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Matsui: "Don't throw away your R/M/E weapons yet"
 Cerberus.Anjisnu
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By Cerberus.Anjisnu 2013-05-03 09:42:52
also this is more recent but best ever no matter how many days you forgot it in the freezer always perfectly slushy never fully frozen
Phoenix.Kojo
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By Phoenix.Kojo 2013-05-03 09:52:42
Remember the original Sierra Mist before they changed the recipe and made it bad?
Ragnarok.Peanriri
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By Ragnarok.Peanriri 2013-05-03 10:00:05
I've had people try and tell me "Cherry Vanilla" coke never existed..
Ragnarok.Ashman
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By Ragnarok.Ashman 2013-05-03 10:01:18
Ragnarok.Peanriri said: »I've had people try and tell me "Cherry Vanilla" coke never existed..
Well, who is gonna believe a taru?
[+]
Ragnarok.Peanriri
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By Ragnarok.Peanriri 2013-05-03 10:03:50
Ragnarok.Peanriri said: »I've had people try and tell me "Cherry Vanilla" coke never existed..
Well, who is gonna believe a taru?
Cool people. Cool people who aren't named something lame, like Ashmen.
Ragnarok.Ashman
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By Ragnarok.Ashman 2013-05-03 10:08:37
WHATEVER PEEONRIRI!
/eats
Phoenix.Kojo
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By Phoenix.Kojo 2013-05-03 10:11:13
Ragnarok.Peanriri said: »I've had people try and tell me "Cherry Vanilla" coke never existed..
Both Coke and Dr. Pepper had Cherry Vanilla, I tried neither. =(
Dr. Pepper also had a Berries and Cream flavor.
 Valefor.Sehachan
Server: Valefor
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By Valefor.Sehachan 2013-05-03 10:12:01
I don't like coke, or any other wannabe version of it for that matter.
Phoenix.Kojo
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By Phoenix.Kojo 2013-05-03 10:16:49
I don't like coke, or any other wannabe version of it for that matter.
Coke upsets my stomach.
Valefor.Sehachan
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By Valefor.Sehachan 2013-05-03 10:17:59
I just don't like the taste. When I was little people always thought I was joking when I said I didn't want it. And so they always gave me anyway.
Ragnarok.Peanriri
Server: Ragnarok
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Posts: 31
By Ragnarok.Peanriri 2013-05-03 10:19:02
WHATEVER PEEONRIRI!
/eats
Nonononono!
Both Coke and Dr. Pepper had Cherry Vanilla, I tried neither. =(
Dr. Pepper also had a Berries and Cream flavor.
Now that you mention it, I think I had tried that Dr. Pepper too but didn't taste anything different because Dr. Pepper already has such a powerful, odd taste.
Phoenix.Kojo
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By Phoenix.Kojo 2013-05-03 10:21:45
Ragnarok.Peanriri said: »WHATEVER PEEONRIRI!
/eats
Nonononono!
Both Coke and Dr. Pepper had Cherry Vanilla, I tried neither. =(
Dr. Pepper also had a Berries and Cream flavor.
Now that you mention it, I think I had tried that Dr. Pepper too but didn't taste anything different because Dr. Pepper already has such a powerful, odd taste.
I love the Cherry Dr. Pepper, tho.
Bismarck.Luces
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Posts: 524
By Bismarck.Luces 2013-05-03 10:37:43
Ragnarok.Peanriri said: »I've had people try and tell me "Cherry Vanilla" coke never existed..
All I see now days is vanilla coke, and diet cherry vanilla coke. Same with dp I can't ever find the cherry vanilla regular dp, but I can find the diet version... I'm on a dp strike for them suing themselves though.
Server: Asura
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By Asura.Originalkord 2013-05-03 10:39:04
Has the common enemy in this thread turned from SE to the soft drink industry?
Phoenix.Kojo
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By Phoenix.Kojo 2013-05-03 10:40:45
Yeah.
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By Asura.Originalkord 2013-05-03 10:42:51
Just checking. This was epic derailment.
By ScaevolaBahamut 2013-05-03 10:43:07
Asura.Originalkord said: »Has the common enemy in this thread turned from SE to the soft drink industry?
needs more mayor bloomberg sock puppet accounts
 Leviathan.Kincard
Server: Leviathan
Game: FFXI
Posts: 1442
By Leviathan.Kincard 2013-05-03 10:43:46
They made a potion around the release of FFXII, I believe it was. It was an herbal tea that was sweetened with honey, IIRC. It also tasted like ***.
Server: Asura
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By Asura.Originalkord 2013-05-03 10:44:53
Asura.Originalkord said: »Has the common enemy in this thread turned from SE to the soft drink industry? Didn't they make an elixir or a potion back in the day? lol
Phoenix Down I think lol.
Valefor.Sehachan
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By Valefor.Sehachan 2013-05-03 10:45:35
I would have bought it only for the bottle. Was so cool. I also remember the funny japanese commercial.
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By Asura.Originalkord 2013-05-03 10:46:47
Nope, twas "Potion.". iWrong
Carbuncle.Tyleron
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By Carbuncle.Tyleron 2013-05-03 10:47:47
Personally, I worry for this game's future as a whole by the trending these past two updates with releasing weapons comparable or beyond base damage of relics, and then completely blowing them out of the water, to the gear that can be somewhat comparable to -1 Hexed gear sets. In turn, if people stop doing Legion, where are the materials for other crafters going to come from to even get to 110 now? The new synths are 110+ which is disappointing, in the way that there still isn't a lot to bridge 105-110 synths.
Not to mention, I think R/M/E have become an integral part of the game and many players, even casuals, making gil by farming currency. If the weapons are rendered obsolete, who's going to bother with any old content at all? Trying to base an entire game off of one expansion is a very poor design for an MMO. I believed they were on the right path before with continuing to keep things relevant, but now I'm just waiting for how they are going to address this before I make my final decision with this game. Lakshmi.Snozeberry said: »This just reaks of a sense of entitlement that the current generation keeps thinking that work they've done in the past somehow means they are guaranteed something in the future. Your work in the past was to get something in the past. They aren't taking anything away from you.
Except, I'm the older generation and this makes you sound like a *** idiot. I will gladly elucidate for you.
I understand that relics are easy now or some people had an easier time making them but here goes:
I spent 2 hours farming dynamis (poorly) everyday getting ~200 currency. That's 153 hours of my time spent farming up apoc (JUST FOR 75).
Then the trials. I think it's a conservative estimate to say another 40-50 hours for the trials to 99.
I understand the concept of the value of time/money is hard to grasp in mommy's basement when the best thing you have to do with an hour is beat off, but my time is actually pretty valueable. Ask a college student what an hour costs them. If one of my customers wants to buy an hour of my time they're paying $50/hour. In 203 hours I'm fairly certain I could begin to learn another language, or re-build an engine (or in theory go buy some mountain dew, play 3 rounds of COD and talk some ***on an online forum).
Either way 200+ hours is a huge chunk of time to invest into ANYTHING (let alone a *** game they charge me for). If you took my working value/hour and applied it to this it would cost you $ 10,150 to have me farm you an Apocalypse on the clock. That's a bit extruded obviously but time IS valuable. When I've only got an average of 700,800 hours on this planet (and only half of those are "good") I kind of expect a return on my investment.
Now you're telling me that someone can get something that shits all over my investment with (assuming luck) less than a days worth of work? Yeah *** that. This isn't WOW. This isn't another MMO. The concept of "everything will be obsolete eventually" was never understood here. If I ever thought this ***would be EASILY replaced I wouldn't have spent the time on it... simple as that.
I also am NOT required to play this game. I do pay for it (in case you weren't aware). I don't use my parents credit card to pay for this account. Being that it is a commodity, or product, it is their job to please me.... in essence I am entitled to demand what I want from this game because they charge me to play it. They stop fulfilling their side of the bargain and guess what:
Everyone with their HURPEDY DURPEDY, CHANGE R GUD MAN. I THINK WE SHUD GET 10 MIN WORK WEAPON BECUZ WOW DOZ IT is *** ignorant. If I wanted that I would have played a different MMO. I vote with my dollar. That's my entitlement. If you change my *** Coke, and I don't like it; I go buy pepsi (or just drink water, etc).
It's not their "whim" to make this game. It is their JOB to make content that pleases people and draws them business. A large portion of the playerbase saying "*** it, im out" is NOT good for continuing to work. If you think new people are going to run out and buy FFXI after 13 years because of 300 D weapons, you're beyond help.
tl;dr keep the majority happy and stop trying to reinvent the wheel. You're not going to attract new players after a decede being like WOW because if they wanted that they'd go play WOW instead long ago.
Best post.... ever.
Ya these 2 posts cover everything.
Agree these two posts cover the main points. Has there been any response from the devs, besides the, we can't talk about the RME adjustment because its not ready?
Right now i am in a wait and see attitude, but if we are going in the direction of completely making older content irrelevant, I expect a significant portion of the base will erode. And many will not migrate to 14 out of spite/lack of trust.
[+]
Leviathan.Kincard
Server: Leviathan
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Posts: 1442
By Leviathan.Kincard 2013-05-03 10:48:03
i was close enough
I think that's the first time I've heard of royal jelly being used in an actual food and not some kind of beauty product, though.
Phoenix.Kojo
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By Phoenix.Kojo 2013-05-03 10:49:04
I would have bought it only for the bottle. Was so cool. I also remember the funny japanese commercial.
JP dude and JP chick doing quickenings on each other? ***was corny but mildly entertaining.
Lakshmi.Byrth
VIP
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By Lakshmi.Byrth 2013-05-03 10:56:42
Carbuncle.Tyleron said: »Has there been any response from the devs, besides the, we can't talk about the RME adjustment because its not ready?
Nope! There's some indication that Matsui had plans to update RMEs even before the most recent patch (hence his "don't throw away your RMEs" post), but it seems that he wanted to use the new high-DPS weapons to motivate players to reform 18-man LSs for Adoulin content.
However, shits are being flipped and now he is facing such incredible pressure from the JPs (our opinions obviously don't matter) that he is considering it post-haste. Because he didn't intend to do it (at least not soon), there is no one working on it and they don't have anyone that could work on it without delaying other (probably FFXIV) content, which they don't want to do. This was poor planning on their part and they're idiots, but they stand to lose enough money from this that they will probably find someone to do it.
To top it off, it's Golden Week in Japan. Don't expect any updates for a few days and even then the best you could hope for is a planning update.
[+]
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By Lakshmi.Sparthosx 2013-05-03 10:58:26
Funny, because all they had to do was attach upgrade items to delve that result in the upgraded relics to smooth things over in the quick 'n dirty fashion.
Valefor.Sehachan
Server: Valefor
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Posts: 24219
By Valefor.Sehachan 2013-05-03 11:00:24
Should give the task to the guy working on Caitsith and Atomos. He can do those later.
[+]
Lakshmi.Byrth
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By Lakshmi.Byrth 2013-05-03 11:03:26
Well, they also have to make 96 (or 100 if RUN/GEO get Mythics) level 99 RMEs (Afterglow and not), which is more items than they added in the last patch. I would assume that it could be mostly copy/paste and change the base damage, which doesn't sound hard to me, but they always complain about adding items en masse.
| 04-26-2013 12:52 PM | | Akihiko Matsui | | Dev Team |  |
| | I'd like to deeply apologize for mentioning "Don’t throw away your relic, mythic, and empyrean weapons" during an interview. Relic, mythic, and empyrean (below R/M/E weapons) take a great deal of time and difficulty to obtain, and this expression was extremely lacking in consideration for all of the players who tried so hard to complete them.
What I wished to convey was that we will be implementing a system to build on R/M/E weapons, so please have them in your possession, and there was no other meaning intended.
In regards to this system, the outline has been finished; however, we have yet to test if what we have planned can be realized and if we can secure the proper amount of manpower to continue it. We are at a point in time right now where it's difficult to explain the details, so please allow us to discuss this another day.
For the Adoulin end-game content aimed at the top players, where they can obtain high level equipment as well, we will gradually make adjustments to difficulty so that once new end-game content is released you'll be able to obtain these items if you put in a bit of effort.
Also, we will similarly be adjusting content in existing areas, though it may take some time and be a limited time event. | |
| 05-09-2013 10:15 AM | | Slycer | | BG Translator |  |
| | Matsui: Follow up on Level 99 Relic, Mythic, Empyrean, and Coin Weapons
Hello, it's Matsui. Thank you for all of your opinions about Relic, Mythic, Empyrean, and Coin weapons (hereafter, RMEC). They were very helpful.
After reading all of the varied opinions, we have decided that rather than unlocking the weapon skills specific to each weapon, a reworking of RME weapons would be more effective (for coin weapons, more information will be provided later, but we plan to allow these to unlock the dedicated weapon skills).
I have written and reorganized this in various ways and it has become quite lengthy with examples. After you have gotten a chance to look over it, please let us know if you have any further opinions.
Content Level
We received many questions about the parameters of Adoulin equipment. Because this is an important part in order to be able to understand the reworking of RME so you can provide your opinion, please allow me to repeat the explanation for content level and growth in Seekers of Adoulin.
In Adoulin, the basic design is a repeated play cycle where players become stronger and stronger as they align themselves with equipment obtained from challenging content which, in turn, allows them to take on even more challenging content.
By aligning themselves with this equipment, players will continue to grow even without leveling up.
The content level of Adoulin content is set as follows:
[[Info below is much better formatted in a table on the original post.]]
20: Delve (Boss Monsters) (Current)
17: Wildskeeper Reive (New Additions) (Next Version Update)
14: Delve NMs (Tier 2) (Current)
13: Skirmish (New Additions) (Next Version Update)
11: Delve NMs (Tier 1) (Current)
6-9: Colonization / Lair Reives (New Additions) (Next Version Update)
7: Wildskeeper Reive (Current)
6: Skirmish (Current)
1-5: Colonization/Lair Reives (Current)
The strength of the equipment that can be obtained, rather than the level of the equipment, will be dependent on the content level. The equipment to be added later in Adoulin will of course be equippable at level 99, but the level of the equipment parameters would be even higher to match the content level (for example, similar to what level 110 or 120 equipment might look like).
While the strength of the monsters which appear is determined to match the content level, in order to fill out the hierarchy between content to some extent, we have designed monsters of variable strength. The parameters of the equipment that can be obtained in Adoulin is set by determining the parameters that would be necessary to compete with those monsters.
The level of current and planned content is set to minimize the gaps between content level, but we may also insert additional intermediate content if the jump between levels remains too high.
In some cases, content variations will cause content to cover multiple levels. We also plan to enhance the amount of content available horizontally at individual levels, rather than just vertically over the content level range.
The content in the next version update will be added with this in mind.
Referencing the "next version update" items above, it will be possible to add new colonization and lair reive equipment purchasable for Bayld in the level 6~9 range (which currently includes Skirmish and Wildskeeper Reives). In addition, we will be inserting new content at levels 13 and 17.
Also, one part of smoothing out the content level will be adjusted in a maintenance to be carried out of the end of this week: we will be adding a fixed probability to obtain the items needed to enter Skirmishes (Simulacrum Segments) from Lair and Colonization Reives. (This adjustment is unrelated to the current rules associated with coalition assignments, gathering, and Soul Pyres.)
By making this adjustment, the assumed progression will be:
1. First, take on lair and colonization reives.
2. As a result of those battles, obtain Simulacrum Segments.
3. Combine the segments in order to enter Skirmishes.
Reworking RMEC
Please excuse my lengthy explanation above. I'll now return to the topic at hand.
First off, since it is necessary for the development staff to further consider the implementation, we cannot guarantee the timeframe as far as whether it will be included in the next version update.
Regarding the types of parameters that would be reworked, special abilities such as Aftermath and Afterglow will remain, while parameters such as the DMG rating, attack, and accuracy will be set to match the content level post-rework.
Since the parameters will be reworked to become aligned with high content difficulty, we do not intend to rework it in small intervals such as with the previous method of Trial of the Magians.
Prior to now, RME were considered the strongest weapons, so I think there will need to be some change to this viewpoint. For those who have RME, you may not require the other weapons, but there now be a choice among other comparable weapons.
If you are worried about how these weapons will be able to be used, for example, against Delve boss monsters, here are some parameters which we are looking at for the reworking. This is just for RME one-handed swords as an example:
Excalibur
DMG:73 Delay:233 Attack+40
"Knights of Round"
Additional effect: Damage varies with HP
to
DMG:121 Delay:233 Attack+60 Accuracy+20
"Knights of Round"
Additional effect: Damage varies with HP
Burtgang
DMG:73 Delay:264 Enmity+18
Physical damage taken-18% Reduces Enmity decrease when taking damage
"Atonement"
Aftermath: Increases Acc./Atk./Occ. attacks twice or thrice
to
DMG:131 Delay:264 Attack+20 Accuracy+20 Enmity+18
Physical damage taken-18% Reduces Enmity decrease when taking damage
"Atonement"
Aftermath: Increases Acc./Atk./Occ. attacks twice or thrice
Almace
DMG:70 Delay:224 DEX+20
"Chant du Cygne"
Aftermath: Occ. deals double damage
to
DMG:114 Delay:224 Attack+20 Accuracy+20 DEX+20
"Chant du Cygne"
Aftermath: Occ. deals double damage
Since coin weapons were originally just intended to be used for Empyrean weapon skills, based on the concept, I believe that instead of reworking them, they can be used to open the dedicated weapon skills (with certain level and job restrictions). We are currently considering the adjustment procedures necessary for this..
In conclusion
I've gone on for a while, so considering the reworking for level 99 Relic, Mythic, and Empyrean weapons as well as the unlocking of dedicated weapon skills via Coin weapons, please let us know your opinions. We will read through your thoughts one by one to make sure we understand your point of view.
Note that this is a large departure from the original plan. Considering the feasibility of scheduling this change, the development may take some time.
I apologize for keeping you waiting on my response.
Thanks in advance!
Translated by: Slycer | |
| 05-09-2013 2:19 PM | | Akihiko Matsui | | Dev Team | |
| | Follow-up: Level 99 Relic, Mythic, Empyrean, and Walk of Echoes Weapons
Matsui here.
Thank you all so much for the feedback on relic, mythic, empyrean, and Walk of Echoes weapons. It has helped out tremendously.
After reading over all of your feedback, instead of continuing the growth of these weapons by unlocking the weapon skills that are tied to each of the weapons, I feel it would be better to perform a revamp on RME weapons. (Regarding Walk of Echoes weapons, I will talk about this below, but they will be involved with unlocking the specialized weapon skills.)
I've been reworking a lot, and writing it all up, but it seems the post turned out rather lengthy, so once you have been able to read through it all and digest it we'd love to hear your feedback.
Content Level
We've received a lot of questions about the stats on Adoulin equipment, and I'd like to once again explain about growth and content levels in Seekers of Adoulin as this is a critical aspect in order to receive feedback on the revamps for RME weapons.
The content in Adoulin has been designed with a repeating play-cycle where you challenge content that you are able to at that moment in time, gather equipment, become stronger, and then take on higher tier content which will allow you to gather even stronger equipment.
It's through the procurement of equipment that will allow players to grow and level up.
We've established content levels for Adoulin content as a means to objectively display difficulty benchmarks. The below is a concrete illustration of these content levels.
| 20 |
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Delve (Boss monsters) |
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| 19 |
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| 18 |
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| 17 |
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New Additions to Wildskeeper Reives |
| 16 |
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| 15 |
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| 14 |
|
Delve (NM group 2) |
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| 13 |
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New additions to Skirmish |
| 12 |
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| 11 |
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Delve (NM group 1) |
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| 10 |
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| 9 |
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New additions to Colonization/Lair Reives |
| 8 |
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| 7 |
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Wildskeeper Reives |
|
| 6 |
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Skirmish |
|
| 5 |
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Colonization/Lair Reives |
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| 4 |
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| 3 |
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| 2 |
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| 1 |
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| Content Level |
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Up to April 2013 |
|
Next version update (currently adjusting) |
|
Equipment strength is dependent on the level of the content you need to challenge in order to obtain the equipment, not the level in which it can be equipped. With the gear that is released in Adoulin from here on out, they can be equipped at level 99; however, instead of considering these to be level 99 pieces of equipment, it would be better for you to think of their level in terms of the content level (for example, level 110 or level 120).
The strength of the monsters that will be introduced are matched to that of the content level, but since there is somewhat of a solidified hierarchy between content, it's been setup so that the strength can be felt with even one level difference in content level. Oppositely, the parameters on Adoulin equipment have been calculated and set in order to deal with these monsters.
Fundamentally we will be making it so that the content level for content to come in the future continues to become higher, but there may be cases where we fill in areas where there is a large jump in content level as needed.
Also, in order to make it so there are various types of content sprawled across a single content level, we are supplementing it with content variations. We've also designed plans to enable resting periods where we will expand laterally instead of vertically, because players may get burnt out going full steam ahead.
In the next version update we will be adding content focusing on filling in the gaps as well as supplementing with content variation.
In the above chart, please look at the “Next version update (currently adjusting)” column. For content levels 6-9 (Skirmish/Wildskeeper Reives), we will be adding equipment appropriate for these content levels that can be exchanged for Bayld along with new Colonization and Lair Reives. Additionally, we will be filling in content for levels 13 and 17.
For those players who are already able to take on Skirmish, Wildskeeper Reives, and Delve at this point in time, it will not be absolutely necessary to challenge this content, but we will be making the above adjustments in case you want to increase your success rate, or are feeling that the current situation is still a bit tough.
Also, as a plan to resolve the issue where Skirmish is not really connecting the content as was planned, we will be undergoing maintenance at the end of this week and making it so statue segments can be obtained from Colonization and Lair Reives at a set rate. (These adjustments are separate from the rules associated with obtaining these items via Coalition Assignments, HELM, and Soul Pyres.)
By performing these adjustments we envision the below flow:
Challenge Colonization and Lair Reives
Obtain statue segments by participating in these reives
Challenge Skirmish with the parts you have obtained
Weapon Revamps
Sorry, I got off track for a bit, but now I'd like to return to the topic at hand.
To start off, I still need to discuss the implementation period with the rest of the development team, so it will be a bit difficult to address this immediately in the next version update, and we cannot make any promises as to when this will take place.
In regards to the kind of stats that will be added when we revamp these weapons, fundamentally the afterglow and aftermath effects as well as the other special stats will carry over and we'll be setting damage values, attack, and accuracy stats to coincide with the content level.
While the stats will be quite strong, we do not plan on making it possible to continuously enhance them in short intervals like the original method of enhancing via Trial of the Magians.
However, RME weapons have been considered the ultimate weapons up until this point in time, but I feel that this needs to change a bit.
I would like to make a shift so that instead of having it so that other weapons aren't necessary if you have RME weapons, you have a choice. If you are happy with RME, then you can use RME, and for those who want other weapons you can use other weapons.
With that said, there may be players who are worried if these weapons will eventually become unusable, but to give an example we had the lead make some calculations for the stats needed to combat the Delve boss monsters, and the below is what the RME swords would look like:
Excalibur
DMG: 73 Delay: 233 Attack+40 "Knights of Round" Additional effect: Damage varies with HP |
DMG: 121 Delay: 233 Attack+60 Accuracy+20 "Knights of Round" Additional effect: Damage varies with HP |
Burtgang
DMG: 73 Delay: 264 Enmity+18 Physical damage taken -18% Reduces Enmity decrease when taking damage. "Atonement" Aftermath: Increases Acc./Atk./Occ. Attacks twice or thrice |
DMG: 131 Delay: 264 Attack+20 Accuracy+20 Enmity+18 Physical damage taken -18% Reduces Enmity decrease when taking damage. "Atonement" Aftermath: Increases Acc./Atk./Occ. Attacks twice or thrice |
Almace
DMG: 70 Delay: 224 DEX+20 "Chant du Cygne" Aftermath: Occ. deals double damage |
DMG: 114 Delay: 224 Attack+20 Accuracy+20 DEX+20 "Chant du Cygne" Aftermath: Occ. deals double damage |
In regards to Walk of Echoes weapons, these were implemented with the concept of allowing players to use the specialized empyrean weapon skills, so instead of revamping them we felt it more appropriate to have them serve to unlock the weapons skills (planning to have restrictions based on jobs and level). Also, we are looking into adjustments for the method to create Walk of Echoes weapons.
In conclusion…
Apologies that this post is so long, but based on all of the above we would love to hear your feedback on the revamps to level 99 RME weapons and unlocking weapon skills with Walk of Echoes weapons.
I will be sure to read over each and every comment you all post.
My thoughts and ideas have completely turned around the plans that were originally drawn up, and I had to sit and really discuss the idea with the rest of the development team, including the possibilities of making this happen.
I apologize that this response was late and that I made you all wait.
Thank you all very much. | |
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