California Debates 'yes Means Yes' Sex Assault Law

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California debates 'yes means yes' sex assault law
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 Lakshmi.Flavin
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By Lakshmi.Flavin 2014-10-01 14:02:35
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Ragnarok.Nausi said: »
Lakshmi.Flavin said: »
Ragnarok.Nausi said: »
Lakshmi.Flavin said: »
So basically where you are coming from is that your own existance inherently makes you culpable in everything that happens related to yourself?

Yes! You are responsible for the events that result from your own existence. I mean are you really saying that someone else is?

That doesn't mean you can't still be the victim of a crime.
I just don't want to be in that room when you start telling that little girl that she should of done more not to be raped by her father.

Existing does not make you culpable of crimes committed against you. You may be able to control your own actions but you can not control all outside forces. The path you're following pretty much takes that stance that even if you do everything you possibly can to avoid or prevent something if it happens its still your fault that it happened. That's ridiculous.

Congratulations you're really a saint, you'd go in there and convince the girl she's helpless to be raped by her father.

Life is inherently risky. No one is arguing that it isn't, but you are the only one responsible for managing how and what kind of risk you expose yourself to.
Are you serious? Is this actually how your brain fucntions?
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 Ragnarok.Nausi
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By Ragnarok.Nausi 2014-10-01 14:03:01
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Bloodrose said: »
Ragnarok.Nausi said: »
Bloodrose said: »
The way Nausi tries to further victimize the victims, then subsequently preach about a culture of victimization in other threads, shows that he's one of the "Legitimate Rape" guys. Nothing more needs be said.

You clearly don't understand what I'm saying one iota.
Right, the whole "Pull yourself by your bootstraps" mythos, complimented by the "it's your fault you were shot by a stray bullet" defense mythos.

"You're not a victim of the rich white guy, stop pretending to be a victim", and then "It's your fault for some drunk driving ***, screeching down the highway, beyond your control or knowledge, if you'd never been there, you'd never have been hurt" line of thinking.

One idea states they aren't, and should never be victims (preaching the culture of victimization), and the other is clearly an opposing and contradictory stance.

How bad are your cognitive reasoning skills to not see how *** HELP I AM TRAPPED IN 2006 PLEASE SEND A TIME MACHINE this is?

Then again, blazed could only use ad hominem against me, instead of trying to actually debate what was posted, and realized he couldn't, but my post was stupid. Riiiight...

I don't think the rape victim is at fault for her own rape, but they bear some responsibility in the events of her own life that exposed her to the risk. That doesn't mean that the rapist is misunderstood, or that he doesn't deserve to be punished. Nor does it mean the rape victim should be. However pointing out that the victim could have managed risk better is not really punishment.

Life is inherently risky, and no one is saying it should ever be lived in the complete and utter absence of risk, but own and manage the risks that you take. You are not helpless to them. To live a life where you believe you are is to be the perpetual victim.
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By Blazed1979 2014-10-01 14:04:19
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Bloodrose said: »
Blazed1979 said: »
Bloodrose said: »
Ramyrez said: »
Lakshmi.Sparthosx said: »
Cerberus.Anjisnu said: »
There have been times where me and my wife are white girl wasted and had sex without saying ***to each other with this law in place either of us could claim rape and I would go to jail

Without this law you know the situation would end the same way right? She claims rape, you're now in the hotseat.

And according to Nausi, it's your fault for poorly selecting your wife.
It's also your fault if someone breaks into your house, for waking up in the morning, for someone running a red light and crashing into you, or for being a victim of anything, really.

Except you know that whole "you're not really a victim, it's just a culture of cashing in on the victimization train" ***.

What a load of crap. Anyone who, God Forbid, puts any responsibility on women is imminently met with a barrage of "rapist" "rapist sympathizer" accusations or called a victim basher.

Good luck Californians, if you're stupid enough to agree with this proposed law, you deserve the rape accusations.
Saying ***like "she dressed" a certain way as a defense for violating a woman sexually without her consent, is being a rapist sympathizer.

Men actually choose rape victims based on predatory means such as perception of a weak target, which can not put up any kind of proper defense. More women are raped who dress conservatively, than those who dress provocatively, and are rarely ever the night club goers in comparison. Not what they chose to wear out in a public place full of people and security cameras.

I don't disagree. But this specific law is targeting an entirely different group of citizens with different behavior patterns and a different age group. This is a law aimed at addressing college rape.
College rape is something completely different than the stalker serial rapist picture you draw.
 Ragnarok.Nausi
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By Ragnarok.Nausi 2014-10-01 14:04:46
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Lakshmi.Flavin said: »
Ragnarok.Nausi said: »
Lakshmi.Flavin said: »
Ragnarok.Nausi said: »
Lakshmi.Flavin said: »
So basically where you are coming from is that your own existance inherently makes you culpable in everything that happens related to yourself?

Yes! You are responsible for the events that result from your own existence. I mean are you really saying that someone else is?

That doesn't mean you can't still be the victim of a crime.
I just don't want to be in that room when you start telling that little girl that she should of done more not to be raped by her father.

Existing does not make you culpable of crimes committed against you. You may be able to control your own actions but you can not control all outside forces. The path you're following pretty much takes that stance that even if you do everything you possibly can to avoid or prevent something if it happens its still your fault that it happened. That's ridiculous.

Congratulations you're really a saint, you'd go in there and convince the girl she's helpless to be raped by her father.

Life is inherently risky. No one is arguing that it isn't, but you are the only one responsible for managing how and what kind of risk you expose yourself to.
Are you serious? Is this actually how your brain fucntions?
So who makes the decision to stay at the party with the creepy guy who won't leave you alone, who later rapes you?
 
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By Bloodrose 2014-10-01 14:06:17
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Ragnarok.Nausi said: »
Bloodrose said: »
Ragnarok.Nausi said: »
Bloodrose said: »
The way Nausi tries to further victimize the victims, then subsequently preach about a culture of victimization in other threads, shows that he's one of the "Legitimate Rape" guys. Nothing more needs be said.

You clearly don't understand what I'm saying one iota.
Right, the whole "Pull yourself by your bootstraps" mythos, complimented by the "it's your fault you were shot by a stray bullet" defense mythos.

"You're not a victim of the rich white guy, stop pretending to be a victim", and then "It's your fault for some drunk driving ***, screeching down the highway, beyond your control or knowledge, if you'd never been there, you'd never have been hurt" line of thinking.

One idea states they aren't, and should never be victims (preaching the culture of victimization), and the other is clearly an opposing and contradictory stance.

How bad are your cognitive reasoning skills to not see how *** HELP I AM TRAPPED IN 2006 PLEASE SEND A TIME MACHINE this is?

Then again, blazed could only use ad hominem against me, instead of trying to actually debate what was posted, and realized he couldn't, but my post was stupid. Riiiight...

I don't think the rape victim is at fault for her own rape, but they bear some responsibility in the events of her own life that exposed her to the risk. That doesn't mean that the rapist is misunderstood, or that he doesn't deserve to be punished. Nor does it mean the rape victim should be. However pointing out that the victim could have managed risk better is not really punishment.

Life is inherently risky, and no one is saying it should ever be lived in the complete and utter absence of risk, but own and manage the risks that you take. You are not helpless to them. To live a life where you believe you are is to be the perpetual victim.
While I am on the fence on this opinion of yours, this is at least, the kind of cohesive response I was hoping for, and I do applaud you for it. Well thought out and explains the position better than the initial knee-jerk response, which, admittedly, was met with an equally knee-jerk response.

My respect for you is rising. Don't blow it.
 Bahamut.Milamber
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By Bahamut.Milamber 2014-10-01 14:06:18
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Leviathan.Comeatmebro said: »
You can't fault a 10-year for being incapable of handling a situation like this, but you can't pretend that they didn't have a way out either. The belief that they have no responsibility and no way out is what lets this kind of thing last for years.

You can be in the right all you want about your behavior after you get raped, it's not going to undo the rape. Police aren't omnipotent, and until the day they are, you are the primary person in charge of your own safety.

You can't fault a baby for getting murdered, and you can't pretend they didn't have a way out either. The belief that they have no responsibility and no way out is what lets this kind of thing last for years.


You can be in the right all you want about your behavior after you get murdered, it's not going to undo the murder. Police aren't omnipotent, and until the day they are, you are the primary person in charge of your own safety.


Yeah, you are *** HELP I AM TRAPPED IN 2006 PLEASE SEND A TIME MACHINE, and a horrible, horrible person. Yet another person to block.
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 Cerberus.Pleebo
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By Cerberus.Pleebo 2014-10-01 14:06:31
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So what you're saying is that the slaves could have just run away?
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By Blazed1979 2014-10-01 14:07:38
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Leviathan.Comeatmebro said: »
You can't fault a 10-year for being incapable of handling a situation like this, but you can't pretend that they didn't have a way out either. The belief that they have no responsibility and no way out is what lets this kind of thing last for years.

You can be in the right all you want about your behavior after you get raped, it's not going to undo the rape. Police aren't omnipotent, and until the day they are, you are the primary person in charge of your own safety.


Every statement in that post is an accurate representation of facts. It's not pretty, it's not something I expected anyone to agree with, but it's accurate. If you don't take responsibility for your own safety, don't be upset when nobody else does.

WTF ARE YOU SAYING? Are you mentally HELP I AM TRAPPED IN 2006 PLEASE SEND A TIME MACHINE.. a 10 year old?!!!
In what world is a 10 year old at all responsible for anything they do let alone the amount of sick ***that some pedophiles want to do to them?
Holy God! WTF did i just read
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 Bahamut.Seekerstar
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By Bahamut.Seekerstar 2014-10-01 14:08:06
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Oh jeez, I don't even know why I'm jumping in on this, but I just can't leave it alone.

Rape is NOT ABOUT SEX, it's about the ability to control, and in most cases, hurt the person the rapist chooses to rape.

It's a goddamn power trip of the highest order and even though yes, there are times that signals get mixed, any /real/ man should recognize that no means no, it doesn't matter WHAT she was doing or how she was doing it, NO MEANS NO.

Yeah, maybe the chick in question is a cocktease at that point, but if you press the issue then you're a rapist and deserve whatever karma gives you.

This silly little law is like most others that try to quantify stuff that should be common sense.... as a woman, if you asked me "will you have consensual sexual intercourse with me" I'd probably laugh my *** off. I may say yes, but I know I'd find it hilarious.

Any person who makes a false rape claim deserves whatever karma gives them as well; that is one of the surest ways to *** up a person's life, and I don't care what someone did to me, that's just too far.
 Leviathan.Comeatmebro
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By Leviathan.Comeatmebro 2014-10-01 14:08:26
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Bahamut.Milamber said: »
Leviathan.Comeatmebro said: »
You can't fault a 10-year for being incapable of handling a situation like this, but you can't pretend that they didn't have a way out either. The belief that they have no responsibility and no way out is what lets this kind of thing last for years.

You can be in the right all you want about your behavior after you get raped, it's not going to undo the rape. Police aren't omnipotent, and until the day they are, you are the primary person in charge of your own safety.

You can't fault a baby for getting murdered, and you can't pretend they didn't have a way out either. The belief that they have no responsibility and no way out is what lets this kind of thing last for years.


You can be in the right all you want about your behavior after you get murdered, it's not going to undo the murder. Police aren't omnipotent, and until the day they are, you are the primary person in charge of your own safety.


Yeah, you are *** HELP I AM TRAPPED IN 2006 PLEASE SEND A TIME MACHINE, and a horrible, horrible person. Yet another person to block.
A baby being murdered isn't exactly the same thing as someone who has the power of speech and the numerous safe havens in our society being incapable of saying something happened to stop it from reoccuring.

Say what you want about my post, if the theoretical girl spoke to her teacher it would've been one rape not nightly for 10 years. Someone incapable of that isn't at fault, as was stated in every post I've made, but their actions could alleviate the situation.
 
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 Bahamut.Seekerstar
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By Bahamut.Seekerstar 2014-10-01 14:12:32
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.....do not quote book definitions at me.

Please. That insults my intelligence, and the intelligences of others, when you know damned well I was referring to intent, not dictionary definition.
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By Bloodrose 2014-10-01 14:13:46
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Leviathan.Comeatmebro said: »
Bahamut.Milamber said: »
Leviathan.Comeatmebro said: »
You can't fault a 10-year for being incapable of handling a situation like this, but you can't pretend that they didn't have a way out either. The belief that they have no responsibility and no way out is what lets this kind of thing last for years.

You can be in the right all you want about your behavior after you get raped, it's not going to undo the rape. Police aren't omnipotent, and until the day they are, you are the primary person in charge of your own safety.

You can't fault a baby for getting murdered, and you can't pretend they didn't have a way out either. The belief that they have no responsibility and no way out is what lets this kind of thing last for years.


You can be in the right all you want about your behavior after you get murdered, it's not going to undo the murder. Police aren't omnipotent, and until the day they are, you are the primary person in charge of your own safety.


Yeah, you are *** HELP I AM TRAPPED IN 2006 PLEASE SEND A TIME MACHINE, and a horrible, horrible person. Yet another person to block.
A baby being murdered isn't exactly the same thing as someone who has the power of speech and the numerous safe havens in our society being incapable of saying something happened to stop it from reoccuring.

Say what you want about my post, if the theoretical girl spoke to her teacher it would've been one rape not nightly for 10 years. Someone incapable of that isn't at fault, as was stated in every post I've made, but their actions could alleviate the situation.
In most cases when a child does manage to speak to someone who cares, the initial response is often of disbelief, primarily because of the accusation of a family member, who on the surface, may be very well adjusted and accommodating to others.

Pull your head out of your HELP I AM TRAPPED IN 2006 PLEASE SEND A TIME MACHINE ***.

Additionally, when the rapist of a father learns of this, he quickly adds beatings or other fear tactics of worse treatment to her, and others she would choose to protect by taking the pain instead. You know this thing called trauma? Panic? Every adult who's been raped can't think cognitively by the morning after they've been a rape victim, much less a 10 year old child.

There's also the stigma of being a rape victim, that comes from within and externally, because people look at you differently.
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By Sylph.Systematicchaos 2014-10-01 14:13:49
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Nazrious said: »
Blazed1979 said: »
Odin.Jassik said: »
Leviathan.Comeatmebro said: »
Caitsith.Shiroi said: »
I'm sure there are plenty of of false rape accusations, I don't know what % that would be, but I'm sure it's fairly big. BUT, being found not guilty due to a lack of evidence doesn't mean it wasn't a rape, they just weren't able to prove it.
http://www.reddit.com/r/MensRights/comments/1o74n7/facts_and_statistics_about_false_rape_claims_a/ Sources cited, before someone sees reddit and shits themselves about credibility.
Quote:
TLDR: -At least 6% of rape claims are false -The vast majority of rape claims are unknown whether they are true or false -The 6% figure does not include mistaken accusations where the accuser was raped but named the wrong defendant -The 6% figure only includes those cases where there is strong proof it was false -False rape claims often result in serious harm, even the ones that do not end in conviction -Punishing false accusers does not mean that a genuine rape accuser would be prosecuted if they could not prove they were raped -False rape claims are 4x more common than false claims of other crimes -Rape victims receive a lot of help, but false rape claim victims receive virtually none - this should be changed.
Only marginally more cases are considered proven true, from what I could find, about 9% of rape accusations are proven in court, fully less than 15% of rape accusations lead to any kind of conviction, and as many as [b]8/10 rapes are never reported.[/b] There is a LOT of gray area on the subject.
So rape is even more widespread in the US than the figures reported? yeah bash India and Pakistan and "middle east" some more. Definition of rape there is a lot more sane than this ***; She says no, resists and you continue = rape. US - she doesn't say anything at all, sucks yo c_ck and it could be rape!!!
In fairness thats only in Cali. Those people seem to be full of a whole lot of something over there...

Not anymore.
 Caitsith.Zahrah
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By Caitsith.Zahrah 2014-10-01 14:14:30
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Bahamut.Kara said: »
Leviathan.Comeatmebro said: »
I'm not entirely sure your point, since you ignored the other half of my post and are responding to something I didn't say.

To elaborate, I am not saying female dress code should be any mitigating factor for rape, nor am I implying it's the cause.

I am saying that a drunk woman shouldn't have an instant out(especially one so damaging to the victim) for bad choices she made while under the influence of something she willingly consumed.
I used your quote as it was the most recent that I saw. I wasn't referring to only your arguments in this thread. I should have made that more clear.

Your use (and a lot of other posters use) of the phrases "dress like a ***" or "drink like a ***" doesn't exactly lend your side objectivity, since that is amazingly subjective.

However, I'm sorry if I misunderstood what you were saying.

I don't think anyone supports revenge or regret accusations. I do think that the assumption that every drunk woman is panting at the idea of being able to cry rape is seriously flawed.

Drunk women don't have an instant out here. If you think getting rape charges attached, going to trial, and getting a conviction is instant, you are mistaken

Just adding that the use and sniggering at "*** suit" in another recent thread for the iconic, little, black dress, doesn't really help any of you either.

Who doesn't love a gussied up gal on their arm? Wait a tick! That's not my girl going out for a night on the town! What a ***! Look at that *** in that black, sweetheart neck-lined dress with a drink! ***!

Some of you really do yourselves no favors from thread-to-thread.
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By Bloodrose 2014-10-01 14:14:54
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There's the dictionary term of what rape is/consists of, and what the actual intent is.

Don't be like candlejack, Shiroi, please.
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 Ragnarok.Nausi
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By Ragnarok.Nausi 2014-10-01 14:18:38
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Cerberus.Pleebo said: »
So what you're saying is that the slaves could have just run away?
Didn't many slaves in fact run away?
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By Blazed1979 2014-10-01 14:21:28
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Leviathan.Comeatmebro said: »
Bahamut.Milamber said: »
Leviathan.Comeatmebro said: »
You can't fault a 10-year for being incapable of handling a situation like this, but you can't pretend that they didn't have a way out either. The belief that they have no responsibility and no way out is what lets this kind of thing last for years.

You can be in the right all you want about your behavior after you get raped, it's not going to undo the rape. Police aren't omnipotent, and until the day they are, you are the primary person in charge of your own safety.

You can't fault a baby for getting murdered, and you can't pretend they didn't have a way out either. The belief that they have no responsibility and no way out is what lets this kind of thing last for years.


You can be in the right all you want about your behavior after you get murdered, it's not going to undo the murder. Police aren't omnipotent, and until the day they are, you are the primary person in charge of your own safety.


Yeah, you are *** HELP I AM TRAPPED IN 2006 PLEASE SEND A TIME MACHINE, and a horrible, horrible person. Yet another person to block.
A baby being murdered isn't exactly the same thing as someone who has the power of speech and the numerous safe havens in our society being incapable of saying something happened to stop it from reoccuring.

Say what you want about my post, if the theoretical girl spoke to her teacher it would've been one rape not nightly for 10 years. Someone incapable of that isn't at fault, as was stated in every post I've made, but their actions could alleviate the situation.

Do you know how much trauma that 10 year old would have experienced? Do you think children think like adults? Do you even know any children? God I HOPE NOT!
Have you read anything from adult rape victims about what its like to be raped? How can you for even a second assume that a child has ANY control whatsoever on their well being.

No one is ever going to entertain or humor your idea that children should have done something different. What the f_ck is wrong with you?
Seriously, what kind of disease or sickness do you suffer from?
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By Bloodrose 2014-10-01 14:21:40
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Caitsith.Shiroi said: »
Bahamut.Seekerstar said: »
.....do not quote book definitions at me.

Please. That insults my intelligence, and the intelligences of others, when you know damned well I was referring to intent, not dictionary definition.

The intent is to have sex. The action is to have sex. The crime is that it's not consensual.
You idiot.

The intent is to display power, force, and desire to instill fear and violate someone physically through physical force. The action used to violate someone physically happens to be through sexual intercourse.

Try talking to sex abuse counselors police, and other experts, who deal with the victims and the rapists.
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By Bloodrose 2014-10-01 14:22:37
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Blazed1979 said: »
Leviathan.Comeatmebro said: »
Bahamut.Milamber said: »
Leviathan.Comeatmebro said: »
You can't fault a 10-year for being incapable of handling a situation like this, but you can't pretend that they didn't have a way out either. The belief that they have no responsibility and no way out is what lets this kind of thing last for years.

You can be in the right all you want about your behavior after you get raped, it's not going to undo the rape. Police aren't omnipotent, and until the day they are, you are the primary person in charge of your own safety.

You can't fault a baby for getting murdered, and you can't pretend they didn't have a way out either. The belief that they have no responsibility and no way out is what lets this kind of thing last for years.


You can be in the right all you want about your behavior after you get murdered, it's not going to undo the murder. Police aren't omnipotent, and until the day they are, you are the primary person in charge of your own safety.


Yeah, you are *** HELP I AM TRAPPED IN 2006 PLEASE SEND A TIME MACHINE, and a horrible, horrible person. Yet another person to block.
A baby being murdered isn't exactly the same thing as someone who has the power of speech and the numerous safe havens in our society being incapable of saying something happened to stop it from reoccuring.

Say what you want about my post, if the theoretical girl spoke to her teacher it would've been one rape not nightly for 10 years. Someone incapable of that isn't at fault, as was stated in every post I've made, but their actions could alleviate the situation.

Do you know how much trauma that 10 year old would have experienced? Do you think children think like adults? Do you even know any children? God I HOPE NOT!
Have you read anything from adult rape victims about what its like to be raped? How can you for even a second assume that a child has ANY control whatsoever on their well being.

No one is ever going to entertain or humor your idea that children should have done something different. What the f_ck is wrong with you?
Seriously, what kind of disease or sickness do you suffer from?
I believe the disease is called "I'm HELP I AM TRAPPED IN 2006 PLEASE SEND A TIME MACHINE"
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By Blazed1979 2014-10-01 14:24:26
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Ragnarok.Nausi said: »
Cerberus.Pleebo said: »
So what you're saying is that the slaves could have just run away?
Didn't many slaves in fact run away?

There I was amused that you and I agreed on something. Oh well, didn't last long.

So the fact that some slaves escaped means that the ones that didn't escape have themselves to blame?

I need to make a gif of me punching my ownself in the face because the stupidity in your post just hurts my head that much.
 
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By Bloodrose 2014-10-01 14:25:49
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Ragnarok.Nausi said: »
Cerberus.Pleebo said: »
So what you're saying is that the slaves could have just run away?
Didn't many slaves in fact run away?
Aaaand... respect lost.

Let's stick with the status quo.
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By Bahamut.Milamber 2014-10-01 14:25:54
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Ragnarok.Nausi said: »
Cerberus.Pleebo said: »
So what you're saying is that the slaves could have just run away?
Didn't many slaves in fact run away?
By volkom 2014-10-01 14:27:25
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Blazed1979 said: »
Ragnarok.Nausi said: »
Cerberus.Pleebo said: »
So what you're saying is that the slaves could have just run away?
Didn't many slaves in fact run away?

There I was amused that you and I agreed on something. Oh well, didn't last long.

So the fact that some slaves escaped means that the ones that didn't escape have themselves to blame?

the ones that got caught didn't run fast enough
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By Blazed1979 2014-10-01 14:28:30
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Bloodrose said: »
Caitsith.Shiroi said: »
Bahamut.Seekerstar said: »
.....do not quote book definitions at me.

Please. That insults my intelligence, and the intelligences of others, when you know damned well I was referring to intent, not dictionary definition.

The intent is to have sex. The action is to have sex. The crime is that it's not consensual.
You idiot.

The intent is to display power, force, and desire to instill fear and violate someone physically through physical force. The action used to violate someone physically happens to be through sexual intercourse.

Try talking to sex abuse counselors police, and other experts, who deal with the victims and the rapists.

Sex is a complex thing. I wouldn't define all rapes that way. Some of them, if not a lot of them, yes.
I read once that on the opposite spectrum of rapists, some men cannot achieve an erection if they feel the other side is not consenting. How is this relevant? state of mind, power and control can be sexual. Rape psycho analysis isn't my specialty. but I do know enough about psychology in general to say for certain not all rape is about power.
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By Bloodrose 2014-10-01 14:31:28
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Caitsith.Shiroi said: »
Bloodrose said: »
Caitsith.Shiroi said: »
Bahamut.Seekerstar said: »
.....do not quote book definitions at me.

Please. That insults my intelligence, and the intelligences of others, when you know damned well I was referring to intent, not dictionary definition.

The intent is to have sex. The action is to have sex. The crime is that it's not consensual.
You idiot.

The intent is to display power, force, and desire to instill fear and violate someone physically through physical force. The action used to violate someone physically happens to be through sexual intercourse.

Try talking to sex abuse counselors police, and other experts, who deal with the victims and the rapists.

You don't actually need that intent to rape someone. Raping is the action of having sex with someone without consent.
Rape is the intent, and action of having sex without consent (or violating someone through physical sexual assault). If there is no intent to have sex without consent, then it becomes a matter of not having sex, or a matter of consensual sex. Neither of which are rape.
 Ragnarok.Nausi
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By Ragnarok.Nausi 2014-10-01 14:32:04
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Blazed1979 said: »
Ragnarok.Nausi said: »
Cerberus.Pleebo said: »
So what you're saying is that the slaves could have just run away?
Didn't many slaves in fact run away?

There I was amused that you and I agreed on something. Oh well, didn't last long.

So the fact that some slaves escaped means that the ones that didn't escape have themselves to blame?

I need to make a gif of me punching my ownself in the face because the stupidity in your post just hurts my head that much.
See there you go putting words into my mouth.

The way I see it, you have a bunch of people who are victims of slavery. Within that group, there's two groups of people. One that wasn't content to remain a slave and therefore made the choice to run away, and another that wasn't discontent enough to run away and therefore remained a slave.

Neither of these choices negate the fact that some people were victims of slavery.

Do we not applaud stories where the slave breaks out into freedom? That doesn't mean that we automatically shun those who didn't.
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