IiPunch - Monk Guide

I think that when you're comparing equipment piece by piece, you want to know if you should stack def gears or PDT instead.
So let's take your example : You take 4 dmg per hit, 25% PDT makes it 3 and 50% PDT makes it 2. 1/3 = 33.33% so what you want to know is : after 25% PDT gears, can I find enough defensive gears that would enable me to add more than 33.33% dmg reduction counting from 3 and not 4.

No lol. You want to know if the defense will reduce less than 1/4 of the mob hits or not. You'll never consider the 33%.

If a mob hits you for 1000
Wether you are at 49% pdt or 0% pdt, adding 1% pdt with reduce the damage taken by 10 HP. There fore you will ask yourself the following question :

"How much defense do I need to beat 10 HP." (in both cases)

You will not ask yourself

"How much defense do I need to reduce my damage taken by 1%" (in case you go from 0% pdt to 1% pdt)
or
"How much defense do I need to reduce my damage taken by 2%" (in case you go from 49% pdt to 50% pdt)


simple

While -PDT is simple and does not factor in stuff like attack, defense and damage, isn't attack a bit less predictable?

Two mobs that hit for the same damage could be doing so for entirely different reasons, one having higher damage, but poor attack; another having lower damage, but capped attack.

Pretty sure this was something to consider at one point, but maybe not so much now?

If the mob hits you for 1000 damage, and you want to reduce that by 10 using defense, you'd increase your defense such that damage was reduced by 1%. That would require about a 1% increase in defense.

Now, add in 25% PDT. You're now getting hit for 750 without that defense increase. Another +1% PDT reduces damage taken to 740, or another -10 damage. However increasing defense by 1% does -not- reduce damage by 10 points now; it reduces damage by 7.5 points. In order to reduce damage by 10 points, you need to increase defense by 1.33%.


If you work from the other direction first, you could say you want to increase defense by 1%, and see how much PDT is required to reduce damage by the same amount. With no PDT, 1% defense reduces damage by 10 points, and you can get that with 1% PDT. With an existing 25% PDT, however, 1% defense reduces damage by 7.5 points, and you'd need just 0.75% PDT to do the same thing.


And all of that is mixed with the fact that "1% defense" isn't a fixed value. We need to decide how much defense we're starting with in order to figure out how much -additional- defense is needed to qualify for that 1% value.


So:

1) A fixed quantity of defense has decreasing value as you consider builds with higher starting defense.

2) A fixed quantity of PDT has increasing value (relative to defense) as you consider builds with higher starting PDT.


We are comparing gear with fixed quantities of the above stats, and thus need to consider both factors when comparing piece A with piece B, so that we can put them into a common frame that actually allows determination of which is the better option.

Stupid body question. Which body piece should I use for Shijin? I can't seem to get into a good enough Pil group (no1 does it anymore) and the others wipe. I have access to AF, AF2, AF3, Loki's Kaftan, Kirin's Osode.

Manibozho after next update

DEF:93 HP+31 MP+37
STR+11 DEX+15 VIT+16 AGI+15 INT+15 MND+15 CHR+15
Accuracy+17 Attack+17
Evasion+25 Magic Evasion+45 Magic Defense+3
Haste+4%

good news for me since mine is rank 15 already

Probably either Loki's or Kirin's, depending on the rest of your set. Shoot for the Manibozho Jerkin though. It's getting some STR added to it next month and has high amounts of DEX, Attack, and Accuracy (which you can see in Tiger's post above).

Is it worth it anymore to have an Impetus up set with AF3 body, or just full-time the optimal TP sets?

I carry around an Impetus set but only swap to it when I have a good "chain" going. I'll swap back to a Thaumas TP set if I miss an auto attack and go back to AF3 when I get a chain going again. Whether it's *worth* carrying around or not, though, I dunno. :3

french math is just different

According to Motenten's spreadsheets, using Tantra +2 during Impetus is 20~ DPS better than using Thaumas. So as long as your Acc is capped (which it would be reasonable that your group is prepared for w/e event your doing to give proper buffs), Keeping Tantra body on when Impetus up is the way to go, according to Spreadsheet. Some would say they macro it in in later, I personally use it right away with Imp up its a preference kinda thing. But it is better, you're Crit Damage and Rate will climb up quite rapidly and if your fighting Mata, you should see 80,000~90,000 hits as long as you don't miss with Rigors

to change the subject from the french math, this is winning over every other set (pre-update stats) on Tojil on the spreadsheet:

ItemSet 308850

Letalis for accuracy, etc

Note that this only works if you manually add in the 1% Ionis haste. If you aren't in Adoulin or don't have Ionis, then you have to swap to Manibozho boots. R15 Manibozho boots is about 9 DPS lower.

I see you switched from mpk-lessongiver-drg to mnk. In all seriousness, ppl need to stop using the spreadsheet blindly and think more about their survivability. Considering that I've cleared 4/5 NMs as 6 with time to spare, the tojil zone is overkill... I wonder who will 6 man tojil first, granted it won't be us and unfortunately it won't be french as I quit 1 month ago ! If anyone want I can give 6-man strats for all the 5x outside morimar NMs.

I'm horrible with time zones: is France that far behind the rest of the world? None of those have been difficult to 6-man for quite some time

Can't wait to see the all-MNK/WHM/BRD 6-man Tojil attempt

Sure I will bite after next months update I am sure low manning is in the future....

Worth it.

Tojil's stats in the spreadsheet last time I checked were really borked, 150VIT/AGI are "you've got to be kidding me" level for Tojil. Try 195.

I've been using 170. You rly think his VIT/AGI are that high ?

Peiste has ~175VIT which is a 30 jump from Raptor (~145) so it woud really surprise me if Tojil's VIT is <180.

This doesnt mean anything as the raptor seems overpowered. Higher attack than most stuff, HELP I AM TRAPPED IN 2006 PLEASE SEND A TIME MACHINE evasion etc. Also harder to tank than anything else including bosses. Also no me and mdk are the only ppl doing delve 6 man and im not talking about tier 1.

Why would the raptor, being "overpowered", having 30 less VIT than an NM, presumably not "overpowered", invalidate the possibility of a delve naakual having higher stats than either of them?

I have no useful data on Tojil to extrapolate any meaningful vit.

I do have some rough estimates I could make on the shark, though.

Using:
Taru mnk/war base = 98
Sushi = 6
Minuets = 10 to 15
Gear = ~26-33 (depending on exact gear set)

Total str: 140-152

Skill base damage: 48+3 = 51
Oatixur: +146

Total base damage = 197


Estimated observable base damage (sample size makes it difficult to be sure on this): 184

fStr: -13

Weapon rank: 16

-13 fStr is within valid range.

dStr for -13 fStr: about -76

Implied vit: 216-228

Setting it at 220 would not be out of line with expectations. However it would be nice if someone would eventually do a real test with a pup's Sharpshot frame.

Do you have the sample of melee non crit and melee crits as well as shijin sample ? Because then it's really easy to reverse it to determine the base damage using the average pdif formulae that I computed. Those look like (from my pdif page on wikipedia):

average non crit melee (m, r=ratio)
r ≤ 0.5 m = .2182870370+.3796296294*r+.7592592591*r^2
0.5 ≤ r < 0.75 m=-.0822530866+1.676697531*r-.6327160494*r^2
0.75 ≤ r ≤ 1.25 m = .2024691355+.8225308644*r
1.25 < r ≤ 1.5 m=1.309722223-.8541666666*r+.6327160494*r^2
1.5 < r ≤ 2.25 m=-.2562500002+1.138888889*r

average crit melee (mc, r=ratio)
r ≤ 0.5 mc = 1.338194445+.5694444444*r
0.5 ≤ r < 0.75 mc=1.338194444+.5694444444*r
0.75 ≤ r ≤ 1.25 mc = .9111111111+1.138888889*r
1.25 < r ≤ 1.5 mc=1.622916667+.5694444444*r
1.5 < r ≤ 1.65 mc=.7687499999+1.138888889*r
1.65 < r ≤ 2.25 mc=-1.298333333+3.644444444*r-.7592592593*r^2

The max/min damage method is not reliable but math based on averaged value is statistically consistent. Knowing average damage on crit and non crit should give both ratio(r) and damage, and then fstr. Shijin is multi noncrits hits too so if you know your dex you can confirm the numbers.

It's much easier to just use PUP because you can get an exact value for VIT after two data points with literally 0 estimation. The only reason I use ~ for the VIT values I list is because I didn't test odd/even auto STR.

The only issue is it has to not be in piercing phase, and it has to be during Bolster (probably? Maybe not since Auto caps attack on Peiste easily without defense debuffs) so timing is a bit of a downer.

Impetus up once update hits? Imagine that the Hands have the new stats.
ItemSet 180754

Gonna also replace tantra cyclas for ascetics fury then too.

Idk the pup method but considering almost no endgame mob have their vit accurately known I'd say it's nearly impossible to implement. Noone bring pup to anything, tojil can't be access on the test server and the pupet dies after 0.5 hits ? Also it require tp so yeah... Anyway I remember downing ig-alimas' stats with like a dozen of hits.

Where do those hands rank in the handslot for the optimal Set posted on Page 1?

I guess new hand order will be: ★Hand equipment hierarchy: Tenryu +1 > Manibozho Gloves (A Path, Minimum Rank...?) > Miodio Gloves > Nomkahpa Mitts > Brego Gloves > Omodaka Gote ?