I'm saying I was underpaid at my last job, due to my skillset and talent, my coworkers and some of my superiors would agree. However they weren't in a position to renegotiate my contract, if they were I'd have requested a higher rate.
People are underpaid all the time, and here's the reason why they put up with it: people have households and family's to support, and as long as that is part of the equation your utopia of pure capitalism in regards to employment cannot and will not exist.
You eliminate the need for people to work for a living, and I'd say to gut the minimum wage entirely.
We'll eventually get there (as we will need to, as our population exceeds what it can support) but the ride will be bumpy the longer people refuse to realize what it's coming to.
edit: depending on the potential for overtime pay and the tax bracket it puts me in, I would possibly very well take a lower pay, but I'd most likely take it and work out the deductions myself, a few organizations can always use some donations.
Is The Tea Party Making A Comeback?
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Is the Tea Party Making a Comeback?
Everyone thinks they are underpaid.
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Gilgamesh.Tenshibaby said: » Everyone thinks they are underpaid. A lot of people are underpaid. edit: except for politicians, they are definitely overpaid. Nobody is underpaid. If you are underpaid, you leave.
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Gilgamesh.Tenshibaby said: » Nobody is underpaid. If you are underpaid, you leave. edit: I guess misguided would be more appropriate and a nicer word, since people seem to get in a hissy when you tell them that their minds are not based in reality.
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Jetackuu said: » Gilgamesh.Tenshibaby said: » Nobody is underpaid. If you are underpaid, you leave. oh wise one , why did you leave your previous job if the new job paid better?Oh right, you were underpaid. But wait, you just said that people don't leave because they are underpaid for their jobs, but you just admitted that you were underpaid in your previous job and left because of that. But if you left because you were underpaid, does that mean that the people who you refer to as "delusional" aren't really because you did exactly what the "delusional" crowd said that happens in real world situations? Does that make you delusional instead? Did you insult yourself (again)? Jetackuu said: » Gilgamesh.Tenshibaby said: » Nobody is underpaid. If you are underpaid, you leave. edit: I guess misguided would be more appropriate and a nicer word, since people seem to get in a hissy when you tell them that their minds are not based in reality. And yes, if you get a job offer, you accepted the wages.
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Asura.Kingnobody said: » Jetackuu said: » Gilgamesh.Tenshibaby said: » Nobody is underpaid. If you are underpaid, you leave. oh wise one , why did you leave your previous job if the new job paid better?Oh right, you were underpaid. But wait, you just said that people don't leave because they are underpaid for their jobs, but you just admitted that you were underpaid in your previous job and left because of that. But if you left because you were underpaid, does that mean that the people who you refer to as "delusional" aren't really because you did exactly what the "delusional" crowd said that happens in real world situations? Does that make you delusional instead? Did you insult yourself (again)? When did I say I accepted a new job or left my old one? I never said that people don't leave when they are underpaid. Usually they can't as there's no better offer around, people endure for their families, go figure. I didn't do anything in regards to what you are talking about, so you're really pulling ***out of your *** now. I also didn't insult anyone, words have meanings besides using them as insults you know. Gilgamesh.Tenshibaby said: » Jetackuu said: » Gilgamesh.Tenshibaby said: » Nobody is underpaid. If you are underpaid, you leave. edit: I guess misguided would be more appropriate and a nicer word, since people seem to get in a hissy when you tell them that their minds are not based in reality. And yes, if you get a job offer, you accepted the wages. I've covered it previously and honestly don't feel like repeating myself. People put up with the wages, as they have families to support, but it's certainly not by default what they are worth. Nobody is worth below a living wage, I don't care what kind of shitstain bad employee they are, if they're that bad then can their ***, but if you keep employing them, then pay them a living wage, if your business can't afford it, then go out of business and let some other person who can manage better do it.
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It's been my experience that when a non-conservative uses the term "neocon" they generally have no idea what it means, they just think it sounds cool, kinda ominous.
And yes, people are worth less than a "living wage", even if we use my definition, which is less than what you neolibs think it is. Any healthy person can live on minimum wage. The idea that "living" means not having to split the rent with someone or do without certain luxuries is absurd. Gilgamesh.Tenshibaby said: » It's been my experience that when a non-conservative uses the term "neocon" they generally have no idea what it means, they just think it sounds cool, kinda ominous. And yes, people are worth less than a "living wage", even if we use my definition, which is less than what you neolibs think it is. Any healthy person can live on minimum wage. The idea that "living" means not having to split the rent with someone or do without certain luxuries is absurd. 1. I'm not a neo anything, except maybe a neorealist. 2. People cannot survive on just minimum wage in many parts of the country, and no sharing room and board with 5 other people being around drugs all the time isn't "living." 3. I don't know what you consider luxuries, but short of inner cities a car and a phone are necessities, and the more of a clunker you buy the more you have to upkeep it, and those unexpected bills can really hurt a lot of people. I don't consider TV a necessity, and internet isn't yet but it's getting that way. Also: heating healthy is more expensive than crappy eating, even if you make everything at home, and living with several others it just becomes worse. Obviously people are making do with real shitty situations, but they shouldn't have to, their employers should pay them a living wage, instead of profiting off government subsidies, and the poor trying to scrape by.
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Our culture of consumerism doesn't help things, but it isn't the root of the poverty problem.
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As far as the leave your job and get a new one goes; My last job was working under the table for less than minimum wage; then dumb ***like a 2hr shift or a 12 hour shift. Would be expected to come in at any time they needed, or not scheduled for up to 2 weeks at a time and you know why I didn't leave? It was more money than I'd be making if I quit; and I couldn't even get a job at McDonalds (which I actually tried on numerous occasions while I was working at that place).
Sometimes you deal with *** to get paid. Now I'm not saying that ppl who aren't happy shouldn't be out actively looking for something else, as I sure was, but that doesn't guarantee anything
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Jetackuu said: » Gilgamesh.Tenshibaby said: » It's been my experience that when a non-conservative uses the term "neocon" they generally have no idea what it means, they just think it sounds cool, kinda ominous. And yes, people are worth less than a "living wage", even if we use my definition, which is less than what you neolibs think it is. Any healthy person can live on minimum wage. The idea that "living" means not having to split the rent with someone or do without certain luxuries is absurd. 1. I'm not a neo anything, except maybe a neorealist. 2. People cannot survive on just minimum wage in many parts of the country, and no sharing room and board with 5 other people being around drugs all the time isn't "living." 3. I don't know what you consider luxuries, but short of inner cities a car and a phone are necessities, and the more of a clunker you buy the more you have to upkeep it, and those unexpected bills can really hurt a lot of people. I don't consider TV a necessity, and internet isn't yet but it's getting that way. Also: heating healthy is more expensive than crappy eating, even if you make everything at home, and living with several others it just becomes worse. Obviously people are making do with real shitty situations, but they shouldn't have to, their employers should pay them a living wage, instead of profiting off government subsidies, and the poor trying to scrape by. //and no sharing room and board with 5 other people being around drugs all the time isn't "living."// The bulk of your fail is in that statement. Think about it before you reply. Ever heard of a straw man? Hyperbole? Doesn't surprise me. They were showing the polls on the news here and no one was showing up. the places were completely empty except 1 or 2 voters at a time for the 30/40 booths.
You guys are wasting your time, is it any surprise that Conservatives/Libertarians would support a labor economy that favors undercutting bids? These are the same types of people that attempted to re legalize slavery by proposing legislation that would abolish the minimum wage. (But you can quit if you aren't paid enough!!!!)
Source
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Odin.Zicdeh said: » You guys are wasting your time, is it any surprise that Conservatives/Libertarians would support a labor economy that favors undercutting bids? These are the same types of people that attempted to re legalize slavery by proposing legislation that would abolish the minimum wage. (But you can quit if you aren't paid enough!!!!) Source
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So you're pro-market, anti-globalization?
Can't we all just get along? All Politrickcians are bad. Once everyone sees that we will ascend to a higher state of being due to having attained enlightenment.
... I guess that's never gonna happen. Never mind go back to senseless arguing. Apparently one the first things this guy said about winning is god gave us a miracle. This does not give em high hopes of this guy doing anything good.
Gilgamesh.Tenshibaby said: » So much fail... And you call US "delusional"? Do you not appreciate that words have meanings? Cars and phones are luxuries. The fact that you don't understand that tells a lot. Anyone can find a job somewhere where they can walk or ride a bike to work. If not, go live somewhere with public transportation. Phones are luxuries , but the small price one must pay to get a phone renders further discussion of that moot. Eating healthier is cheaper than eating unhealthily, not that it matters to the people who have a lifetime of making poor decisions, and therefore are earning minimum wage. A pound of rice and a dozen eggs cost roughly the same price as a Happy Meal. Not where you live? Move. //and no sharing room and board with 5 other people being around drugs all the time isn't "living."// The bulk of your fail is in that statement. Think about it before you reply. Ever heard of a straw man? Hyperbole? Words only have meaning when you give them meaning. You are delusional if you don't think cars and phones are a necessity in today's world, not everyone has the luxury of being able to pick up and move whenever they please. I see no further discussion will suffice as you are so far out of touch it isn't funny. The bulk of your fail is that you don't realize that people are living in shitty conditions while corporations make ridiculous profits on the backs of the poor, while trying to eliminate the middle class as well. You keep supporting a system that will only have a negative impact on you, so go for it.
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Gilgamesh.Tenshibaby said: » Odin.Zicdeh said: » You guys are wasting your time, is it any surprise that Conservatives/Libertarians would support a labor economy that favors undercutting bids? These are the same types of people that attempted to re legalize slavery by proposing legislation that would abolish the minimum wage. (But you can quit if you aren't paid enough!!!!) Source notrly. It's tough to take a stance on that subject for two reasons: 1) America is a nation of Immigrants. Why is our generation special that we decide others can't enter now? -but- 2) If everyone leaves their shitty country to come to our country, it'll just make our place shitty too. Then the only winners are those who take money out of the American economy and send it over the borders. That's just the broadstrokes obviously, and I can break down each of those salient points into dozens more.
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Asura.Kingnobody said: » Jetackuu said: » Gilgamesh.Tenshibaby said: » Nobody is underpaid. If you are underpaid, you leave. oh wise one , why did you leave your previous job if the new job paid better?Oh right, you were underpaid. But wait, you just said that people don't leave because they are underpaid for their jobs, but you just admitted that you were underpaid in your previous job and left because of that. But if you left because you were underpaid, does that mean that the people who you refer to as "delusional" aren't really because you did exactly what the "delusional" crowd said that happens in real world situations? Does that make you delusional instead? Did you insult yourself (again)? Some people do leave because they can get more money elsewhere... it doesn't necassarily mean they were underpaid, just that someone is willing to pay them more to do smoething else... they might even be doing different work... There is an actual monetary value to an employee but it isn't measured by what someone is willing to pay you lol... That is just what it is... what someone is willing to pay you... Zicdeh, remind me to have a chat with you sometime about the economy, I'm fairly certain It'd be an enlightening endeavor for me.
I'm not sure if I'm supposed to take that as a patronizing statement or not. The small part of myself I bury with objectivity that tends to be a bit of a paranoid schizophrenic is telling me you're being a *** who's here to "Educate" my ignorance. What should I tell him???
Jetackuu said: » When did I say I accepted a new job or left my old one? Jetackuu said: » I'm saying I was underpaid at my last job Jetackuu said: » I never said that people don't leave when they are underpaid. Usually they can't as there's no better offer around, people endure for their families, go figure. What is keeping you from looking for another job if you feel your current one is not paying you enough? Or are you going to say that your jobs always tie you down to the desk and demand you work for peanuts while your bosses reap the benefits of your stupidity? Odin.Zicdeh said: » You guys are wasting your time, is it any surprise that Conservatives/Libertarians would support a labor economy that favors undercutting bids? These are the same types of people that attempted to re legalize slavery by proposing legislation that would abolish the minimum wage. (But you can quit if you aren't paid enough!!!!) Jetackuu said: » You are delusional if you don't think cars and phones are a necessity in today's world, not everyone has the luxury of being able to pick up and move whenever they please. And what is keeping you from using a landline again? Or right, you want the latest gadget and would go into debt for it... It is called "living within your means" and it is something you obviously lack (also called common sense, but you are going to argue about that point anyway, so why bother). Jetackuu said: » The bulk of your fail is that you don't realize that people are living in shitty conditions while corporations make ridiculous profits on the backs of the poor, while trying to eliminate the middle class as well. Lakshmi.Flavin said: » Pay isn't always a factor when people decide to move to new jobs.. could be that it's something they really want to do. Could be that they take a pay cut to get a job with better opportunities... maybe they don't want to deal with the people they work with anymore... the possibilities are out there... money isn't the sole motivating factor for picking a career path... Lakshmi.Flavin said: » Some people do leave because they can get more money elsewhere... it doesn't necassarily mean they were underpaid, just that someone is willing to pay them more to do smoething else... they might even be doing different work... |
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