'll share how I finally did it. After I came home to an eviction notice on the door because my roommate decided to steal the rent, I moved back home at the age of 22 I appreciate that you are looking to me for financial advice, and unfortunately since that has A) already passed, which you solved already and B) you are not giving me the complete story and situation, I cannot help you.
I can help with current problems, not past problems that already have been taken care of.
Server: Shiva
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Posts: 3618
By Shiva.Onorgul 2015-04-22 15:42:06
Oh gods and small fishes, where to start with you, Altima?
Actually, let's start on a positive note: thanks for actually providing an anecdote. I'm not sure I completely believe the story you've told, if only because no story is ever fully told (damn that liberal arts degree of mine), but it provides something.
The government can do absolute nothing about this since nothing can be proven against him, not like they are gonna go looking anyways because more than likely millions of people do about the same damn thing. This is a classic justification argument. Everyone does this, especially when family is involved. You know how every murderer's mother says, "Oh, he was such a good boy, and if he did do it, I'm sure there was a good reason"?
But if millions of people were doing this sort of thing, we'd know. We only have so many people living on government assistance, after all, and even 1,000,000 would be more than enough to raise huge red flags.
Also, by the by, you might not want to mention tax fraud around Kingnobody. He doesn't believe it exists.
Is this wrong? I used to think so.. But arguing with him about it all the time he always brought up the 5 factory's in 2yrs and I gotta say.. He turned my opinion on the matter.
In his and now my opinion, until something drastically changes. It is everyone for himself, take what you can get. Is this how it should be? No.. Is this the Obama America... Yes.. Your misattribution is depressing.
Your brother has been *** over seventeen different ways to Sunday by the relaxing of labor laws and corporate restrictions by conservative politicians, ergo it's Obama's fault that he is a tax-evading welfare fraudster. What nonsense.
You know what would have kept your brother from having to switch jobs every 5 months? A labor union. Good old progressive liberalism would've kept him steadily employed by sucking some of the money out of the stockholders' and CEOs' pockets. Instead, you're trying to justify him stealing from other poor people (because anyone who legally works 15 minutes is contributing to government welfare). That's literally insane.
Dog-eat-dog, every-man-for-himself policies are the bread-and-butter of contemporary conservatism and capitalism. Liberal politics is the reason your brother is still alive and has a roof over his head, conservative politics is what put him in that position. But you've been taught to hate the liberals, so it's Obama's fault. K.
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Siren.Mosin
By Siren.Mosin 2015-04-22 15:43:48
where to start with you, Altima?
the best place is not to.
Server: Shiva
Game: FFXI
Posts: 3618
By Shiva.Onorgul 2015-04-22 15:45:23
Always feels like I wasted $80,000+ on getting two college degrees as I've never once needed them to get a job. I'll dispute you on the "never once needed to get a job" point. Maybe back in the 90s it was possible to get a position without proving you'd been to college, but nowadays you can barely run a forklift in a warehouse without at least a 2-year degree in jacking off.
Hell, you said you couldn't find work last time you were here. Hiring practices in the US are completely *** right now and saying, "Just get an education," is like saying, "Just set your money on fire."
Phoenix.Xantavia
Server: Phoenix
Game: FFXI
Posts: 449
By Phoenix.Xantavia 2015-04-22 15:46:37
My point is, learn to manage your money better. Not everyone has the luxury of having the spare money.
I've worked paycheck to paycheck, it blows, it's also why I went back to school, and while that's helped some, I just have more bills to pay. Maybe you should realize that managing money helps create spare money. You know, instead of buying the latest/greatest gadget, you actually save up to buy that home you want or that car instead of borrowing money to pay for it. Those little costs add up quickly.
But I wouldn't expect you to understand that. That requires responsibility, something you shown you don't have. What would you recommend for the situation I was in back in the mid 90's? I was making 4.35/hour, about 35 hours a week in fast food. After putting aside money for rent and student loans, I was able to put about $20 in my pocket each week. That $20 had to cover all other expenses, like food and laundry. I had no car, and used a pay phone if I had to get in contact with somebody. So please, enlighten me as to what I should have done to get out of that situation. I'll share how I finally did it. After I came home to an eviction notice on the door because my roommate decided to steal the rent, I moved back home at the age of 22 I appreciate that you are looking to me for financial advice, and unfortunately since that has A) already passed, which you solved already and B) you are not giving me the complete story and situation, I cannot help you.
I can help with current problems, not past problems that already have been taken care of. What more information do you need to answer a theoretical. My expenses ate up almost of my income, to the point that there were times I had to decide between eating or having clean clothes to wear. People deal with these situations all the time now. Being told to save money, or get a new job, or move where conditions are better are not real answers. Yet this is what is often suggested. This is why it can be very difficult to better your situation. You can't really plan for tomorrow when you aren't making it today.
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Server: Shiva
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Posts: 3618
By Shiva.Onorgul 2015-04-22 15:49:50
What more information do you need to answer a theoretical. My expenses ate up almost of my income, to the point that there were times I had to decide between eating or having clean clothes to wear. People deal with these situations all the time now. Being told to save money, or get a new job, or move where conditions are better are not real answers. Yet this is what is often suggested. This is why it can be very difficult to better your situation. You can't really plan for tomorrow when you aren't making it today. Well, instead of buying food and vidja games and all that other frivolous stuff, obviously you should've gotten some lipstick, tasteful knee pads, and a short skirt so you could blow guys for 50 cents a pop down by the steel mill in between the shifts you were working. Bootstrap your way to success, one *** at a time!
Also, I don't know if you're male or female and that fact would be 100% irrelevant to my above advice, just before you mention.
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Leviathan.Chaosx
Server: Leviathan
Game: FFXI
Posts: 20284
By Leviathan.Chaosx 2015-04-22 15:52:46
Actually liberal polices are what causes entities to become bankrupt. When you keep believing that you are entitled to more and more things, the price goes up, and more and more people's wants turn into needs.
The best example is Social Security. Where's the incentive to save up for when you get older? Just borrow from the next generation. Let them worry about it.
By fonewear 2015-04-22 16:02:19
Actually liberal polices are what causes entities to become bankrupt. When you keep believing that you are entitled to more and more things, the price goes up, and more and more people's wants turn into needs.
The best example is Social Security. Where's the incentive to save up for when you get older? Just borrow from the next generation. Let them worry about it.
But but old people !
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Server: Sylph
Game: FFXI
Posts: 765
By Sylph.Kuwoobie 2015-04-22 16:02:57
Actually liberal polices are what causes entities to become bankrupt. When you keep believing that you are entitled to more and more things, the price goes up, and more and more people's wants turn into needs.
The best example is Social Security. Where's the incentive to save up for when you get older? Just borrow from the next generation. Let them worry about it.
Yeah. Let's go back to the dark ages. Unless people are living in a third world country they are "entitled."
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By fonewear 2015-04-22 16:03:37
Actually liberal polices are what causes entities to become bankrupt. When you keep believing that you are entitled to more and more things, the price goes up, and more and more people's wants turn into needs.
The best example is Social Security. Where's the incentive to save up for when you get older? Just borrow from the next generation. Let them worry about it.
Yeah. Let's go back to the dark ages. Unless people are living in a third world country they are "entitled."
Dark ages you mean 2008 ? Sub prime mortgages government bailing out GM high unemployment rate etc
A young community organizer with hope some dreams and a father he never met !
Server: Asura
Game: FFXI
Posts: 34187
By Asura.Kingnobody 2015-04-22 16:12:08
My point is, learn to manage your money better. Not everyone has the luxury of having the spare money.
I've worked paycheck to paycheck, it blows, it's also why I went back to school, and while that's helped some, I just have more bills to pay. Maybe you should realize that managing money helps create spare money. You know, instead of buying the latest/greatest gadget, you actually save up to buy that home you want or that car instead of borrowing money to pay for it. Those little costs add up quickly.
But I wouldn't expect you to understand that. That requires responsibility, something you shown you don't have. What would you recommend for the situation I was in back in the mid 90's? I was making 4.35/hour, about 35 hours a week in fast food. After putting aside money for rent and student loans, I was able to put about $20 in my pocket each week. That $20 had to cover all other expenses, like food and laundry. I had no car, and used a pay phone if I had to get in contact with somebody. So please, enlighten me as to what I should have done to get out of that situation. I'll share how I finally did it. After I came home to an eviction notice on the door because my roommate decided to steal the rent, I moved back home at the age of 22 I appreciate that you are looking to me for financial advice, and unfortunately since that has A) already passed, which you solved already and B) you are not giving me the complete story and situation, I cannot help you.
I can help with current problems, not past problems that already have been taken care of. What more information do you need to answer a theoretical. My expenses ate up almost of my income, to the point that there were times I had to decide between eating or having clean clothes to wear. People deal with these situations all the time now. Being told to save money, or get a new job, or move where conditions are better are not real answers. Yet this is what is often suggested. This is why it can be very difficult to better your situation. You can't really plan for tomorrow when you aren't making it today. Because every situation is different, but it generally falls back to the same answers which you already gave.
As for your theoretical, all it would take is a budget and sticking to it. In order for a budget to happen, one would have to know all income and expenses, present and future. But regardless of the event, it's passed anyway, so no matter what answer I can give you, it wouldn't effect you one bit.
Server: Lakshmi
Game: FFXI
Posts: 10394
By Lakshmi.Sparthosx 2015-04-22 16:24:10
My point is, learn to manage your money better.
I'm buying up morgan silver dollars!
amIdoin'itright?
Got me some REAL WTC Silver Dollars.
Because nothing evokes the spirit of 9/11 than profiteering.
Server: Lakshmi
Game: FFXI
Posts: 10394
By Lakshmi.Sparthosx 2015-04-22 16:26:13
Actually liberal polices are what causes entities to become bankrupt. When you keep believing that you are entitled to more and more things, the price goes up, and more and more people's wants turn into needs.
The best example is Social Security. Where's the incentive to save up for when you get older? Just borrow from the next generation. Let them worry about it.
Nearly 50% of Americans have no savings. Let that soak in real quick.
By fonewear 2015-04-22 16:33:06
Lakshmi.Sparthosx said: »My point is, learn to manage your money better.
I'm buying up morgan silver dollars!
amIdoin'itright?
Got me some REAL WTC Silver Dollars.
Because nothing evokes the spirit of 9/11 than profiteering.
That's nothing I got the blood of the infidels from the ISIS shopping network !
Fight in the cause of Allah those who fight you, but do not transgress limits; for Allah loveth not transgressors. And kill them wherever you find them, and drive them out from whence they drove you out, and persecution is severer than slaughter, and do not fight with them at the Sacred Mosque until they fight with you in it, but if they do fight you, then slay them; such is the recompense of the unbelievers.
By fonewear 2015-04-22 16:36:39
Lakshmi.Sparthosx said: »Actually liberal polices are what causes entities to become bankrupt. When you keep believing that you are entitled to more and more things, the price goes up, and more and more people's wants turn into needs.
The best example is Social Security. Where's the incentive to save up for when you get older? Just borrow from the next generation. Let them worry about it.
Nearly 50% of Americans have no savings. Let that soak in real quick.
Yea but you can get a Native American to give you a loan !
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Server: Lakshmi
Game: FFXI
Posts: 10394
By Lakshmi.Sparthosx 2015-04-22 16:39:22
It's the Native American way. Like this gem:
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By fonewear 2015-04-22 16:40:28
You are forgetting the Obama coins !
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Server: Asura
Game: FFXI
Posts: 34187
By Asura.Kingnobody 2015-04-22 16:40:47
Lakshmi.Sparthosx said: »Actually liberal polices are what causes entities to become bankrupt. When you keep believing that you are entitled to more and more things, the price goes up, and more and more people's wants turn into needs.
The best example is Social Security. Where's the incentive to save up for when you get older? Just borrow from the next generation. Let them worry about it.
Nearly 50% of Americans have no savings. Let that soak in real quick. Nearly 50% of Americans pay no income tax. Let that soak up too while you are at it.
Server: Lakshmi
Game: FFXI
Posts: 10394
By Lakshmi.Sparthosx 2015-04-22 16:41:35
Lakshmi.Sparthosx said: »Actually liberal polices are what causes entities to become bankrupt. When you keep believing that you are entitled to more and more things, the price goes up, and more and more people's wants turn into needs.
The best example is Social Security. Where's the incentive to save up for when you get older? Just borrow from the next generation. Let them worry about it.
Nearly 50% of Americans have no savings. Let that soak in real quick. Nearly 50% of Americans pay no income tax. Let that soak up too while you are at it.
*soaking intensifies*
Americans are spending $153 billion a year to subsidize McDonald’s and Wal-Mart’s low wage workers
The Washington post
And because its behind a paywall....
Quote: The low wages paid by businesses, including some of the largest and most profitable companies in the U.S. – like McDonald’s and Wal-Mart – are costing taxpayers nearly $153 billion a year.
After decades of wage cuts and health benefit rollbacks, more than half of all state and federal spending on public assistance programs goes to working families who need food stamps, Medicaid, or other support to meet basic needs. Let that sink in — American taxpayers are subsidizing people who work — most of them full-time (in some case more than full-time) because businesses do not pay a living wage.
Workers like Terrence Wise, a 35-year-old father who works part-time at McDonald’s and Burger King in Kansas City, Mo., and his fiancée Myosha Johnson, a home care worker, are among millions of families in the U.S. who work an average of 38 hours per week but still rely on public assistance. Wise is paid $8.50 an hour at his McDonald’s job and $9 an hour at Burger King. Johnson is paid just above $10 an hour, even after a decade in her field. Wise and Johnson together rely on $240 a month in food stamps to feed their three kids, a cost borne by taxpayers.
The problem of low wages and the accompanying public cost extends far beyond the fast-food industry. Forty-eight percent of home care workers rely on public assistance. In child care, it’s 46 percent. Among part-time college faculty—some of the most highly educated workers in the country—it’s 25 percent.
Ebony Hughes is paid $7.50 an hour as a home care worker in Durham, N.C., and has a second job at a local KFC. While the home care industry has the fastest growing number of jobs in America, these workers are some of the lowest paid in the country – earning, on average, $13,000 a year. To get enough hours to pay the bills, Hughes works from 6 a.m. to 11 p.m. But she and her daughter still rely on public assistance to make ends meet.
UC Berkeley’s Center for Labor Research and Education, which I chair, has analyzed state spending for Medicaid/Children’s Health Insurance Program and Temporary Assistance for Needy Families, and federal spending for those programs as well as food stamps and the Earned Income Tax Credit.
We found that, on average, 52 percent of state public assistance spending supports working families (defined as working for at least 26 weeks a year and 10 hours a week) – with costs as high as $3.7 billion in California, $3.3 billion in New York, and $2 billion in Texas.
In recent months, the substantial public cost of low wages has prompted elected officials to take action. Legislators in California, Colorado, Maine, Oregon, and Washington are considering increasing the minimum wage to $12 an hour. In Connecticut, a proposal currently moving through the state legislature would fine large companies that pay low wages in an effort to recoup the costs imposed on taxpayers.
When 73 percent of people who benefit from major public assistance programs live in a working family, our economy isn’t operating the way it should – and could – be. From 2003-2013, inflation-adjusted wages fell for the entire bottom 70 percent of the workforce. Over the same time period we have also seen a large decline in the share of Americans with job-based health coverage.
Today – on Tax Day – underpaid workers are striking and protesting in cities across the country and around the globe to call for $15 an hour and the right to form a union. Their success would increase family incomes for tens of millions of adjunct professors, fast-food, home care and child care workers, among other underpaid workers. Raising wages would also generate significant savings to state and federal governments, and allow them to better target how our tax dollars are used.
Public assistance programs provide a vital support system for American families. But when Americans like Wise, Johnson and Hughes are working as hard as they can and are still paid too little to get by without public support, we need action to raise wages. On Tax Day it is a good time to take a hard look at the high public cost of low wages in the United States.
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