Crafting's Current Shortcomings And Imbalances

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Crafting's current shortcomings and imbalances
 Bismarck.Hsieh
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By Bismarck.Hsieh 2014-07-10 13:33:27
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Best way to make gil is make mules that synth a consumable that is a quick sale. I only synth items if there's a buyer that wants.
 Bismarck.Ramyrez
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By Bismarck.Ramyrez 2014-07-10 13:35:43
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Some of you are focusing a bit too much on the "profit" aspects here and not as much on the "usefulness" aspects.

What I'm saying is I'd like to see them move crafting in a direction where you don't need to track down one of your severs few goldsmiths.

I'd just like to see them bring a practical, daily application to all crafts (in addition to not-unreasonable methods of higher-tier skilling). As Comeatbebro up there mentioned, the costs involved in even start to HQ stuff is absolutely ridiculous for the results.

There was a time not long ago I would have said it's far too late in the game for an overhaul of the crafting system, but the way they've turned some other things on their ear in the past few years, I think some crafting changes could greatly benefit the long-time dedicated crafters and bring new people into it for the benefit of each server, too.

TL;DR: This isn't me whining "whaaaaa, I can't make money with my craft". I didn't even level my craft(s) for that (mule crafts too). I'm perfectly capable of coming to the conclusion of what to sell to maximize profit for my craft. I've been playing this game a long time and I've got a solid grasp of both economics as a whole and Vana'diel's economy.

What I'm saying is I think we're at a point where they could really take crafting to a new level, balance it out, and make it a bigger part of the game beyond supplying the handful of elite players on each server with every white border they want.
 Bismarck.Herzins
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By Bismarck.Herzins 2014-07-10 13:43:06
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Bismarck.Hsieh said: »
Leathercrafting to my understanding people are buying the +1 aeostaur gear.

Wish +1 aeostaur crap would sell... have tons of +1 crap clogging my inv...
 Cerberus.Conagh
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By Cerberus.Conagh 2014-07-10 13:44:52
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Bismarck.Ramyrez said: »
Some of you are focusing a bit too much on the "profit" aspects here and not as much on the "usefulness" aspects.

What I'm saying is I'd like to see them move crafting in a direction where you don't need to track down one of your severs few goldsmiths.

I'd just like to see them bring a practical, daily application to all crafts (in addition to not-unreasonable methods of higher-tier skilling). As Comeatbebro up there mentioned, the costs involved in even start to HQ stuff is absolutely ridiculous for the results.

There was a time not long ago I would have said it's far too late in the game for an overhaul of the crafting system, but the way they've turned some other things on their ear in the past few years, I think some crafting changes could greatly benefit the long-time dedicated crafters and bring new people into it for the benefit of each server, too.

TL;DR: This isn't me whining "whaaaaa, I can't make money with my craft". I didn't even level my craft(s) for that (mule crafts too). I'm perfectly capable of coming to the conclusion of what to sell to maximize profit for my craft. I've been playing this game a long time and I've got a solid grasp of both economics as a whole and Vana'diel's economy.

What I'm saying is I think we're at a point where they could really take crafting to a new level, balance it out, and make it a bigger part of the game beyond supplying the handful of elite players on each server with every white border they want.

You made a Craft that allowed you to crafter yer own bullets, k I did a craft that allowed me to buy bullets, its semantics, in both senarios you get bullets, one you just make with your own pixels, the other you buy with your own pixels.

While I agree crafting is lack luster and the fact crafts don't make bullets is a complete *** joke, the system is and has always been poorly balanced.
 Bismarck.Ramyrez
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By Bismarck.Ramyrez 2014-07-10 13:47:14
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It's not just semantics (not semantics at all, really), but we're in close enough agreement in practice to not bicker about it.

Like I said. I felt like you did not that long ago. I just feel like with all the other things they've been willing to revamp, why not crafting?
 Valefor.Sapphire
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By Valefor.Sapphire 2014-07-10 13:51:44
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Phoenix.Warusha said: »
Hey man you should level your alchemy to 106 to make spurrina coifs for people. Has been BiS for like two years now. You might even call that useful, or profitable.

There's no market for -1s when there's never mats on the AH, and noone does the content for the abjurations anymore(to create demand).
What little demand remains is crafters with abjs already, hoping they make a -1 for themselves in the process, not to sell because it takes forever to get materials collected.
 Bismarck.Snprphnx
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By Bismarck.Snprphnx 2014-07-10 13:55:07
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I agree with you Ramy. Crafting does need an overhaul. Getting anything to 100 shouldn't be at a huge loss like Goldsmith was for everyone who leveled it a few years ago. The synth kits did help with both cost and availability of materials, and I hope they add more for 60+.

I don't know if SE needs to add armor durability to all existing and future armor, so that you need to get it repaired every so often, and have it be different guild depending on the piece, like Hagondes be clothcraft, Qaaxo leather, etc etc, and include all guilds so that each gets equal stuff to repair.

Or make consumables required to a certain degree. Like a few mobs that use moves that give a long lasting ailment that no spell or JA can erase. Like a potion for Amnesia.
 Bismarck.Ramyrez
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By Bismarck.Ramyrez 2014-07-10 14:01:01
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Bismarck.Snprphnx said: »
I agree with you Ramy. Crafting does need an overhaul. Getting anything to 100 shouldn't be at a huge loss like Goldsmith was for everyone who leveled it a few years ago. The synth kits did help with both cost and availability of materials, and I hope they add more for 60+. I don't know if SE needs to add armor durability to all existing and future armor, so that you need to get it repaired every so often, and have it be different guild depending on the piece, like Hagondes be clothcraft, Qaaxo leather, etc etc, and include all guilds so that each gets equal stuff to repair. Or make consumables required to a certain degree. Like a few mobs that use moves that give a long lasting ailment that no spell or JA can erase. Like a potion for Amnesia.

...it seems self-serving because I'm an Alchemist, but an Amnesia potion would be amazing just on the functionality. Hell, I'd by that from vendors if it were available.
 Asura.Failaras
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By Asura.Failaras 2014-07-10 14:12:10
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Panacea removes Amnesia doesn't it?
 Bismarck.Ramyrez
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By Bismarck.Ramyrez 2014-07-10 14:29:17
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Asura.Failaras said: »
Panacea removes Amnesia doesn't it?

No.

Edit: At least, I didn't think so? Seeing some place say it "potentially" removes it.

I use them quite sparingly, but I don't recall it ever doing so. But the only time I'd have tried would have been in Legion when I already had all the stat down garbage on from the mantis mobs.
 Bismarck.Hsieh
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By Bismarck.Hsieh 2014-07-10 14:47:42
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Asura.Failaras said: »
Panacea removes Amnesia doesn't it?
No. There is no medicine to remove amnesia.
 Bismarck.Hsieh
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By Bismarck.Hsieh 2014-07-10 14:52:33
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Valefor.Sapphire said: »
Phoenix.Warusha said: »
Hey man you should level your alchemy to 106 to make spurrina coifs for people. Has been BiS for like two years now. You might even call that useful, or profitable.

There's no market for -1s when there's never mats on the AH, and noone does the content for the abjurations anymore(to create demand).
What little demand remains is crafters with abjs already, hoping they make a -1 for themselves in the process, not to sell because it takes forever to get materials collected.
I see a market for coif-1 more than any other cursed gear at the moment. It's just that no one wants to take the effort to farm the mats for a small chance of a HQ.
 Bismarck.Ramyrez
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By Bismarck.Ramyrez 2014-07-10 15:04:03
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Bismarck.Hsieh said: »
Valefor.Sapphire said: »
Phoenix.Warusha said: »
Hey man you should level your alchemy to 106 to make spurrina coifs for people. Has been BiS for like two years now. You might even call that useful, or profitable.
There's no market for -1s when there's never mats on the AH, and noone does the content for the abjurations anymore(to create demand). What little demand remains is crafters with abjs already, hoping they make a -1 for themselves in the process, not to sell because it takes forever to get materials collected.
I see a market for coif-1 more than any other cursed gear at the moment. It's just that no one wants to take the effort to farm the mats for a small chance of a HQ.

I would have suspected the jacket-1 to be up there, honestly, but who knows. I actually had a lot of loathing for that particular tier of gear anyhow just because they kept the augments off the NQ until they weren't nearly as worthwhile in many cases. It wasn't like back in the day where an HQ haubergeon was frequently acceptable, but even the HQ was attainable.

Shelling out 10m+ (sometimes 3-4x that or more) for some of those -1s...that was a valid price for them given the difficulty and materials of the synth. Not blaming the crafters. SE is just out of their god damn minds.
 Bismarck.Snprphnx
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By Bismarck.Snprphnx 2014-07-10 15:42:24
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Jacket still sells for a decent amount. Have someone in my shell that still makes them.
 Cerberus.Conagh
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By Cerberus.Conagh 2014-07-10 16:52:26
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Bismarck.Ramyrez said: »
It's not just semantics (not semantics at all, really), but we're in close enough agreement in practice to not bicker about it.

Like I said. I felt like you did not that long ago. I just feel like with all the other things they've been willing to revamp, why not crafting?

Crafting supports those who are dedicated ~
Crafting does not support new players or people who never bothered with it. The updates are not to make long winded stuff useful, they're added for player retention which anyone with a hard to make craft is already somewhat committed, SE would simply rather give immediate rewards not requiring synthesizing to keep less involved players engaged and maintain their income.

While I would argue that creates a false economy a lot of companies do short term bonuses to keep a sinking ship afloat (not arguing ffxi is dead but its not as popular as it once was), the idea is to open new revenue streams and not try to maintain old ones that are slim and won't make them a great deal of gil money.

While I agree a new synthesis system would be nice, or possibly a revamp, it would simply discourage new players unless massively dumbs down and increases the easement of crafting skill progression as this won't open a new world to new / not interested players which would just in turn lower the prices due to over diluting the skill base (Same idea behind making Graduates more plentiful so employers can drive down prices which would again work for the mass populous of the server) which wouldn't benefit you in any sense of making profit, but would increase the idea of using a craft for a purpose.

Overall, they're in a catch 22 position really ~
 Cerberus.Doctorugh
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By Cerberus.Doctorugh 2014-07-10 18:52:34
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Idea: all the stupid idiotic enjoyable seasonal events could have item rewards that only crafters could turn into the final new seasonal item. Keep two groups of people on game who I cant understand at all that deserve a little placation reward.
 Ragnarok.Rieekil
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By Ragnarok.Rieekil 2014-07-10 18:53:25
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did i mention woodworking didnt get any haxed gears ?!
 Bahamut.Soraishin
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By Bahamut.Soraishin 2014-07-11 02:48:54
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Bismarck.Ramyrez said: »
This is just a general ragepost to vent frustration so I appologize if I'm annoying anyone, but is everyone else (aside from the blacksmiths and goldsmiths) sick to the *** yet about the extraordinary amount of favoring those two crafts see?

Admittedly a lot of this rage on my part stems from being an Alchemist and Corsair/Ranger. I'm just about at the end of my rope spending endless amounts of my plasm on bullets, whilst the craft I leveled specifically to make bullets is worthless because SE thinks they're apparently doing everyone a favor by making ammo that doesn't require gil to obtain and letting a craft rot.

As much as I like being able to make panaceas and hallowed water -- assuming I'm willing to take the time to gather all the base materials myself since they're never on the AH -- maybe a real, useful item or two wouldn't go amiss?

dija sword was fun while it lasted, back to cursed cuisses spam for -1's ; ;
 Fenrir.Jinjo
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By Fenrir.Jinjo 2014-07-11 03:58:46
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They've done just about everything in their power to make high level synthesis almost completely undesirable to be honest.
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By Sylph.Hyunkyl 2014-07-11 17:03:57
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Needs some more Cursed Masks -1 on Sylph!
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By Leviathan.Andret 2014-07-17 16:37:45
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Great, this just destroyed any chance I hope to level another craft other than cooking pass lv60. Probably fishing for fish to cook but that's about all I could think of.

I do admit that cooking is 'profitable' as in you're making money by selling your products but not actually very 'profitable' if you factor in the time spend crafting/selling/buying materials from NPC/muling...etc. Economically speaking, if you have another source of money making like dynamis/salvage then you'd be losing by sitting around making food products.