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Donald Sterling banned from NBA Games for life
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By Asura.Kingnobody 2014-04-30 12:52:01
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Ragnarok.Yatenkou
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By Ragnarok.Yatenkou 2014-04-30 12:52:10
The method in which the tapes were obtained, illegal or otherwise, has no bearing on the consequences suffered by Sterling from a private organization. As reasoned multiple times before, they are separate matters. You are correct. I don't think anyone was arguing what the NBA did to Sterling. I believe the argument is "Did TMZ break the law by releasing said information in the first place, and will/should they be held accountable." If you read (and understood) what people wrote, you wouldn't be trying to create an argument nobody was arguing with you about. Freedom of the press
Wait wait hang on a moment, if these are leaked phone lines, isn't that an invasion of someone's privacy?
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By Asura.Kingnobody 2014-04-30 12:54:02
Ragnarok.Yatenkou said: »The method in which the tapes were obtained, illegal or otherwise, has no bearing on the consequences suffered by Sterling from a private organization. As reasoned multiple times before, they are separate matters. You are correct. I don't think anyone was arguing what the NBA did to Sterling. I believe the argument is "Did TMZ break the law by releasing said information in the first place, and will/should they be held accountable." If you read (and understood) what people wrote, you wouldn't be trying to create an argument nobody was arguing with you about. Freedom of the press
Wait wait hang on a moment, if these are leaked phone lines, isn't that an invasion of someone's privacy? It is. Illegal search and seizure of information used to slander a private citizen.
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Leviathan.Syagin
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By Leviathan.Syagin 2014-04-30 12:54:16
I didn't misunderstand anything. The current excuse for Sterling is that his conversation was private or somehow constitutionally protected. Neither of those matter to his current situation. No need to carry water for every rich white guy that gets in trouble. This has nothing to do with privacy... idk why that word keep flying around.
Leviathan.Syagin
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By Leviathan.Syagin 2014-04-30 12:56:39
Ragnarok.Yatenkou said: »The method in which the tapes were obtained, illegal or otherwise, has no bearing on the consequences suffered by Sterling from a private organization. As reasoned multiple times before, they are separate matters. You are correct. I don't think anyone was arguing what the NBA did to Sterling. I believe the argument is "Did TMZ break the law by releasing said information in the first place, and will/should they be held accountable." If you read (and understood) what people wrote, you wouldn't be trying to create an argument nobody was arguing with you about. Freedom of the press Wait wait hang on a moment, if these are leaked phone lines, isn't that an invasion of someone's privacy? It is. Illegal search and seizure of information used to slander a private citizen.
not if one of the parties involved in the conversation hands it over.
Lakshmi.Zerowone
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By Lakshmi.Zerowone 2014-04-30 13:07:15
looooooooool
If you're arguing about the application of constitutional law to this situation, you're astoundingly ignorant.
The method in which the tapes were obtained, illegal or otherwise, has no bearing on the consequences suffered by Sterling from a private organization. As reasoned multiple times before, they are separate matters.
Even with the constitutional right to privacy we are not protected from private citizens or corporations. I don't understand why I've been seeing certain people getting on a soap box in face book feeds about violation of rights with respect to this matter. Yeah the evidence would be inadmissible in a court of law, but this wasn't a court of law etc etc. Sometimes social media demonstrates how the education system has failed a lot of people when the soapbox comes out.
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By Asura.Kingnobody 2014-04-30 13:20:56
Ragnarok.Yatenkou said: »The method in which the tapes were obtained, illegal or otherwise, has no bearing on the consequences suffered by Sterling from a private organization. As reasoned multiple times before, they are separate matters. You are correct. I don't think anyone was arguing what the NBA did to Sterling. I believe the argument is "Did TMZ break the law by releasing said information in the first place, and will/should they be held accountable." If you read (and understood) what people wrote, you wouldn't be trying to create an argument nobody was arguing with you about. Freedom of the press Wait wait hang on a moment, if these are leaked phone lines, isn't that an invasion of someone's privacy? It is. Illegal search and seizure of information used to slander a private citizen.
not if one of the parties involved in the conversation hands it over. Already debunked
Also, CA is a "two-party consent" state
In order to release a conversation to the public, both parties have to consent to it in CA. Sterling didn't, so there goes that little theory of yours.
You should backread some.
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By Shiva.Viciousss 2014-04-30 13:37:14
TMZ didn't do anything, they were handed the tapes. Keep up. They were handed the tapes that were illegally obtained
And they released it for your entertainment value (and advertising money).
Makes you wonder how these tapes were obtained in the first place, if it was a third party who obtained it or if it was TMZ who taped it in the first place.
But since you and Pleebo are ok with people being wiretapped for your own entertainment, then neither of you can ever complain about a certain Act passed by a certain administration ever again....
So you believe her then? A mistress that is being sued for money she doesn't have denies something and you just run to her side, cute. Doesn't prove anything. And I have never complained about the Patriot Act before, why would I now?
Cerberus.Pleebo
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By Cerberus.Pleebo 2014-04-30 13:40:23
The current excuse for Sterling is that his conversation was private or somehow constitutionally protected. It was private.
The Constitution was earlier misrepresented by myself, which have been corrected by me, but if you bothered to even read it before inserting your foot in your mouth, you would have seen that. It has since been corrected, and even shown that there would not even be a defense for TMZ to hide behind.
No need to carry water for every rich white guy that gets in trouble. Why are you playing the race card? Or is that the only way you know to backpedal out of your own mistake? You're still wrong since it isn't slander. Nothing released was falsified information.
Leviathan.Chaosx
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By Leviathan.Chaosx 2014-04-30 13:41:50
What is this falsified information you speak of?
Bismarck.Bloodrose
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By Bismarck.Bloodrose 2014-04-30 13:45:30
I did some more digging around about the two party consent law in California. This is what I came across:
Quote: California Wiretapping Law
California's wiretapping law is a "two-party consent" law. California makes it a crime to record or eavesdrop on any confidential communication, including a private conversation or telephone call, without the consent of all parties to the conversation. See Cal. Penal Code ยง 632. The statute applies to "confidential communications" -- i.e., conversations in which one of the parties has an objectively reasonable expectation that no one is listening in or overhearing the conversation. See Flanagan v. Flanagan, 41 P.3d 575, 576-77, 578-82 (Cal. 2002). A California appellate court has ruled that this statute applies to the use of hidden video cameras to record conversations as well. See California v. Gibbons, 215 Cal. App. 3d 1204 (Cal Ct. App. 1989).
If you are recording someone without their knowledge in a public or semi-public place like a street or restaurant, the person whom you're recording may or may not have "an objectively reasonable expectation that no one is listening in or overhearing the conversation," and the reasonableness of the expectation would depend on the particular factual circumstances. Therefore, you cannot necessarily assume that you are in the clear simply because you are in a public place.
If you are operating in California, you should always get the consent of all parties before recording any conversation that common sense tells you might be "private" or "confidential." In addition to subjecting you to criminal prosecution, violating the California wiretapping law can expose you to a civil lawsuit for damages by an injured party. See Cal. Penal Code ยง 637.2.
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By Asura.Kingnobody 2014-04-30 13:45:43
Vic is accusing me of white knighting a woman I could care less for, and Pleebo is trying to redefine slander.
Both of which are defending their entertainment show though.
Either that or trolling us all by being obtuse. Who knows.
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Cerberus.Pleebo
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By Cerberus.Pleebo 2014-04-30 13:46:56
Go look up the word slander. Like, right now.
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Leviathan.Chaosx
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By Leviathan.Chaosx 2014-04-30 13:47:47
Nazis.
Bismarck.Bloodrose
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By Bismarck.Bloodrose 2014-04-30 13:50:20
If I called Pleebo a ***, without any indication of what made him different than the norm, that would be slanderous - because it's falsified or undocumented information meant to cause defamation of character.
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By Shiva.Viciousss 2014-04-30 13:53:10
Bismarck.Bloodrose said: »I did some more digging around about the two party consent law in California. This is what I came across:
Quote: California Wiretapping Law
California's wiretapping law is a "two-party consent" law. California makes it a crime to record or eavesdrop on any confidential communication, including a private conversation or telephone call, without the consent of all parties to the conversation. See Cal. Penal Code ยง 632. The statute applies to "confidential communications" -- i.e., conversations in which one of the parties has an objectively reasonable expectation that no one is listening in or overhearing the conversation. See Flanagan v. Flanagan, 41 P.3d 575, 576-77, 578-82 (Cal. 2002). A California appellate court has ruled that this statute applies to the use of hidden video cameras to record conversations as well. See California v. Gibbons, 215 Cal. App. 3d 1204 (Cal Ct. App. 1989).
If you are recording someone without their knowledge in a public or semi-public place like a street or restaurant, the person whom you're recording may or may not have "an objectively reasonable expectation that no one is listening in or overhearing the conversation," and the reasonableness of the expectation would depend on the particular factual circumstances. Therefore, you cannot necessarily assume that you are in the clear simply because you are in a public place.
If you are operating in California, you should always get the consent of all parties before recording any conversation that common sense tells you might be "private" or "confidential." In addition to subjecting you to criminal prosecution, violating the California wiretapping law can expose you to a civil lawsuit for damages by an injured party. See Cal. Penal Code ยง 637.2.
In other words, no crime has been committed, since Sterling arranges for all of his conversations to be recorded.
Lakshmi.Zerowone
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By Lakshmi.Zerowone 2014-04-30 13:53:50
Bismarck.Bloodrose said: »If I called Pleebo a ***, without any indication of what made him different than the norm, that would be slanderous - because it's falsified or undocumented information meant to cause defamation of character.
well, since its in written form it's libel.
Bismarck.Bloodrose
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By Bismarck.Bloodrose 2014-04-30 13:56:50
Bismarck.Bloodrose said: »I did some more digging around about the two party consent law in California. This is what I came across:
Quote: California Wiretapping Law
California's wiretapping law is a "two-party consent" law. California makes it a crime to record or eavesdrop on any confidential communication, including a private conversation or telephone call, without the consent of all parties to the conversation. See Cal. Penal Code ยง 632. The statute applies to "confidential communications" -- i.e., conversations in which one of the parties has an objectively reasonable expectation that no one is listening in or overhearing the conversation. See Flanagan v. Flanagan, 41 P.3d 575, 576-77, 578-82 (Cal. 2002). A California appellate court has ruled that this statute applies to the use of hidden video cameras to record conversations as well. See California v. Gibbons, 215 Cal. App. 3d 1204 (Cal Ct. App. 1989).
If you are recording someone without their knowledge in a public or semi-public place like a street or restaurant, the person whom you're recording may or may not have "an objectively reasonable expectation that no one is listening in or overhearing the conversation," and the reasonableness of the expectation would depend on the particular factual circumstances. Therefore, you cannot necessarily assume that you are in the clear simply because you are in a public place.
If you are operating in California, you should always get the consent of all parties before recording any conversation that common sense tells you might be "private" or "confidential." In addition to subjecting you to criminal prosecution, violating the California wiretapping law can expose you to a civil lawsuit for damages by an injured party. See Cal. Penal Code ยง 637.2.
In other words, no crime has been committed, since Sterling arranges for all of his conversations to be recorded. Actually, in the basis of the law, a crime was committed: Sterling never gave any consent for the "eavesdropping" of his conversation, but consent was given between TMZ, and his ex-girlfriend, who has as much right to share any recorded message that she is a part of.
It can be tricky to interpret this particular case in conjunction with the law.
Cerberus.Pleebo
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By Cerberus.Pleebo 2014-04-30 13:57:28
Bismarck.Bloodrose said: »If I called Pleebo a ***, without any indication of what made him different than the norm, that would be slanderous - because it's falsified or undocumented information meant to cause defamation of character.
well, since its in written form it's libel. And since it's true, it's neither, lol.
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Bismarck.Bloodrose
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By Bismarck.Bloodrose 2014-04-30 13:57:44
Bismarck.Bloodrose said: »If I called Pleebo a ***, without any indication of what made him different than the norm, that would be slanderous - because it's falsified or undocumented information meant to cause defamation of character.
well, since its in written form it's libel. True, and I should have known that.
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By Shiva.Viciousss 2014-04-30 14:00:13
How is it eavesdropping if he consents to the recording of his phone calls?
Bismarck.Bloodrose
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By Bismarck.Bloodrose 2014-04-30 14:02:59
How is it eavesdropping if he consents to the recording of his phone calls? Based on the interpretation of the law, he has reasonable expectation to believe that his communications, while recorded, are still private and confidential. Because he has a stake in the conversation, and without his consent, TMZ was given access to listen in on the entirety of the recorded communication. That still counts as eavesdropping.
Edit: I had to add this:
Quote: 631. (a) Any person who, by means of any machine, instrument, or
contrivance, or in any other manner, intentionally taps, or makes any
unauthorized connection, whether physically, electrically,
acoustically, inductively, or otherwise, with any telegraph or
telephone wire, line, cable, or instrument, including the wire, line,
cable, or instrument of any internal telephonic communication
system, or who willfully and without the consent of all parties to
the communication, or in any unauthorized manner, reads, or attempts
to read, or to learn the contents or meaning of any message, report,
or communication while the same is in transit or passing over any
wire, line, or cable, or is being sent from, or received at any place
within this state; or who uses, or attempts to use, in any manner,
or for any purpose, or to communicate in any way, any information so
obtained, or who aids, agrees with, employs, or conspires with any
person or persons to unlawfully do, or permit, or cause to be done
any of the acts or things mentioned above in this section, is
punishable by a fine not exceeding two thousand five hundred dollars
($2,500), or by imprisonment in the county jail not exceeding one
year, or by imprisonment pursuant to subdivision (h) of Section 1170,
or by both a fine and imprisonment in the county jail or pursuant to
subdivision (h) of Section 1170. If the person has previously been
convicted of a violation of this section or Section 632, 632.5,
632.6, 632.7, or 636, he or she is punishable by a fine not exceeding
ten thousand dollars ($10,000), or by imprisonment in the county
jail not exceeding one year, or by imprisonment pursuant to
subdivision (h) of Section 1170, or by both that fine and
imprisonment.
(b) This section shall not apply (1) to any public utility engaged
in the business of providing communications services and facilities,
or to the officers, employees or agents thereof, where the acts
otherwise prohibited herein are for the purpose of construction,
maintenance, conduct or operation of the services and facilities of
the public utility, or (2) to the use of any instrument, equipment,
facility, or service furnished and used pursuant to the tariffs of a
public utility, or (3) to any telephonic communication system used
for communication exclusively within a state, county, city and
county, or city correctional facility.
(c) Except as proof in an action or prosecution for violation of
this section, no evidence obtained in violation of this section shall
be admissible in any judicial, administrative, legislative, or other
proceeding.
(d) This section shall become operative on January 1, 1994.
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Valefor.Endoq
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By Valefor.Endoq 2014-04-30 14:07:22
By kenshynofshiva 2014-04-30 14:08:56
Eavesdropping is the act of secretly listening to the private conversation of others without their consent, as defined by Black's Law Dictionary.[1] This is commonly thought to be unethical and there is an old adage that "eavesdroppers seldom hear anything good of themselves...eavesdroppers always try to listen to matters that concern them."[2]
Lakshmi.Zerowone
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By Lakshmi.Zerowone 2014-04-30 14:13:55
Bismarck.Bloodrose said: »If I called Pleebo a ***, without any indication of what made him different than the norm, that would be slanderous - because it's falsified or undocumented information meant to cause defamation of character.
well, since its in written form it's libel. And since it's true, it's neither, lol.
SEMANTICS!!!!
Leviathan.Syagin
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By Leviathan.Syagin 2014-04-30 14:16:27
Ragnarok.Yatenkou said: »The method in which the tapes were obtained, illegal or otherwise, has no bearing on the consequences suffered by Sterling from a private organization. As reasoned multiple times before, they are separate matters. You are correct. I don't think anyone was arguing what the NBA did to Sterling. I believe the argument is "Did TMZ break the law by releasing said information in the first place, and will/should they be held accountable." If you read (and understood) what people wrote, you wouldn't be trying to create an argument nobody was arguing with you about. Freedom of the press Wait wait hang on a moment, if these are leaked phone lines, isn't that an invasion of someone's privacy? It is. Illegal search and seizure of information used to slander a private citizen. not if one of the parties involved in the conversation hands it over. Already debunked Also, CA is a "two-party consent" state In order to release a conversation to the public, both parties have to consent to it in CA. Sterling didn't, so there goes that little theory of yours. You should backread some. Congratulations, have another pointless fact http://www.google.com/url?q=http://www.theepochtimes.com/n3/648506-donald-sterling-son-found-dead-is-old-news-story-saying-scott-daniel-sterling-died-happened-a-year-ago/&sa=U&ei=4UthU9KwAoyeyASYo4LoAw&ved=0CB4QqQIwAA&usg=AFQjCNFddZC7fiLtN6FSPJFk-fQHuWyB5w
Bismarck.Bloodrose
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By Bismarck.Bloodrose 2014-04-30 14:16:37
Personally I think Sterling got what he had coming, at least in the context of being banned for life and forced to sell the Clippers, after 25 years of dragging the organization's name through the mud.
Additionally, he can't sue the NBA or other team owners for voting him out either, due to the recorded conversation - that's a separate issue between him, his lawyer, his ex-gf and her lawyer, and TMZ and their lawyers for damages suffered.
Also, the truth is not an absolute defense in cases of slander or libel. Regardless of the truth behind an allegation being 100%, you can still be sued for the way the truth was presented, in order to damage or cause defamation of character to a person or entity.
Cerberus.Pleebo
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By Cerberus.Pleebo 2014-04-30 14:17:01
TMZ didn't record those calls, and they're protected from any criminal prosecution for releasing them by the 1st Amendment. His ex-girlfiend can claim ignorance as to how they got to TMZ and TMZ doesn't have to divulge its source. The piece of ***racist lost and there's nothing he can do about it.
Leviathan.Chaosx
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By Leviathan.Chaosx 2014-04-30 14:19:21
TMZ didn't record those calls, and they're protected from any criminal prosecution for releasing them by the 1st Amendment. His ex-girlfiend can claim ignorance as to how they got to TMZ and TMZ doesn't have to divulge its source. The piece of ***racist lost and there's nothing he can do about it. Ignorance as a legal defense? Wow.
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By Lakshmi.Kingofbastok 2014-04-30 14:20:40
According to the Wiretapping Law, couldn't Sterling be guilty of breaking it then, unless he specifically gets consent to record the conversations from the other party?
Donald Sterling has been banned for life from NBA Games and any activity concerning his team, The Los Angeles Clippers, and fined $2.5 million after a phone conversation between Sterling and his then girlfriend was leaked, containing racially-charged rhetoric. Discuss.
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