Dev Tracker - Discussion

I wish Scragg would answer my letters...

SE could make NIN great again by giving a NIN only job trait that would no longer wipe shadows and for NIN cause even more enmity. Among other amazing things they could do for NIN!!!

Someone doesn't remember the great utsusemi nerf of 2004 where it would get wiped on aoes instead of taking a single shadow away.

I do remember, that is why i want it back. NIN needs to much love it isnt even funny.

Well they also gave NIN shadow bloat forcing them to kill the entire idea. Keeping up shadows was a skill at 75 cap especially as a SJ.

Stunning bosses was also WAY more engaging than absTP strats. The moves for the most part weren't FUs for missing a stun just a ton of chaos. Gades of Hades anyone?

NIN would be instantly busted if you could block AOE damage and not have shadows stripped. That's basically full time Battuta/Rampart? You won't get hit, won't lose shadows, and are a TP machine.

Also, even though Absorb-TP is a more modern version of Stun strategy, it's just a reimagined version of TP Denial method that we used with MNK Subtle Blow Penance, TP Drainkiss, or Mewing Lullaby. Before that, there was kite strategy (even when Gravity DIDN'T work on Kirin). Stun rotation strategy fell way down the list because it's sometimes slower that straight zerg or any other strat. Just kill the damn thing so fast before it can get too many moves off, or stay away from any of it's moves.

For TP denial it kinda goes something like this:

Can it be kited? >>> Gravity > Kite/follow/kill
Can it's TP be absorbed? >>> Absorb TP/Threnody/Frazzle
If not, can we deny it's TP? >>> Subtle Blow, Mewing/Drainkiss
If none of these, can we straight zerg it through Asylum/Bolster Bubbles? >> do that


(way down the list)

Sudden Lunge + Leg Sweeps (Stun spell, far inferior to the previous 2) into the rotation (you can basically eliminate any monster offensively with these two moves if it is vulnerable to stun, but nobody is doing this).

Make Utsusemi work as a small Stoneskin like effect when dealing with AoE with NIN main.

It'll still get stripped, but at least they'll mitigate some damage in the process.

I love the leapfrog between SE and players.

Here's a monster with a bunch of nasty moves to overcome, use everything at your disposal to win!

Nah, we'd rather not.

Fine, we'll make the next one immune to x.

Still not interested. The more we can ignore the better.

Over and over.

Just to be clear, with Yagyu and Yonin active, there is nothing in the game that can generate more enmity than NIN spamming Utsusemi. I have died in the middle of a fight that had a PLD, got up, used Mijin Gakure for a weakness removal, then just for fun put on Yagyu and my tanking/enmity set. Within 3 casts of Utsusemi, I pulled hate straight from the tank.

The only issues NIN has with enmity is it has no initial tool for tagging multiple targets, like Banishga (but you generally don't shadow tank multiple targets anyways, so kind of moot). And Yonin is on a longer timer, so if you die and lose it, you will be a long time without it.

This is literally the reason Bumba V25 is so annoying, and the reason the current strategy is ignoring every single element of the fight and just watching it die from relentless DOT.

Yeah, I can respect gradual resistance to something like stun or whatever when it is stronger than intended, but punishing players for using the tools you gave them is just a *** move.

How about this: Shadows absorbs 20% AoE potency/dmg resulting in full absorption with 5 shadows to keep it exclusive to NIN. ( /nin absorbs 10% each shadow)

Everything Buukki said is correct.

But let's be even more clear: NIN also does not require Yagyu to generate solid hate, so if anyone has the misconception that a bonanza weapon is necessary I would like to clear that up.

Yonin on its own is a solid hate tool, but you can turbocharge things by mainhanding a C-path Divergence Su4/Su5 katana. While it is indeed even better if you stick a Yagyu in offhand (which gets downright comical in how strong it is with all those additional shadows on your party ALSO counting as more hate for the NIN), the Divergence weapon on its own will massively level up your enmity generation capacity. And for that purpose, even the Su4 (~6mil gil on my server right now) works quite effectively at generating hate through casting a bunch of shadows. Don't forget to use Gekka: Ichi (NIN's Crusade equivalent) too.

A damage reduction based on how many shadows are active at the time the damage is received would be perfect. Phalanx kind of effect. And there's already precedent for this because there's "attack based on utsusemi" and "enmity based on utsusemi" on several weapons, but specifically and most recently the Dynamis-D katana Fudo Madamune.

Was said in the NIN thread a fair few times i think but just a DT II based on number of shadows consumed to an AoE would be a nice middle ground if we have such a shadow surplus that letting AoE only take x amount would be too broken, could even just tie it to yonin and give a offensive variant to innin if they wanted to keep to that whole theme.

My enmity remark was based on as you lose shadows it degrades. Unless I am misremembering. For nin having enemy hit shadows should generate even more.

could also just make it not a 100% proc, instead base chance to consume a shadow on ninjutsu skill and yonin degradation with a cap somewhere around 30-50%. 100% shield block is equally absurd, really.

utsusemi sticks out because its cool and lore appropriate for the job and all that, but also the most broken ability in the entire game.

I'd want a boost to ninjutsu nuking dmg before making shadow tanking great again.

Letting ninjutsu nukes do good dmg, perhaps with a stance switching spell for nuking like yonin, would let Nin fit into magic burst setups, and let them do something other than just be a melee dd.

Mostly I want it because ninjutsu nukes look effing cool.