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Please sign in to Stop genocide in palestine
By fonewear 2014-08-06 14:19:16
Gaza strip girl she's been living in a disputed territory war. I bet she never met a nice Israeli boy.
Bismarck.Ramyrez
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By Bismarck.Ramyrez 2014-08-06 14:21:40
Gaza strip girl she's been living in a disputed territory war. I bet she never met a nice Israeli boy.
Was he born and raised in south Tel Aviv?
Did they catch a midnight train (do they have trains in that region?) going anywhere?
By fonewear 2014-08-06 14:25:38
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Bismarck.Ramyrez
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By Bismarck.Ramyrez 2014-08-06 14:30:41
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How great is it that at the time, that was huge news and a major faux pas? Man do I miss those days.
By fonewear 2014-08-06 14:32:51
I shaved my head to get Sinead O' Connor to stop singing.
That and to support Britney Spears efforts in whatever it is she does.
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By Asura.Kingnobody 2014-08-06 14:38:46
That and to support Britney Spears efforts in whatever it is she does. You mean besides spread her legs?
Ragnarok.Zeig
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By Ragnarok.Zeig 2014-08-06 16:54:11
As a general rule, I tend to immediately throw out any argument from people who believe in Djinns and Sassanid folk tales. That pretty much just leaves the Anti-Muslims unopposed. But whether they believe in Sassanid folk tales, Unicorns, or the flying spaghetti monster is not the point. The point is: does their texts instruct them to "exterminate all Jews" as some claimed?
One person says the text does, another person says it doesn't. That's the problem with creating a religion for illiterate goat herders, the original meaning is twisted into an unrecognizable form by the time some objective scholars can write down what's there.
If I'm not mistaken, the actual dialect the original Qur'an was written in no longer exists as well. At this point it could be a recipe for snickerdoodles and nobody would know.
How many say it does? What makes their interpretation more feasible than others'? Are they learned about the Arabic language, historical context, etc etc.
People can and will disagree on about everything. What validates one's claims over another is what should be of concern to us. That's why I asked Ramyrez to read about a certain topic from both pro and anti-Muslim websites, then judge himself.
The dialect of the Quran is basically what formal Arabic today is (it's actually a reference). It is used in official settings etc, but people communicate using local (informal/slang) dialects.
Depends on what you define as a creator. I create a couple things, usually twelve plus hours after a meal. Am I God? Or do I just have a healthy colon? I'll leave that debate to future generations.
But if you believe there is an Original creator, you cannot prove it. The most you can do is assume a series of assumptions are true. We were talking about Occam's razor a little while ago, and if you're unfamiliar with the term, it basically means that which relies on the least assumptions is usually true. Just in the realm of religion alone, you have to believe that 60,000+ Individual interpretations are all false, and that you chose the one truth, some people would rather buy the lottery ticket for a 1:60,000 payoff, I'd rather invest in a future.
In terms of an original creator, you have to assume that there needed to be a creator, and that the creator didn't need a creator. As Carl Sagan would say, why not save a step? Assume everything didn't need a creator, neither assumption has any more or any less validity or evidence. I thought Occam's razor supported the concept of one, eternal God (since it ends the perpetual "who created the creator?" inevitable series of questions).
@Eslim: Islamic theology says that all of God's messengers preached the message of Islam—submission to the will of God.
Each came to preach Islam at different times in history and some told of the coming of the final prophet and messenger of God, who would be named "Ahmed" commonly known as Muhammad. Each prophet directed a message to a different group of people, and thus would preach Islam in accordance with the times.
And, in the Quran 6:162-163, Abraham calls himself a Muslim.
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By Asura.Kingnobody 2014-08-06 16:58:23
Yeah, a fictional character from a book calling themselves something in a different book....
Sounds legit!
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Leviathan.Chaosx
Server: Leviathan
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Posts: 20284
By Leviathan.Chaosx 2014-08-06 17:35:57
That brings up an interesting point. When is it socially acceptable to hug strangers ?
My rule of thumb is if you had at least three beers you can hug anyone. I'd say an even 4.
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Leviathan.Chaosx
Server: Leviathan
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By Leviathan.Chaosx 2014-08-06 17:44:13
We did it guys!
Cease fire for 2 days now!
Quote: A 72-hour Gaza truce held through its second day on Wednesday and Israel said it was ready to extend the deal as Egyptian mediators pursued talks with Israelis and Palestinians on an enduring end to a war that devastated the Hamas-ruled enclave.
Egypt's intelligence chief met a Palestinian delegation in Cairo, the state news agency MENA said, a day after he conferred with Israeli representatives. The Palestinian team, led by an official from Western-backed President Mahmoud Abbas's Fatah party, includes envoys from Hamas and the Islamic Jihad group.
"The indirect talks between the Palestinians and Israelis are moving forward," one Egyptian official said, making clear that the opposing sides were not meeting face to face. "It is still too early to talk about outcomes but we are optimistic."
Egyptian Foreign Minister Sameh Shukri told reporters his country was working hard for a deal and sought "solutions to protect the Palestinian people and their interests". Source
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By Cerberus.Senkyuutai 2014-08-06 19:20:26
Love is free and sex should be too, so call me maybe? I dream of a world where sex is free.
Will it ever happen? Please tell me it's not an utopia.
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By fonewear 2014-08-06 22:11:02
Love is free and sex should be too, so call me maybe?
Love isn't free you have to give up something...
Server: Odin
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By Odin.Zicdeh 2014-08-06 22:26:10
As a general rule, I tend to immediately throw out any argument from people who believe in Djinns and Sassanid folk tales. That pretty much just leaves the Anti-Muslims unopposed. But whether they believe in Sassanid folk tales, Unicorns, or the flying spaghetti monster is not the point. The point is: does their texts instruct them to "exterminate all Jews" as some claimed?
One person says the text does, another person says it doesn't. That's the problem with creating a religion for illiterate goat herders, the original meaning is twisted into an unrecognizable form by the time some objective scholars can write down what's there.
If I'm not mistaken, the actual dialect the original Qur'an was written in no longer exists as well. At this point it could be a recipe for snickerdoodles and nobody would know.
How many say it does? What makes their interpretation more feasible than others'? Are they learned about the Arabic language, historical context, etc etc.
People can and will disagree on about everything. What validates one's claims over another is what should be of concern to us. That's why I asked Ramyrez to read about a certain topic from both pro and anti-Muslim websites, then judge himself.
The dialect of the Quran is basically what formal Arabic today is (it's actually a reference). It is used in official settings etc, but people communicate using local (informal/slang) dialects.
Depends on what you define as a creator. I create a couple things, usually twelve plus hours after a meal. Am I God? Or do I just have a healthy colon? I'll leave that debate to future generations.
But if you believe there is an Original creator, you cannot prove it. The most you can do is assume a series of assumptions are true. We were talking about Occam's razor a little while ago, and if you're unfamiliar with the term, it basically means that which relies on the least assumptions is usually true. Just in the realm of religion alone, you have to believe that 60,000+ Individual interpretations are all false, and that you chose the one truth, some people would rather buy the lottery ticket for a 1:60,000 payoff, I'd rather invest in a future.
In terms of an original creator, you have to assume that there needed to be a creator, and that the creator didn't need a creator. As Carl Sagan would say, why not save a step? Assume everything didn't need a creator, neither assumption has any more or any less validity or evidence. I thought Occam's razor supported the concept of one, eternal God (since it ends the perpetual "who created the creator?" inevitable series of questions).
@Eslim: Islamic theology says that all of God's messengers preached the message of Islam—submission to the will of God.
Each came to preach Islam at different times in history and some told of the coming of the final prophet and messenger of God, who would be named "Ahmed" commonly known as Muhammad. Each prophet directed a message to a different group of people, and thus would preach Islam in accordance with the times.
And, in the Quran 6:162-163, Abraham calls himself a Muslim.
But the assumption that everything needs a creator is still there. There is no reason to believe the Universe hasn't always existed, the only thing that has ever supported a Creator is wishful thinking.
Personally I've always thought the idea of a creator is the most disgusting self-centered thought of human nature. That we have some pre-concieved privilege in the Universe is nothing but the most obnoxious manifestation of human ego.
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Bahamut.Ravael
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By Bahamut.Ravael 2014-08-06 23:31:42
But the assumption that everything needs a creator is still there. There is no reason to believe the Universe hasn't always existed, the only thing that has ever supported a Creator is wishful thinking.
Personally I've always thought the idea of a creator is the most disgusting self-centered thought of human nature. That we have some pre-concieved privilege in the Universe is nothing but the most obnoxious manifestation of human ego.
Here's a weird thought. Rather than argue religion in general, let's try something more metaphysical for kicks and giggles. We all see things from a first-person point of view. How does that even happen? What is the criteria that places you in command of the brain you control as opposed to the brain of another being? And what is the criteria for sentience to begin with? Does your computer get a first-person point of view? How about single-cell organisms?
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By Enuyasha 2014-08-06 23:52:16
But the assumption that everything needs a creator is still there. There is no reason to believe the Universe hasn't always existed, the only thing that has ever supported a Creator is wishful thinking.
Personally I've always thought the idea of a creator is the most disgusting self-centered thought of human nature. That we have some pre-concieved privilege in the Universe is nothing but the most obnoxious manifestation of human ego.
Here's a weird thought. Rather than argue religion in general, let's try something more metaphysical for kicks and giggles. We all see things from a first-person point of view. How does that even happen? What is the criteria that places you in command of the brain you control as opposed to the brain of another being? And what is the criteria for sentience to begin with? Does your computer get a first-person point of view? How about single-cell organisms? To an extension of your question: How do you know its a first person view? Maybe you're actually some fourth person vantage point in another persons reality. If your computer does get a first person view, does it just sit there staring at you, or does it look around occasionally to see out of its peripherals?
/tionfoil hat
AINT GETTING ME WITH YOUR FOURTH PERSON SPYING! NOPE!!!
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By Enuyasha 2014-08-06 23:58:18
We did it guys!
Cease fire for 2 days now!
Quote: A 72-hour Gaza truce held through its second day on Wednesday and Israel said it was ready to extend the deal as Egyptian mediators pursued talks with Israelis and Palestinians on an enduring end to a war that devastated the Hamas-ruled enclave.
Egypt's intelligence chief met a Palestinian delegation in Cairo, the state news agency MENA said, a day after he conferred with Israeli representatives. The Palestinian team, led by an official from Western-backed President Mahmoud Abbas's Fatah party, includes envoys from Hamas and the Islamic Jihad group.
"The indirect talks between the Palestinians and Israelis are moving forward," one Egyptian official said, making clear that the opposing sides were not meeting face to face. "It is still too early to talk about outcomes but we are optimistic."
Egyptian Foreign Minister Sameh Shukri told reporters his country was working hard for a deal and sought "solutions to protect the Palestinian people and their interests". SourceMaybe this will be a start of that wonderful thing we invaded The Middle East for in the first place? P-E-A-C-E?
But i do hope it goes the full 72 hours and some ***gets talked through.
Bahamut.Ravael
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By Bahamut.Ravael 2014-08-06 23:59:24
The only reason I even brought that up was simply to demonstrate that even with the most basic, rational belief of "what you see is what you get", the amount of work that it takes to justify your own existence is insane. Calling each other crazy for believing or not believing that there is something beyond this life is laughable, because both theories are beyond our comprehension to fully understand with our feeble human minds.
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Bahamut.Kara
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By Bahamut.Kara 2014-08-07 00:05:54
I'm a fan of Descartes "I think, therefore I am".
Bahamut.Ravael
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By Bahamut.Ravael 2014-08-07 00:07:04
I'm a fan of Descartes "I think, therefore I am".
A phrase that is both very profound and utterly lacking.
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By Enuyasha 2014-08-07 00:09:20
The only reason I even brought that up was simply to demonstrate that even with the most basic, rational belief of "what you see is what you get", the amount of work that it takes to justify your own existence is insane. Calling each other crazy for believing or not believing that there is something beyond this life is laughable, because both theories are beyond our comprehension to fully understand with our feeble human minds. I totally agree with you, but in all honesty im sort of in the belief that it doesnt really matter "where you go when you die" because thats after youre put in a box and left to bubble up into a noxious pool of chemicals. If theres an afterlife it surely wouldnt or shouldnt matter if we can prove or disprove its existence cause the only way to get there would be to die anyway....or figure out the processes behind transcending that boundary and if death would be the only way to do it. Its sort of an irrelevant question which when answered, would lead to a bunch of other irrelevant questions we'd have to get answered from a being that may or may not exist :<
Bahamut.Ravael
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By Bahamut.Ravael 2014-08-07 00:14:09
The only reason I even brought that up was simply to demonstrate that even with the most basic, rational belief of "what you see is what you get", the amount of work that it takes to justify your own existence is insane. Calling each other crazy for believing or not believing that there is something beyond this life is laughable, because both theories are beyond our comprehension to fully understand with our feeble human minds. I totally agree with you, but in all honesty im sort of in the belief that it doesnt really matter "where you go when you die" because thats after youre put in a box and left to bubble up into a noxious pool of chemicals. If theres an afterlife it surely wouldnt or shouldnt matter if we can prove or disprove its existence cause the only way to get there would be to die anyway....or figure out the processes behind transcending that boundary and if death would be the only way to do it. Its sort of an irrelevant question which when answered, would lead to a bunch of other irrelevant questions we'd have to get answered from a being that may or may not exist :<
Fair enough. I'm of the opinion that humans would just rather be force-fed gross simplifications of potential answers, such as "yep, there's a god" or "no there ain't". Thinking is hard, and it's far easier to discriminate and fight back against those whose "nature and nurture" developed a completely different set of conclusions than our own.
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By Odin.Zicdeh 2014-08-07 01:50:01
But the assumption that everything needs a creator is still there. There is no reason to believe the Universe hasn't always existed, the only thing that has ever supported a Creator is wishful thinking.
Personally I've always thought the idea of a creator is the most disgusting self-centered thought of human nature. That we have some pre-concieved privilege in the Universe is nothing but the most obnoxious manifestation of human ego.
Here's a weird thought. Rather than argue religion in general, let's try something more metaphysical for kicks and giggles. We all see things from a first-person point of view. How does that even happen? What is the criteria that places you in command of the brain you control as opposed to the brain of another being? And what is the criteria for sentience to begin with? Does your computer get a first-person point of view? How about single-cell organisms?
I've actually spoken to single-celled organisms and yes, they do view the world from a first person point of view. Unfortunately you lack the mental capacity to communicate with them because I'm superior to you, so you'll have to take my word for it.
Leviathan.Chaosx
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By Leviathan.Chaosx 2014-08-07 02:07:15
Quote: Recep Tayyip Erdogan has said Israeli actions in Gaza ‘surpassed what Hitler did to them.’ Now he’s digging in deeper in a letter sent on his behalf to his biggest boosters in Congress.
Turkey’s prime minister, Recep Tayyip Erdogan, has some advice for his strongest supporters in the U.S. Congress: If you don’t like the rise of anti-Semitism that has accompanied Israel’s latest war, then you should pressure Israel to stop killing Palestinians.
An August 5 letter written by one of Erdogan’s top advisers on behalf of the prime minister and obtained by The Daily Beast disputes accusations that his recent statements about Israel were anti-Semitic. Those statements include an assertion on July 19 that Israel’s actions in Gaza “surpassed what Hitler did to them.” A few days earlier, a top newspaper in Turkey affiliated with Erdogan called on Turkish Jews to apologize for the actions of Israel’s military in Gaza.
“Each Israeli attack undermines the peace and tranquility of Jews living all around the world and turns them into targets of hate speech,” wrote Volkan Bozkir, a former Turkish ambassador to the European Union and now an Erdogan adviser and legislator who serves as the chairman of the Turkey-USA Inter-Parliamentary Friendship Caucus and the Turkish parliament’s Foreign Affairs Committee.
He added: “We would therefore recommend that you, instead of trying to silence the legitimate criticisms towards Israel, call on and pressure the Israeli government to put an end to its policies of occupation and destruction. This would be the best and the strongest response to anti-Semitism.” Turkish Leader Doubles Down on Blaming Israel for Anti-Semitism
Bahamut.Ravael
Server: Bahamut
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By Bahamut.Ravael 2014-08-07 02:34:34
But the assumption that everything needs a creator is still there. There is no reason to believe the Universe hasn't always existed, the only thing that has ever supported a Creator is wishful thinking.
Personally I've always thought the idea of a creator is the most disgusting self-centered thought of human nature. That we have some pre-concieved privilege in the Universe is nothing but the most obnoxious manifestation of human ego.
Here's a weird thought. Rather than argue religion in general, let's try something more metaphysical for kicks and giggles. We all see things from a first-person point of view. How does that even happen? What is the criteria that places you in command of the brain you control as opposed to the brain of another being? And what is the criteria for sentience to begin with? Does your computer get a first-person point of view? How about single-cell organisms?
I've actually spoken to single-celled organisms and yes, they do view the world from a first person point of view. Unfortunately you lack the mental capacity to communicate with them because I'm superior to you, so you'll have to take my word for it.
Well, okay. If our recent conversations have proven anything, it's that I often take your word for things.
Bahamut.Ravael
Server: Bahamut
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Posts: 13643
By Bahamut.Ravael 2014-08-07 02:36:09
Quote: Recep Tayyip Erdogan has said Israeli actions in Gaza ‘surpassed what Hitler did to them.’ Now he’s digging in deeper in a letter sent on his behalf to his biggest boosters in Congress.
Turkey’s prime minister, Recep Tayyip Erdogan, has some advice for his strongest supporters in the U.S. Congress: If you don’t like the rise of anti-Semitism that has accompanied Israel’s latest war, then you should pressure Israel to stop killing Palestinians.
An August 5 letter written by one of Erdogan’s top advisers on behalf of the prime minister and obtained by The Daily Beast disputes accusations that his recent statements about Israel were anti-Semitic. Those statements include an assertion on July 19 that Israel’s actions in Gaza “surpassed what Hitler did to them.” A few days earlier, a top newspaper in Turkey affiliated with Erdogan called on Turkish Jews to apologize for the actions of Israel’s military in Gaza.
“Each Israeli attack undermines the peace and tranquility of Jews living all around the world and turns them into targets of hate speech,” wrote Volkan Bozkir, a former Turkish ambassador to the European Union and now an Erdogan adviser and legislator who serves as the chairman of the Turkey-USA Inter-Parliamentary Friendship Caucus and the Turkish parliament’s Foreign Affairs Committee.
He added: “We would therefore recommend that you, instead of trying to silence the legitimate criticisms towards Israel, call on and pressure the Israeli government to put an end to its policies of occupation and destruction. This would be the best and the strongest response to anti-Semitism.” Turkish Leader Doubles Down on Blaming Israel for Anti-Semitism
Oh snap, he went all Godwin's Law up in this joint. All bets are off.
By Jetackuu 2014-08-07 02:42:26
Tell me, how does one occupy it's own land?
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