Is Religion Causing Unequal Pay Among Women?

I think they factor in length of time at the job as well. I'll see if I can find the law.

you can't pay a woman less for being a woman, but you can pay a person (who can happen to be of the opposite sex) less for the same job for being less experienced/skilled for the job.

If the woman comes up to the employer asking "why do i get paid less than him?", the employer can't go "because you're a woman", but the employer can say "because he has 7 years of experience and you dont".

The employer can very well pay you less for being a lady, but he'll never tell you that and there's always plenty of other reasoning he can give to argue the difference of pay. It's a bit pointless really.

Source

This. Great Odin's Raven, THIS.

Even before I met my wife, I don't know if I was ever attracted to a woman who wasn't insultingly labeled a "tom boy". Any girl I actively pursued in my life was always outside the realm of "traditional" girls.

What the hell is the point in dating or marrying women with whom you have nothing in common? I don't care how hot she is. Even if she's intelligent too. If you can't do anything fun with her (OTHER than the obvious...) then you're just wasting your time.

(For the record, my wife's a forensic scientists and does make more than me, though the difference is minor)

All just my opinion, obviously.

What I'm saying is, those of you having children, let them be who they want to be.

I'm going to start giving my child Lego bricks when she's old enough, start tossing out some of the doll ***. She's a bit too young to play with them all now, she has some blocks, but nothing like building blocks.

If I had a daughter she would tell us to ban the word bossy...while at the same time being bossy ? Wait what ?

Sounds like my mom as a kid.

Honestly, I'm wondering if even this is necessarily a "problem". Is it really a problem that society (generally) encourages one set of people to act a certain way and another to act another way as long as you're free to do something else with your life?

It is a fact that women in the same profession as men make on average nearly the same amount, so there's nothing I can see that supports the idea women are discriminated against when they seek to do something different with their lives.

It's just that career ends up being a harder decision for women because they have to decide at some point whether to put their career on hold to have children or to just keep on going. Until ex vivo pregnancy is invented there's really nothing that can be done (well, you could adopt, but it seems like a lot of powerful/successful women arn't interested in that. Not so immune to those biological influences after all, I guess?)

Frankly, in my opinion, all children regardless of gender should get Legos and Recorders (the instrument) as early as they can manage to use them. Creativity in the arts and structure have been consistently shown to make smarter, more successful children.

Yet somehow schools keep cutting fundings to the arts, but keeping the football programs.

Don't get me wrong; physical fitness needs a focus too, but it's pointless if we've got a nation of underachieving meatheads.

Just don't for got those new legos 'aimed' for girls. Ridiculous to say the least.

Lego Bricks is the proper plural form, you guys are being like nails on a chalkboard right now...

We have a nation of underachieving meatheads, lol...

Oh Archie Bunker...

wouldn't dare, she'll be getting Star Wars Lego bricks when she's old enough.

Maybe I'm wrong, but I'm guessing you don't have a lot of experience with anyone -- male or female -- that was given gender-specific toys they resented.

It is a problem. If nothing else than because, in the grand scheme, if you buck your gender-assigned role, people treat you like you're bizarre, or weird.

You should see the ***my wife goes through because she's 1) a scientist and 2) not having children.

She gets constantly condescended to by others (not so much in the profession, but outside of it) and other women (even those IN the profession) treat her like some sort of pariah at times because they simply can't fathom not wanting to be "mommy".

Oh for ***'s sake. That's like the new pink-themed Nerf weapons weapons that are all bows and crossbows now thanks to The Hunger Games, but they can't just be good for any kid.

They've GOT to be PINK for GIRLS because GIRLS like PINK.

1. "Legos" are "Legos" because they are for children, and no child primly says, "Father, mother, I am going to go and create with my Lego bricks". Ok, very few children say that. My brother probably did, actually, because he was a little *** at that age. But yeah. You give a kid a Lego set for Christmas, they excitedly exclaim, "LEGOS!"

So they're Legos.

2. While I can appreciate a reference to young Rob Reiner, it wasn't quite what I had in mind. @.@

I'm sorry, I don't consider it either "for children" or just because something is a popular use, it being "right"

Lego is a trademarked brand name and the proper plural form is "Lego Bricks"

I always have referred to it as "Lego" as singular and plural.

I know a bunch of children that said "underwears" it still doesn't make it right.

I know grown adults that say "deers" and just the same.

I'd think the problem here is not gender specific toys, but parents/whoever didn't acknowledge the fact that their child did not enjoy the toys they were given? I could be thinking too shallow. but i don't know.

Gender specific is just a marketing label or a human perception under the current culture and norms. There is no reason why you can't give a pink "girly" toy to a boy and some "boy" toy to a girl. I personally was grew up with logical/lego/computer games and I have a colleague who grew up playing my little pony. We're both in the computing industry.

Sometimes it seems to me that parents are blaming their way of raising their kids by what marketing is branded as suitable toys to their child. What you give to your child is, at the end of the day, your own decision. If you feel there are valuable skills to be learned from lego but your daughter(or son!) wouldn't touch anything that is not pink, pink lego might be a good solution.

Are you really free though? From the moment you're conscious you're already taking in ideas of what you should be and what society expects of you. In the case of women, being able to break out of girly-girl, damsel-in-distress territory to pursue male fields is seen as not female and actively suppressed. It's not too different than the parents who take objects out of a left-handed childs hands because right-handed people are the majority.

You are molded by society far before you reach adulthood and can presumably think on your own. Unfortunately that requires a level of introspection that escapes many an adult. Many simply just accept because it's what society demands of you.

Simply ask boomers how their parents felt when women decided to work and quit the homemaking / stay at home wife gig.

Also look at men. From a young age I was expected to be sports-oriented with a flair for aggression that never kicked in. In turn, I was basically that dude who was last to be picked for everything cause I didn't give a ***about sports and in turn came to antagonize the status quo. You're not 'free' to do anything when clearly regimented ideas of what men and women are supposed to do exist, at least not until you achieve a level of critical thinking that escapes tradition.

Gender role pliability is required and has been the scholarly pursuit of feminists before the term became a call to arms for zealots on both ends.

@Jet

Yes, yes. I forgot your wording obsession.

...you're doing worlds of good for my perspective. This might be what other people feel like talking to me.

You're pretty much just wrapping everything up into one package. It's all a problem. The marketing, the imposed gender roles, the way parents treat children in respect to their genders. It's all a big perpetual cycle.

Luckily you do have some parents breaking out of that now, and hopefully that trend continues.

Gender-reinforcement behavior debates always discuss how girls aren't encouraged to learn calculus or play football, but so rarely do they touch on the poisonous crap we cram into boys' heads. I'll admit that we culturally are doing a greater disservice to growing girls, so there's a reason for the disparity, but in an effort to point out the opposite side of the coin, I'll cite a favorite song by a favorite singer (set to a cute animation).



It's the subtle stuff that is the problem. Pink toys are not. Many girls simply do like pink. Hell, so do many boys. When I was 6, I picked out a heavy winter coat with a neon pink triangle on it (oh dear, '80s) and was quite fond of it. I wouldn't say pink was my favorite color or even in the top 10 (I've favored green since I was verbal), but my parents were smart enough not to make a big deal.

On the other hand, though, they have spent years quietly hinting that one of their three sons should produce offspring.

Reminds me of when I went to Japan when I was little. I wanted the red shirt, but the guy insisted that blue was for boys and red for girls. He wouldn't sell it to me.

This is a pet peeve, sorry.

It's the official language from Lego themselves, and as a really big fan (obviously since still in my 20's I will purchase it, but rarely as it's expensive, and no MegaBlocks are not the same thing...)

I went as far as to look it up, it's official, don't get mad at me...

I'd further run on a gaming tangent cause well... you're all nerds. Anecdotal evidence ahoy!

Video games are considered a 'male' hobby primarily because why would a girl want to slay dragons, platform through strange new worlds, drive fast cars or defeat a giant Moogle king? Girls instead want to cook, clean and hyperventilate over anything and everything. Why? Because that's the female way. *citation needed*

If you internalize this idea as a woman in turn you'll never actually come to try/like gaming because you've already been duped into an unsubstantiated and baseless ideal cultivated by our collective ignorance. But are video games really for men? The primary demographic way back when games were new were basically 'failed' men. Men who couldn't cut the social mustard and thus had to relegate themselves to fantasy worlds of swords and sorcery because they couldn't compete with 'real' men off building ***with their teeth, sawing off damaged arms and *** people up for breakfast.

(Even today this holds true. It is slowly changing as video games are accepted as an artform but look at genres to see how these gender standards affect what you/others play.)

Sports games? Acceptable. SPORTS *** YEAH.
Fighting games? Acceptable. *** that *** up.
Platformers? Mindless fun. Kids games though.
RPGs? Holy *** looooooooooooser.
Adventure? The only adventure is *** people up.
Shooters? Wholly embraced, hurrah!
Puzzle? Mindless fun. Too much thinking though.

In turn, gamers were(still are?) the runoff of society. The few women who clung to the subculture were in turn also seen as rejects yet aren't seen as equal in gamer culture. Why? Because failed men often antagonize women for not being accepted by social status quo.

It does work both ways, absolutely. I played multiple sports in which I really had no active interest because it's what I was supposed to do. I was *** all terrible at them. The one major sport I did like (hockey) wasn't offered in the small area in which I lived, and things like lacross, the various winter sports, etc. were just not options at all.

The thing was, I never had any friends on those sports teams because all the other guys there knew I obviously didn't care that much, wasn't any good, and had little in common with them. They wanted nothing to do with me.

In retrospect, it's actually both hillarious and sad how much ***I took for enjoying the things I liked that are now huge; fantasy (specifically, LotR), comics, alternate sports. Additionally, I enjoyed cooking and the various crafts my mother was frequently into. I eventually found a place for myself with the band kids.

And I was just in the middle of the two, never really getting into any of the classically "feminine" interests. I'd say I can't imagine the life of a boy actively interested in those, but sadly I can, because I did have one friend who was. It was hell for him.

Hah. I know, I know. I'll also entertain the idea of buying them frequently, though I rarely do as I've nowhere to put them (I do still have my Lego Slave I on a bookshelf).

And yeah. MegaBlocks suck. They'll do in a pinch. But they suck.

Damn near indestructible pieces of plastic :D

This point is a big one for me.* Female gamers/readers "geeks" for lack of a better term, take so much *** *** from males of the group. And that's utter *** ***. There is so much shaming about cosplay if you're not "hot", but if you are hot, you get shamed for "not being a real geek"!

You'd think a group of people who, if they're my age, grew up ostricized and rejected for their interests would have some modicum of *** empathy and understanding. Instead far, far too many (as if even one weren't too many) just gleefully embrace the opportunity to be the aggressor and victimize someone else to get their jollies.

It's *** despicable.

*Edit: obviously it's a big one for me, you've extrapolated this already if you've read my prior posts given that I'm married to a scientist and fervently encouraged marrying people with similar interests beyond sex.

And yet the best times I've had in MMOs have been with women owing to that whole cultural programming of cooperating instead of stamping on one another's necks for a Cloudsong or Defending Ring or whatever.

The real problem with trying to address this stuff is that a lot of it is not necessarily bad, but generally taken to extremes. Like, say, completely losing your ***in a game of Plants vs. Zombies: Penny Arcade - Incongruity.

I have a thing for one of the female cosplayers on the site actually, most probably wouldn't consider her "hot" but I find her delectable :D

(not saying who).

I am guilty of this. You should have heard me back in the days competing for pops for HNMs, VNMs, Empy mobs in Abyssea...pretty much everything up through now that they've instanced things. I've gotten much better with age.

But I try to explain to people why I avoid competitive situations. It's because I am too competitive and I don't like the *** that I turn into.