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Breast Feeding
Server: Odin
Game: FFXI
Posts: 943
By Odin.Calipso 2014-02-26 12:46:35
I'd also like to point out, that we're generally taught and it's a societal norm that it's not ok to look/stare (especially at women), and if you do you can quickly be classified as a creep/perv. When someones doing something really blatant 2-5 feet away from you, it can be a little hard not to look/see even if you're trying not to. I think this is what leads people to be uncomfortable, because they're unintentionally feeling like perverts for looking when they didn't mean to.
At least that's the way it kinda seems to me =/
Lakshmi.Flavin
Server: Lakshmi
Game: FFXI
Posts: 18466
By Lakshmi.Flavin 2014-02-26 12:49:20
Perhaps the better way to get people to embrace it would be to continue feeding openly so people get used to it and it becomes "normal". Kowtowing to prudes and the perpetually outraged doesn't really send that message. I think we should do this with murder too. It's all well and good that you apply this logic to every thread on this site but sometimes there's a reason something isn't socially acceptable. Before this gets turned around on me, I'm not saying that I'm against gay marriage/interracial-dating/insert-token-debate-here.... It's just this "point" has absolutely nothing to back it up. "If we ***in public eventually people will get used to it." "Only nagging prudish nay-sayers who constantly *** anyhow wouldn't approve of a woman chewing food and regurgitating it into her children's mouth in public." "Because if you see it enough, you'll end up being desensitized to it" is not always a solution. What's the solution then? *** about it til it goes away or people do what you want them to? It's already legal. It's not physically harming anyone. Just because your precious sensibilities are offended doesn't mean others should be forced to change their lifestyle.
This whole topic is a non-issue.
By fonewear 2014-02-26 12:51:26
I was breastfeeding in the park the other day and I got a bunch of awkward stares.
I told the people "my eyes are up here".
Server: Asura
Game: FFXI
Posts: 34187
By Asura.Kingnobody 2014-02-26 12:51:41
Just because your precious sensibilities are offended doesn't mean others should be forced to change their lifestyle. Ah, but there is the actual problem.
It isn't that person A is disgusted by mother B breastfeeding, it is because person A wants to control what mother B, C, D, E, and F should do with their lives.
As I said on page 1.
Just another example of "It's ok to infringe your rights as a citizen until it's your right being infringed."
Server: Asura
Game: FFXI
Posts: 34187
By Asura.Kingnobody 2014-02-26 12:52:34
I was breastfeeding in the park the other day and I got a bunch of awkward stares. I would stare at you too if you were breastfeeding in public.
Since, you know, you can't produce milk...ever....
By fonewear 2014-02-26 12:54:21
I was breastfeeding in the park the other day and I got a bunch of awkward stares. I would stare at you too if you were breastfeeding in public.
Since, you know, you can't produce milk...ever....
It was a political statement.
Breasts represent male dominated society.
Milk represents my love of Oreos.
Bismarck.Ramyrez
Server: Bismarck
Game: FFXI
Posts: 4746
By Bismarck.Ramyrez 2014-02-26 12:56:25
Quote: Being terrified of the possibility of a slack-jawed gawker is kind of a sexist thought on a woman's part, no?
You've greater faith in humanity than I.
Ragnarok.Ashman
Server: Ragnarok
Game: FFXI
Posts: 4252
By Ragnarok.Ashman 2014-02-26 12:56:45
Perhaps the better way to get people to embrace it would be to continue feeding openly so people get used to it and it becomes "normal". Kowtowing to prudes and the perpetually outraged doesn't really send that message.
I think we should do this with murder too. It's all well and good that you apply this logic to every thread on this site but sometimes there's a reason something isn't socially acceptable.
Before this gets turned around on me, I'm not saying that I'm against gay marriage/interracial-dating/insert-token-debate-here....
It's just this "point" has absolutely nothing to back it up. "If we ***in public eventually people will get used to it." "Only nagging prudish nay-sayers who constantly *** anyhow wouldn't approve of a woman chewing food and regurgitating it into her children's mouth in public."
"Because if you see it enough, you'll end up being desensitized to it" is not always a solution.
Ummm... When you have a group of friends who all have children of various ages, men progressively become more desensitized to it, from what I've seen. Granted, the blanket is the unspoken courtesy, but it becomes par for the course when gathering for birthdays, barbecues, or just BSing around in the garage with neighbors who are close. No one is going to scream, "GO AWAY! You can't socialize!"
Kind of indicative of the level of maturity and experience of men. I can't think of many that would turn into pre-pubescent, giggle-pusses at around age thirty over a boob under a blanket, unless they're on FFXIAH.
Being terrified of the possibility of a slack-jawed gawker is kind of a sexist thought on a woman's part, no?
This is a bit different from blindly making the assumption, or pressing your choice on Joe Stranger. I wouldn't have a problem if someone did it near me but that doesn't make it polite to just DO it.
Hell, even if this woman turned to the person next to her and said "I'm sorry but my baby needs to be fed, i hope you don't mind" or something.
The fact she asks on public media, then gets upset about the answer and demands to see a written policy kind of stinks to me of "trying to make something of it".
I just think there's a courtesy to human interaction that some people take for granted. I wouldn't smoke at someones house without asking if it was ok and then using an ash tray. I wouldn't just help myself to someone else's shower and then stroll out without a towel. I know these aren't the best comparisons but I'm having trouble trying to convey the intangible quality of manners/tact that seem to be lacking from the OP.
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Server: Odin
Game: FFXI
Posts: 943
By Odin.Calipso 2014-02-26 12:57:09
Actually, men can (and do) produce milk to breastfeed their children :p
Cerberus.Pleebo
Server: Cerberus
Game: FFXI
Posts: 9720
By Cerberus.Pleebo 2014-02-26 12:57:59
FFS, she's not pissing at a public bus stop or shitting in the potted plants at the mall. It's feeding a kid. I get the impression that most of the people here accept public breastfeeding as a necessity at some times, but find it uncomfortable to see it done out in the open. The conflict there is just so unnecessary since we all acknowledge how beneficial it is, but people insist on putting that aside because THEY MIGHT SEE AN UNCLOTHED BOOB.
What are the odds that this is even a consistent problem for the average person? You might run into someone breastfeeding, what, maybe a few times a year if you go out a lot? Is that really a problem?
Hell, even if the public didn't care about seeing these things, most women would still probably opt to breastfeed privately because it's likely more sanitary.
By fonewear 2014-02-26 12:57:59
Actually, men can (and do) produce milk to breastfeed their children :p
I only produce chocolate milk though...
Server: Asura
Game: FFXI
Posts: 34187
By Asura.Kingnobody 2014-02-26 13:01:09
Actually, men can (and do) produce milk to breastfeed their children :p Did not know that...
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By fonewear 2014-02-26 13:01:56
Normally I produce milk by going to the grocery store. People are still impressed though.
Lakshmi.Flavin
Server: Lakshmi
Game: FFXI
Posts: 18466
By Lakshmi.Flavin 2014-02-26 13:04:45
THEY MIGHT SEE AN UNCLOTHED BOOB. It's not porn so it is unacceptable. now..
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Bahamut.Kara
Server: Bahamut
Game: FFXI
Posts: 3544
By Bahamut.Kara 2014-02-26 13:06:23
Strange but True: Males Can Lactate
Unless you are an Indonesian fruit bat, though, it probably won't happen naturally
There are also not enough documented cases to test if the milk is actually nourishing the baby.
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Caitsith.Zahrah
Server: Caitsith
Game: FFXI
By Caitsith.Zahrah 2014-02-26 13:06:27
What are the odds that this is even a consistent problem for the average person? You might run into someone breastfeeding, what, maybe a few times a year if you go out a lot? Is that really a problem?.
^^^ This! ^^^
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By fonewear 2014-02-26 13:10:43
Strange but True: Males Can Lactate
Unless you are an Indonesian fruit bat, though, it probably won't happen naturally
There are also not enough documented cases to test if the milk is actually nourishing the baby.
So I can't make a living selling my breast milk damn it !
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Server: Odin
Game: FFXI
Posts: 943
By Odin.Calipso 2014-02-26 13:11:53
Quote: Being terrified of the possibility of a slack-jawed gawker is kind of a sexist thought on a woman's part, no?
You've greater faith in humanity than I.
I'm not really paranoid (or vain) to the point where I thought every time I was publicly breastfeeding there was some creep watching me, but thinking that it would never happen to anyone ever is a little silly. Even through 2 kids and a few years of breastfeeding, the thought of it even happening just once was at least part of what made me try to be discreet. Even without the thought of some potential creeper, my main motivation was that I just didn't want to show my breasts to the public. Is that really so weird?
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Lakshmi.Flavin
Server: Lakshmi
Game: FFXI
Posts: 18466
By Lakshmi.Flavin 2014-02-26 13:12:42
Strange but True: Males Can Lactate Unless you are an Indonesian fruit bat, though, it probably won't happen naturally There are also not enough documented cases to test if the milk is actually nourishing the baby. Start devouring that estrogen guys!
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By fonewear 2014-02-26 13:13:43
Quote: Being terrified of the possibility of a slack-jawed gawker is kind of a sexist thought on a woman's part, no?
You've greater faith in humanity than I.
I'm not really paranoid (or vain) to the point where I thought every time I was publicly breastfeeding there was some creep watching me, but thinking that it would never happen to anyone ever is a little silly. Even through 2 kids and a few years of breastfeeding, the thought of it even happening just once was at least part of what made me try to be discreet. Even without the thought of some potential creeper, I just didn't want to show my breasts to the public. Is that really so weird?
These days they just creep you on Facebook.
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Ragnarok.Lenneth
Server: Ragnarok
Game: FFXI
Posts: 27
By Ragnarok.Lenneth 2014-02-26 13:13:44
You've very likely been near a woman breastfeeding many times and never even known. Most of us are quite discreet. I'm pretty sure I've seen more butt check and cleavage unrelated to breastfeeding than I ever have actual nursing boob flashing and I spend a great deal of time around nursing mothers.
Lakshmi.Flavin
Server: Lakshmi
Game: FFXI
Posts: 18466
By Lakshmi.Flavin 2014-02-26 13:16:54
You've very likely been near a woman breastfeeding many times and never even known. Most of us are quite discreet. I'm pretty sure I've seen more butt check and cleavage unrelated to breastfeeding than I ever have actual nursing boob flashing and I spend a great deal of time around nursing mothers. The secret society of breastfeeding mothers... You may not realize it but they are all around you... every park bench... every starbucks... even at your local grocer!
when I read the last part of that I just imagined an AC scene with a breastfeeding mother on the move sorrounded by a pack of women in booty shorts to go un noticed.
By fonewear 2014-02-26 13:18:13
Ragnarok.Ashman
Server: Ragnarok
Game: FFXI
Posts: 4252
By Ragnarok.Ashman 2014-02-26 13:19:29
This whole topic is a non-issue.
I agree. The problem is that if we only discussed issues on this forum, or bandied about facts without personal experiences, and opinions we wouldn't have a forum, lol.
I live a relatively introverted, but accepting, quiet life. I will probably never encounter 99% of the ***we debate on this forum. You implied that bitching isn't going to help etc etc but this forum is like 10% game related math, 10% showing people what gear their dumb *** should be able to figure out themselves, and 80% bitching about random topics. No one is curing cancer at ffxiah (or changing laws/quality of life).
Example:
OP:
JoanofArc5lyfe posted on twitter that she wants to know if she can whip her *** out on a plane. They said yes but please don't be rude and at least cover yourself. She said no thx. P.S. yay for free bleeding, lel. So what do you guys at ffxiah think about dis story?
response #1:
"that is a story that is in the news that relates to breastfeeding. however, i will post no opinions or *** in any way"
necrobump: 100 days have lapsed
response #2:
"heh, boobs"
By fonewear 2014-02-26 13:20:46
I come for the boobs stay for the random topics.
Server: Valefor
Game: FFXI
Posts: 1837
By Valefor.Applebottoms 2014-02-26 13:21:02
From my point of view: I've never been around people that breastfed, so seeing it does make me a bit uncomfortable. But I don't stare, I look away and move on with my life.
It's the people that have no consideration for others that get to me.
I'm fine for feeding a child, that's ok. But making others uncomfortable then saying "my child needs to be fed, so screw you", kinda goes too far in my book.
One time I had to purposefully sit away from a woman. She had a child in one arm feeding while she was eating her sandwich at Subway in the middle of the seating area. Kinda hard to not look when you're right in the middle of everything, so I sat in a spot facing away from her.
There was a corner booth that was more discreet and private, but she sat in the middle. To each her own, I guess.
By fonewear 2014-02-26 13:23:26
If Joan of Arc was alive today she would breast feed in public.
Caitsith.Zahrah
Server: Caitsith
Game: FFXI
By Caitsith.Zahrah 2014-02-26 13:25:26
Server: Odin
Game: FFXI
Posts: 943
By Odin.Calipso 2014-02-26 13:30:04
This whole topic is a non-issue.
OP:
JoanofArc5lyfe posted on twitter that she wants to know if she can whip her *** out on a plane. They said yes but please don't be rude and at least cover yourself. She said no thx. P.S. yay for free bleeding, lel. So what do you guys at ffxiah think about dis story?
I think this is kinda what's irking most people (or at least me) in this story, is not the fact that she was breastfeeding in a public place, or that it's "gross" and she shouldn't do it, but her attitude about it.
I'm a mom. I had 2 kids that were exclusively breastfed. Breastfeeding is great.
There is nothing wrong with being uncomfortable because you accidentally saw someone's breast while they were breastfeeding. Just don't be a *** about it.
That should apply to the woman too. Most places are actually quite courteous to breastfeeders. Why not show a little courteousy back, and try to be a little discreet? There's a reason stories like this hit the news, it's because they're pretty uncommon. With my own two kids, having many other mothers as friends, and 6 nephews/nieces I have NEVER heard of anyone being rude about breastfeeding, and that's even knowing quite a few of the bare-all without a cover type women.
Server: Valefor
Game: FFXI
Posts: 1837
By Valefor.Applebottoms 2014-02-26 13:37:18
WHen I first started working at Target, I saw a mother that was breastfeeding in the store, although I didn't realize it at first.
She had her main shirt up (had another shirt underneath), and the child was covering everything else.
I thought "child must be hungry, ok" and just went on with my business. I saw her again about 10 minutes later in my line and she was done. That was it.
No harm done, child fed, etc.
Unlike one video I saw where this mother was screaming at a worker while the father cheered her on, because the worker told her she needed to cover up because there were lots of kids running around. Forgot to add that she was screaming while the child was still feeding. Interesting, lol.
To each her own, again.
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