Gaol: Unplayable Content Because Of Lag
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Gaol: Unplayable content because of lag
R20 seem be full rank augments right now, with no evidence of pieces going above that yet.
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Lakshmi.Buukki said: » SimonSes said: » Lakshmi.Buukki said: » endxen said: » It seriously will take a year, yes you read that right "a year" to fully RP the augments for one gear set. It's a ridiculous grind but it is what it is... Probably not exactly a year for someone who stays on top of 6k segments daily and gets dragged into V15s constantly without expending his own segments to farm up, but that's going to be a very small minority. The average player will take them a year if they don't give up by then. We are talking about Rank 20? or Rank 30 that so far only exist in dats? Full rank augments, unless they change the, so R30. There is an update this coming month, so maybe they scale it down or up, or adjust RP. I have capped one piece of Odyssey gear to R20 from a T1, and even with a build-up of about 60k segments at launch, it still took me well over a month to cap. That includes learning the fights, deaths, using segments for other clears, etc. Knowing what I know right now, it would be quicker and less wasted points, but any average player right now saying they want to get into Gaol with 0 segments, 0 progress, and 0 ability to skip tiers, assuming they can even beat V15 A3s, it's going to take a whole lot longer to R20 5 pieces of gear from the highest Atonement, let alone R30. A year doesn't sound like much of an exaggeration at all. This also assumes they know exactly what they are doing to make progress and stay on top of 6k+ segments daily, which is already next to impossible for an average player to accomplish (cuz RL) I have been trying to farm my segments everyday on 4 chars while not bringing more than 2-3 chars at a time... It's tooooooo much odysseyyyyyy. The KI lockout, along with the long queues on Asura, along with the inconsistency in farming with shout groups (in a bad/unlucky group I get 3.5k segments, in a good group I get 6k), makes this a giant chore. Lakshmi.Buukki said: » SimonSes said: » Lakshmi.Buukki said: » endxen said: » It seriously will take a year, yes you read that right "a year" to fully RP the augments for one gear set. It's a ridiculous grind but it is what it is... Probably not exactly a year for someone who stays on top of 6k segments daily and gets dragged into V15s constantly without expending his own segments to farm up, but that's going to be a very small minority. The average player will take them a year if they don't give up by then. We are talking about Rank 20? or Rank 30 that so far only exist in dats? Full rank augments, unless they change the, so R30. There is an update this coming month, so maybe they scale it down or up, or adjust RP. I have capped one piece of Odyssey gear to R20 from a T1, and even with a build-up of about 60k segments at launch, it still took me well over a month to cap. That includes learning the fights, deaths, using segments for other clears, etc. Knowing what I know right now, it would be quicker and less wasted points, but any average player right now saying they want to get into Gaol with 0 segments, 0 progress, and 0 ability to skip tiers, assuming they can even beat V15 A3s, it's going to take a whole lot longer to R20 5 pieces of gear from the highest Atonement, let alone R30. A year doesn't sound like much of an exaggeration at all. This also assumes they know exactly what they are doing to make progress and stay on top of 6k+ segments daily, which is already next to impossible for an average player to accomplish (cuz RL) Rank 20 is 32 or 33 V15 so with 6k segment per day, thats 17 days, but I havent heard about 6k runs being standard, more like 4.5k, so lets put that at 22 days. V30 would be similar amount of V25, but once again rank 20 was only datamined and I havent heard anyone was able to unlock V20, so I have no reason to assume thats anything Rank 20 is actually available in game. So for now its around 110 days per set to rank 20, if you do it every day. So realistically more like a 4-6 months, not a year.
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Are you including all of the prep work required to build the V+ access to even be able to earn max RP per fight on your own, or just considering the person entering only V15 T3s from the start? I mentioned all of those factors that will take time in my post, though harder to quantify.
people complaining about the "grind" of a year for completing one set have completely missed the boat here.
1. 6k segment runs are quite doable with a stable group vs pickup or multiboxing. Yes, they're the high end, but after a few weeks of running with the same people, learning each others' tendencies, and being mindful during the run of things to learn for the future (good/bad families for your group, pulling tactics, etc) it can easily be the goal for every Segment farming you do. 2. Everyone's looking for some cheese method or multibox method vs just going into Sheol:C with a group of friends and slaughtering ***like an old KRT Bones EXP party back in the 75 days. Constant roaming, fast-paced, and over in 30 minutes. 70 if you save your moglophones for back-to-back segment farming. Just quit trying to game the system and get in there, pay attention to what works and what doesn't, and kill stuff. 3. Sure, RP'ing is going to take a helluva lot of time. But if you're still spending Mars Orbs hoping for that Dagon Breastplate or Shamash Robe, don't whine about a grind of a year. You're still spending time in game to earn Silver Vouchers in hopes for 6 year old content drops. 4. No, its not pickup friendly. ANY aspect of it. But it is flexible. Got 3 friends but can't form a full party? There's a place for that style using 2 trusts. Will you progress as fast as a stable 6-man group? Probably not, but they said before Gaol was even released that the rewards were designed to be greater for those who attempt higher challenges. 5. Its the most predictable gil earning I have in game right now by a long shot. Seeing about 4.5-5mil weekly earned from the segment farmings just in the game giving me gil, not selling ***, not needing a buyer....just doing the content. That plus a single gain-EXP dump of sparks means I can buy a piece of Atonement3 armor every week and never miss the gil. In many ways, its a throwback to when Omen was first released- a single party content with a lot of new mechanics, new fights, time gated, and fast-paced. Don't look at Omen as the monstrosity of AFK that it morphed into when it became Alliance content, and don't view it as Omen post the addition of Swart where its just solo farming. Its a good thing for the health of the game to have long-term content for soloing, single-party, and alliances. Embrace it. Get some friends together, have a few laughs, and get some good stuff at the same time without having to deal with the RNG monster doling out drops with no relevance to time spent. The RP grind seem impossible? Oh well- at least over half of the gear is exceedingly useful even at base level (I will agree the mage sets don't feel like anything special until augments creep up).
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Leviathan.Celebrindal said: » people complaining about the "grind" of a year for completing one set have completely missed the boat here. 1. 6k segment runs are quite doable with a stable group vs pickup or multiboxing. Yes, they're the high end, but after a few weeks of running with the same people, learning each others' tendencies, and being mindful during the run of things to learn for the future (good/bad families for your group, pulling tactics, etc) it can easily be the goal for every Segment farming you do. 2. Everyone's looking for some cheese method or multibox method vs just going into Sheol:C with a group of friends and slaughtering ***like an old KRT Bones EXP party back in the 75 days. Constant roaming, fast-paced, and over in 30 minutes. 70 if you save your moglophones for back-to-back segment farming. Just quit trying to game the system and get in there, pay attention to what works and what doesn't, and kill stuff. 3. Sure, RP'ing is going to take a helluva lot of time. But if you're still spending Mars Orbs hoping for that Dagon Breastplate or Shamash Robe, don't whine about a grind of a year. You're still spending time in game to earn Silver Vouchers in hopes for 6 year old content drops. 4. No, its not pickup friendly. ANY aspect of it. But it is flexible. Got 3 friends but can't form a full party? There's a place for that style using 2 trusts. Will you progress as fast as a stable 6-man group? Probably not, but they said before Gaol was even released that the rewards were designed to be greater for those who attempt higher challenges. 5. Its the most predictable gil earning I have in game right now by a long shot. Seeing about 4.5-5mil weekly earned from the segment farmings just in the game giving me gil, not selling ***, not needing a buyer....just doing the content. That plus a single gain-EXP dump of sparks means I can buy a piece of Atonement3 armor every week and never miss the gil. In many ways, its a throwback to when Omen was first released- a single party content with a lot of new mechanics, new fights, time gated, and fast-paced. Don't look at Omen as the monstrosity of AFK that it morphed into when it became Alliance content, and don't view it as Omen post the addition of Swart where its just solo farming. Its a good thing for the health of the game to have long-term content for soloing, single-party, and alliances. Embrace it. Get some friends together, have a few laughs, and get some good stuff at the same time without having to deal with the RNG monster doling out drops with no relevance to time spent. The RP grind seem impossible? Oh well- at least over half of the gear is exceedingly useful even at base level (I will agree the mage sets don't feel like anything special until augments creep up). Nicely said. Additionally, everybody is patrolling Rabao looking for that free pass into Kalunga for a clear. It's like yo, it took me and the boys 8 days to get there from scratch. Put in any effort and it's going to be fine. It's an hour at most out of your day. You are going to want the progression anyway if you are going to augment. Just do the damn content, holy smokes.
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Lakshmi.Buukki said: » Are you including all of the prep work required to build the V+ access to even be able to earn max RP per fight on your own, or just considering the person entering only V15 T3s from the start? I mentioned all of those factors that will take time in my post, though harder to quantify. Prep is 20 days if counting 4.5k segments and starting from 0, but its done once. If you have help its 7 days. Leviathan.Celebrindal said: » Everyone's looking for some (...) or multibox method This is the only one that doesnt make sense in your post. If people multibox, then they want RP for all chars to make gear for all chars, so they try to find way to multibox this not for better RP, but to simply get RP on everyone. I mean some people treat mulitboxing like they only bis gear one main char and treat rest like a pleb alts, but (guessing here) most people try to equip every char.
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SimonSes said: » Leviathan.Celebrindal said: » Everyone's looking for some (...) or multibox method This is the only one that doesnt make sense in your post. If people multibox, then they want RP for all chars to make gear for all chars, so they try to find way to multibox this not for better RP, but to simply get RP on everyone. I mean some people treat mulitboxing like they only bis gear one main char and treat rest like a pleb alts, but (guessing here) most people try to equip every char. I have tons of respect for multiboxers, and view what they do as a completely different skillset than what I am capable of in my own gaming. However, at the end of the day even they must admit that by multiboxing, they are attempting to mimic the playing of several real characters, and while imitation may be the sincerest form of flattery- imitation is always a poor man's knockoff of an original. Its not meant to provide as good of an ROI as a party of individuals. And if multiboxers expect to pull the same rewards as a group of individuals, its just not going to happen for the vast majority of them. So be ok that ALL your rewards are going to the same human being even though the per-character return isn't going to match individuals. That was my intent behind my comment. I also notice you specify "so they try to find (sic) a way to multibox that is not better for RP, but simply to get RP on everyone". If that was the mentality I saw in my own experience, I wouldn't have even bothered to mention them in my first post. But instead I see more "well, I can't match that level of segment farming while tri/quad/etc-boxing". SimonSes said: » Lakshmi.Buukki said: » Are you including all of the prep work required to build the V+ access to even be able to earn max RP per fight on your own, or just considering the person entering only V15 T3s from the start? I mentioned all of those factors that will take time in my post, though harder to quantify. Prep is 20 days if counting 4.5k segments and starting from 0, but its done once. If you have help its 7 days. Your math is a little off Simon. 4500 segments/day is 90,000 in 20 days. You spend 3000 Segments per clear, 12000 to V15 clear one A1. 4 NMs. Thats 48,000 for V15 on A1. 72,000 for 6 NMs. Then we assume you only do one path for bosses. another 12,000 segments. You get 3 free KIs at start, so ok around 130k segments to get (let's say Kalunga) V15 access. This is assuming no failures, and you maintain 4500 segments per day. And then you expend the segments (or can find a group to help kill the actual bosses). But whatever, an extra month of farm time to even access the V15 A3 path of your choice. Now look, I don't want to beat a dead horse here, but what endexen said about it taking upwards of a year for an average player is not unrealistic. Certainly people can do it a lot faster, but Gaol just is not really going to be something your average player is going to be able to complete efficiently, so it is a very long(er) grind for them. For someone like you or myself, we do it and understand the mechanics, so it is whatever. Just saying that a person who wanted to get into Gaol and max out these sets, they would probably see how long it takes and mentally psych themselves out before they embark on such a tall task.
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The average player isn't to be able to kill a V15 T3 in the first place, let alone have a group that would be willing to spam just the NM you want. If you can only kill at V5, then that's suddenly almost 200 wins for each piece (assuming you paid for one V15 win just to unlock R20).
The average player would take a lot longer than a year to max out a full set.
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Ok so they drop it to V10 or V5, or they get lucky and get carried on all V15 kills. Whether it takes longer in your example or shorter in Simon's, I was just reiterating what endexen said. Wasn't necessarily disputing either scenario. Just saying, 1 year for a full set maxed was not an unreasonable projection.
Why don't you guys just team up with people?
I'm having no issues forming for Ody on Odin. Odin.Senaki said: » Why don't you guys just team up with people? I'm having no issues forming for Ody on Odin. We do. What makes you think we don't? SimonSes said: » Leviathan.Celebrindal said: » Everyone's looking for some (...) or multibox method This is the only one that doesnt make sense in your post. If people multibox, then they want RP for all chars to make gear for all chars, so they try to find way to multibox this not for better RP, but to simply get RP on everyone. I mean some people treat mulitboxing like they only bis gear one main char and treat rest like a pleb alts, but (guessing here) most people try to equip every char. I used to always joke around that I've spent more gil/time on my mules than I have on my main. Sadly that joke is 100% fact now. endxen said: » Lakshmi.Buukki said: » Ok so they drop it to V10 or V5, or they get lucky and get carried on all V15 kills. Whether it takes longer in your example or shorter in Simon's, I was just reiterating what endexen said. Wasn't necessarily disputing either scenario. Just saying, 1 year for a full set maxed was not an unreasonable projection. There are going to be a lot of variables that fall into this. Things like people not logging on or moving on to other things, sometimes you are going to have bad luck on a run or maybe you get stuck at a certain veng+ level that you can't get past. This is the scenario our group is going to run into when we start the RP grind. We have a solid 5-6 person group all the time... but we all are going to have differences on which set we want to focus on. So eventually that decision is going to break up the group unfortunately. So then it is going to take longer to RP a set because PuG's can't do this content consistently and most have no desire to waste 3k segments on a doomed run. By not pooling the RP into one lump sum to use is going to make this a nightmare for some people. I understand why they didn't pool the RP, but I also think they executed it poorly even with how they did it. 1 item per T1. 1 item per T2. 7 items per T3. And the best items are T3, so naturally, everyone will want to do those primarily. So now I need a specific item from T2, but it's a ninja katana. Nobody is going to waste 3000 segments x30 runs to help me cap it, especially with it being something bad like Craklaw and the only item you get from it is for a job nobody cares about. So now I have very little chance to RP that piece if I wanted to unless I solo it (and risk wasting more segments). And with all the armor split up between bosses, you have even more issues capping what you want exactly, as you mentioned. A universal RP system would have been more favorable, with Bonus points awarded to doing specific bosses. That way, if I can only kill V15 Gogmagog, at least I can farm that until my eyes bleed and spend that RP anywhere, even if its significantly lower than doing a V15 Craklaw or V15 Kalunga. At least I could make some progress, especially if I wasn't needing the RP from Gogmagog or Kalunga anyways. Having to do that specific NM with the same group is going to be hard for some if they don't get anything from it.
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Yes. Basically, unless you get other people who also want to equally spam farm the same NM/item you want, it won't be as easy as 4 months of simple farming the same NM to cap a set. Unless everyone agrees to it up front.
Odin.Sudra said: » So you can only get RP on an item from the specific NM that you get the item from? Yes. The RP is applied after the fight by trading an item from that NM to the ??? next to Odyssey entrance (the moogle). You are then asked how much of your total RP (from that NM) you wish to apply to that piece. This way, you don't have only people WEARING that gear getting RP in a fight. If you have zero things you want to RP on a boss, but earn some, it can be converted to segments at a 1:1 ratio. Prioritize, it sucks in that the community will have different priorities but the idea is solid. Do that content to raise that item.
Not really sure why you would want to waste months worth of RP into Daken+5 and totally see why no one else would... Ideally, I see a plan of having static segment farming, and then once the mechanics are more clear, focused RP'ing parties if your current alliance-based content LS has 2-3 segment farming groups running.
It's almost like it's designed so that you play with people who have the same goals, instead of the same static set of people every day all day.
Kind of like an mmo... that can't be right. *looks at notes* oh, well I'll be damned XI is an mmo despite the meta.
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Never not been the case. They generally have a pretty good handle on the What and the Why, but completely fail on the How.
Or the concept vs the implementation etc In fairness, it is a difficult negotiation, they're just exceptionally bad at it. So I had this really strange bug inside Odyssey zone, 2 people in my party died, and after they get raised, they immediately get r0, and everytime they log back in they spawn with red dot immidiately get timed out again. This continues until the timer in odyssey runs out, they get kicked to rabao then the r0 stops.
Anyone else have any experience like this? Asura.Aburaage said: » So I had this really strange bug inside Odyssey zone, 2 people in my party died, and after they get raised, they immediately get r0, and everytime they log back in they spawn with red dot immidiately get timed out again. This continues until the timer in odyssey runs out, they get kicked to rabao then the r0 stops. Anyone else have any experience like this? I have experienced beyond normal lag today in Odyssey Sheol C. Not this exact situation, but noticed strange lag myself. Dual boxing PLD + WHM in sheol c, my WHM alt had little to no lag at all, everything was fine. Main char, PLD was a different story. Took about 2 minutes for anyone to load in, I never received buffs from party, similar to Mireu where you can't target anyone. No mobs spawned in outside of 1 instance. 15 minutes into the 30 minute timer my inventory STILL never loaded up. While this was happening my main char, the PLD only received half the Segments the whole party got. This bug/lag prevented me getting segments from kills. My party was having no issues at all and could see me perfectly fine, but I couldn't see them or any mobs. I tried logging out mid-run and seeing if it would make it better. Nope. It got even worse and got to the point I couldn't even buff myself, I couldn't set blu spells, I couldn't see party chat, tells or nothing. While this was happening on main char, the alt WHM was perfectly fine as an fyi. So for this to happen on 1 instance, but not another is dumb. Never had lag this bad, not even in Gaol. Shame our 1 day lockout segment farming got *** cos of a nice lag/glitch. |
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