Matsui: "Don't Throw Away Your R/M/E Weapons Yet"

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Matsui: "Don't throw away your R/M/E weapons yet"
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By macsdf1 2013-05-02 10:59:23
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Lakshmi.Saevel said: »
They didn't.

http://wiki.bluegartr.com/bg/Lacryma_Sickle

That guy is selling the HQ for 350M. The NQ requires a single delve boss drop. It's a crafting drop too, not even one of the R/EX items.

He's only selling two things, Jack and ***. First of all you can't baz an item for over 99m. He is just listing he wants to sell it for that price, doesn't mean he actually has it. Go and make up a few WTS things of your own, go!
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By macsdf1 2013-05-02 11:01:44
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Connavarr said: »
I don't have a problem doing the work to upgrade a 99 R/M/E further. My problem is the ease in which someone can obtain a weapon vastly superior to what a 99 owner has done already.

Add a trial/quest to improve 99 R/M/E's when Delve/AHable weapons are harder to get. Not before.

The trial will be to get those new parts and synergy them with your old 99, bam, done.
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By skyehope928 2013-05-02 11:01:48
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So is se doing anything about our rem?
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By Lakshmi.Snozeberry 2013-05-02 11:01:53
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Again, my argument isn't that R/M/E should die, it's that people are over-reacting 2 days after a version update, and are demanding DMG+ increases *NOW*. Short-term, poorly thought out arguments are what got SE into this problem in the first place, as a playerbase we should express to them *THAT* is what we are mad at, not that we want it fixed *NOW*.
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By Ragnarok.Zohnax 2013-05-02 11:03:19
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Lakshmi.Snozeberry said: »
Again, my argument isn't that R/M/E should die, it's that people are over-reacting 2 days after a version update, and are demanding DMG+ increases *NOW*. Short-term, poorly thought out arguments are what got SE into this problem in the first place, as a playerbase we should express to them *THAT* is what we are mad at, not that we want it fixed *NOW*.
I haven't seen as much, "We want it now!" complaints, but rather players shooting down this ridiculous notion they presented us with the other day after saying, "your efforts will not be wasted."
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 Lakshmi.Saevel
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By Lakshmi.Saevel 2013-05-02 11:04:15
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And another troll added to the infamous blist.
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By macsdf1 2013-05-02 11:04:37
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Hey look guys, I crafted an easy to make gaxe!

http://www.ffxiah.com/player/Bismarck/Macross

check my bazaar listing buy it now!
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By Connavarr 2013-05-02 11:06:19
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This entire shitstorm wouldn't even be here if SE had made 99 R/M/E's equal to or better then Delve weapons on the day of the update. Or had they not gone bonkers with those weapons in the first place.

Matsui's comments have made it worse since then, not better.
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By Phoenix.Kojo 2013-05-02 11:06:48
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macsdf1 said: »
Hey look guys, I crafted an easy to make gaxe!

http://www.ffxiah.com/player/Bismarck/Macross

check my bazaar listing buy it now!

For a good time~ For a good time caaaallll!!~
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By Phoenix.Kojo 2013-05-02 11:09:57
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Connavarr said: »
This entire shitstorm wouldn't even be here if SE had made 99 R/M/E's equal to or better then Delve weapons on the day of the update. Or had they not gone bonkers with those weapons in the first place.

Matsui's comments have made it worse since then, not better.

Honestly, they could've put currently unobtainable updated R/M/Es in the dats and this wouldn't have happened. For that matter, Matsui could have just said R/M/E updates were in the works and after seeing the new weapons, everyone would look forward to it instead of rage about it.
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 Lakshmi.Snozeberry
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By Lakshmi.Snozeberry 2013-05-02 11:10:11
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Lakshmi.Saevel said: »
And another troll added to the infamous blist.

Have I made this list yet? :D

But seriously, there are many more things I would like fixed before I concern myself that my relic trials were a waste of time.

1. Skirmish pops should be easier to get. This allows others to be less gimp.
2. More missions
3. More ranks in coalitions
4. Fix ratio on colonization reives to improve overall bayld rate.
5. Adjust rates at which bivoaks get destroyed
6. Job adjustments (RDM/SMN/GEO/RUN I'm looking at you)
7. Artifact armor (GEO/RUN)
...
50. R/M/E adjustments.
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 Lakshmi.Toioiz
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By Lakshmi.Toioiz 2013-05-02 11:11:26
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Phoenix.Kojo said: »
Connavarr said: »
This entire shitstorm wouldn't even be here if SE had made 99 R/M/E's equal to or better then Delve weapons on the day of the update. Or had they not gone bonkers with those weapons in the first place.

Matsui's comments have made it worse since then, not better.

Honestly, they could've put currently unobtainable updated R/M/Es in the dats and this wouldn't have happened. For that matter, Matsui could have just said R/M/E updates were in the works and after seeing the new weapons, everyone would look forward to it instead of rage about it.

Truth. This is again my complaint, their response to the situation.
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By Ragnarok.Zohnax 2013-05-02 11:18:34
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Personally, I worry for this game's future as a whole by the trending these past two updates with releasing weapons comparable or beyond base damage of relics, and then completely blowing them out of the water, to the gear that can be somewhat comparable to -1 Hexed gear sets. In turn, if people stop doing Legion, where are the materials for other crafters going to come from to even get to 110 now? The new synths are 110+ which is disappointing, in the way that there still isn't a lot to bridge 105-110 synths.

Not to mention, I think R/M/E have become an integral part of the game and many players, even casuals, making gil by farming currency. If the weapons are rendered obsolete, who's going to bother with any old content at all? Trying to base an entire game off of one expansion is a very poor design for an MMO. I believed they were on the right path before with continuing to keep things relevant, but now I'm just waiting for how they are going to address this before I make my final decision with this game.
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By macsdf1 2013-05-02 11:20:10
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Why would you stop doing legion? Getting super weapons will make legion much more fun and farmable and accessable.

You can farm other stuff to sell, like shards for alixirs. People will buy em.
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 Lakshmi.Saevel
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By Lakshmi.Saevel 2013-05-02 11:20:46
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Lakshmi.Snozeberry said: »
Lakshmi.Saevel said: »
And another troll added to the infamous blist.

Have I made this list yet? :D

But seriously, there are many more things I would like fixed before I concern myself that my relic trials were a waste of time.

1. Skirmish pops should be easier to get. This allows others to be less gimp.
2. More missions
3. More ranks in coalitions
4. Fix ratio on colonization reives to improve overall bayld rate.
5. Adjust rates at which bivoaks get destroyed
6. Job adjustments (RDM/SMN/GEO/RUN I'm looking at you)
7. Artifact armor (GEO/RUN)
...
50. R/M/E adjustments.

You actually attempt a discussion rather then just try to piss everyone off, so no your not on that list.

Assuaging subscribers feelings should be #1 on that list otherwise the game dies. This is an old game, most of it's players are long term committed people who've built up their character. Telling them that none of that matters anymore is just begging to have them start over on another MMO. The reason long term players tend to stick with poorly managed or old MMO's is that they've built up a character and / or social connections. Removing the built up character is just asking for people to join another game. If their expected to put in all the work they've already done, why bother doing it in FFXI with it's myriad of problems and incompetent development team.
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By macsdf1 2013-05-02 11:22:34
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Lakshmi.Saevel said: »
Lakshmi.Snozeberry said: »
Lakshmi.Saevel said: »
And another troll added to the infamous blist.

Have I made this list yet? :D

But seriously, there are many more things I would like fixed before I concern myself that my relic trials were a waste of time.

1. Skirmish pops should be easier to get. This allows others to be less gimp.
2. More missions
3. More ranks in coalitions
4. Fix ratio on colonization reives to improve overall bayld rate.
5. Adjust rates at which bivoaks get destroyed
6. Job adjustments (RDM/SMN/GEO/RUN I'm looking at you)
7. Artifact armor (GEO/RUN)
...
50. R/M/E adjustments.

You actually attempt a discussion rather then just try to piss everyone off, so no your not on that list.

Assuaging subscribers feelings should be #1 on that list otherwise the game dies. This is an old game, most of it's players are long term committed people who've built up their character. Telling them that none of that matters anymore is just begging to have them start over on another MMO. The reason long term players tend to stick with poorly managed or old MMO's is that they've built up a character and / or social connections. Removing the built up character is just asking for people to join another game. If their expected to put in all the work they've already done, why bother doing it in FFXI with it's myriad of problems and incompetent development team.

I play to have fun. Killing new stuff, getting new stuff to get even more powerful to kill even more powerful stuff = fun.
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 Fenrir.Sylow
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By Fenrir.Sylow 2013-05-02 11:25:04
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Lakshmi.Snozeberry said: »
6. Job adjustments (RDM/SMN/GEO/RUN I'm looking at you)

Delve is SMN's job adjustment
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By duos 2013-05-02 11:26:21
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Its not even totally about the damage really, the unique look of REM weapons along with some unique aftermaths ( apoc, rng relics, etc etc ) has been replaced by a bronze looking weapons with damage ratio that looks like it comes from a private server of some sort.

Couldn't they just add another legendary with a story line attached to it that surpass the 99 but by just a little. Where the hardcore peeps would do them but it will not diminish what we got now.
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By Lakshmi.Snozeberry 2013-05-02 11:27:04
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So, we're saying the same thing. Making R/M/E relevant isn't the issue. Dealing with players is the issue, and they need to do a much better job at long-term planning than anything else.

They've done this before (Abyssea re: Relics), and should know the expectations and how to "manage" them before the playerbase complains. Ultimately I would wish for a much different playerbase than anything, but you can't get everything. :)

Back to the point that started me commenting in this thread, yes, R/E/M should get updates, no, they shouldn't be automatic, yes, they should be trial type things that keep players engaged in the new content.
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By Lakshmi.Byrth 2013-05-02 11:28:48
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Fenrir.Sylow said: »
Delve is SMN's job adjustment

Naw, not according to the JP forums. It looks like they're considering:
1) A 45 minute time limit for Delve monsters.
2) A 20 minute time limit (instead of Rage).
3) Not changing anything.

If they choose to add a time limit, Summoner will be pretty useless. Delve monsters will (for the most part) be meleeburns.
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By skyehope928 2013-05-02 11:33:21
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Y not let us merge our rem with other trial weopons I that would be cool to merge I think plus a damage boost
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By Quetzalcoatl.Makenshi 2013-05-02 11:39:55
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skyehope928 said: »
Y not let us merge our rem with other trial weapons I that would be cool to merge I think plus a damage boost
That would actually make my now useless level 99 magian weapons (trying to decide if OAT was ever useful...) useful too lol

I'd merge relic with OAT and STR trial weapons :p
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By Fenrir.Sylow 2013-05-02 11:47:12
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Lakshmi.Byrth said: »
Fenrir.Sylow said: »
Delve is SMN's job adjustment

Naw, not according to the JP forums. It looks like they're considering:
1) A 45 minute time limit for Delve monsters.
2) A 20 minute time limit (instead of Rage).
3) Not changing anything.

If they choose to add a time limit, Summoner will be pretty useless. Delve monsters will (for the most part) be meleeburns.

I don't get that post really
They're all like "we set the difficulty of IV and V considering that you would have gotten the equipment from I-III"

Are they high
No offense SE but a few accessories and a few points of STR/DEX/ACC/Attack aren't really making a gigantic difference when we're rolling with COR and BRD anyway
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By Bismarck.Osaia 2013-05-02 11:48:24
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Ragnarok.Ashman said: »
Lakshmi.Snozeberry said: »
This just reaks of a sense of entitlement that the current generation keeps thinking that work they've done in the past somehow means they are guaranteed something in the future. Your work in the past was to get something in the past. They aren't taking anything away from you.

Except, I'm the older generation and this makes you sound like a *** idiot. I will gladly elucidate for you.

I understand that relics are easy now or some people had an easier time making them but here goes:

I spent 2 hours farming dynamis (poorly) everyday getting ~200 currency. That's 153 hours of my time spent farming up apoc (JUST FOR 75).
Then the trials. I think it's a conservative estimate to say another 40-50 hours for the trials to 99.
I understand the concept of the value of time/money is hard to grasp in mommy's basement when the best thing you have to do with an hour is beat off, but my time is actually pretty valueable. Ask a college student what an hour costs them. If one of my customers wants to buy an hour of my time they're paying $50/hour. In 203 hours I'm fairly certain I could begin to learn another language, or re-build an engine (or in theory go buy some mountain dew, play 3 rounds of COD and talk some ***on an online forum).

Either way 200+ hours is a huge chunk of time to invest into ANYTHING (let alone a *** game they charge me for). If you took my working value/hour and applied it to this it would cost you $ 10,150 to have me farm you an Apocalypse on the clock. That's a bit extruded obviously but time IS valuable. When I've only got an average of 700,800 hours on this planet (and only half of those are "good") I kind of expect a return on my investment.

Now you're telling me that someone can get something that shits all over my investment with (assuming luck) less than a days worth of work? Yeah *** that. This isn't WOW. This isn't another MMO. The concept of "everything will be obsolete eventually" was never understood here. If I ever thought this ***would be EASILY replaced I wouldn't have spent the time on it... simple as that.

I also am NOT required to play this game. I do pay for it (in case you weren't aware). I don't use my parents credit card to pay for this account. Being that it is a commodity, or product, it is their job to please me.... in essence I am entitled to demand what I want from this game because they charge me to play it. They stop fulfilling their side of the bargain and guess what:

Everyone with their HURPEDY DURPEDY, CHANGE R GUD MAN. I THINK WE SHUD GET 10 MIN WORK WEAPON BECUZ WOW DOZ IT is *** ignorant. If I wanted that I would have played a different MMO. I vote with my dollar. That's my entitlement. If you change my *** Coke, and I don't like it; I go buy pepsi (or just drink water, etc).

It's not their "whim" to make this game. It is their JOB to make content that pleases people and draws them business. A large portion of the playerbase saying "*** it, im out" is NOT good for continuing to work. If you think new people are going to run out and buy FFXI after 13 years because of 300 D weapons, you're beyond help.

tl;dr keep the majority happy and stop trying to reinvent the wheel. You're not going to attract new players after a decede being like WOW because if they wanted that they'd go play WOW instead long ago.

Best post.... ever.
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By macsdf1 2013-05-02 11:50:07
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Fenrir.Sylow said: »
Lakshmi.Byrth said: »
Fenrir.Sylow said: »
Delve is SMN's job adjustment

Naw, not according to the JP forums. It looks like they're considering:
1) A 45 minute time limit for Delve monsters.
2) A 20 minute time limit (instead of Rage).
3) Not changing anything.

If they choose to add a time limit, Summoner will be pretty useless. Delve monsters will (for the most part) be meleeburns.

I don't get that post really
They're all like "we set the difficulty of IV and V considering that you would have gotten the equipment from I-III"

Are they high
No offense SE but a few accessories and a few points of STR/DEX/ACC/Attack aren't really making a gigantic difference when we're rolling with COR and BRD anyway

lol some 2-3 are harder than the 4-5s
 Lakshmi.Byrth
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By Lakshmi.Byrth 2013-05-02 11:50:26
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Fenrir.Sylow said: »
Lakshmi.Byrth said: »
Fenrir.Sylow said: »
Delve is SMN's job adjustment

Naw, not according to the JP forums. It looks like they're considering:
1) A 45 minute time limit for Delve monsters.
2) A 20 minute time limit (instead of Rage).
3) Not changing anything.

If they choose to add a time limit, Summoner will be pretty useless. Delve monsters will (for the most part) be meleeburns.

I don't get that post really
They're all like "we set the difficulty of IV and V considering that you would have gotten the equipment from I-III"

Are they high
No offense SE but a few accessories and a few points of STR/DEX/ACC/Attack aren't really making a gigantic difference when we're rolling with COR and BRD anyway

I also could not understand how the I~III equipment could possibly matter. Plus... are they really shocked that we are willing to use our invincible tanks and just bore it to death? Have they really not played FFXI before?
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 Sylph.Krsone
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By Sylph.Krsone 2013-05-02 11:52:38
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Ragnarok.Zohnax said: »
Personally, I worry for this game's future as a whole by the trending these past two updates with releasing weapons comparable or beyond base damage of relics, and then completely blowing them out of the water, to the gear that can be somewhat comparable to -1 Hexed gear sets. In turn, if people stop doing Legion, where are the materials for other crafters going to come from to even get to 110 now? The new synths are 110+ which is disappointing, in the way that there still isn't a lot to bridge 105-110 synths.

Not to mention, I think R/M/E have become an integral part of the game and many players, even casuals, making gil by farming currency. If the weapons are rendered obsolete, who's going to bother with any old content at all? Trying to base an entire game off of one expansion is a very poor design for an MMO. I believed they were on the right path before with continuing to keep things relevant, but now I'm just waiting for how they are going to address this before I make my final decision with this game.
Bismarck.Osaia said: »
Ragnarok.Ashman said: »
Lakshmi.Snozeberry said: »
This just reaks of a sense of entitlement that the current generation keeps thinking that work they've done in the past somehow means they are guaranteed something in the future. Your work in the past was to get something in the past. They aren't taking anything away from you.

Except, I'm the older generation and this makes you sound like a *** idiot. I will gladly elucidate for you.

I understand that relics are easy now or some people had an easier time making them but here goes:

I spent 2 hours farming dynamis (poorly) everyday getting ~200 currency. That's 153 hours of my time spent farming up apoc (JUST FOR 75).
Then the trials. I think it's a conservative estimate to say another 40-50 hours for the trials to 99.
I understand the concept of the value of time/money is hard to grasp in mommy's basement when the best thing you have to do with an hour is beat off, but my time is actually pretty valueable. Ask a college student what an hour costs them. If one of my customers wants to buy an hour of my time they're paying $50/hour. In 203 hours I'm fairly certain I could begin to learn another language, or re-build an engine (or in theory go buy some mountain dew, play 3 rounds of COD and talk some ***on an online forum).

Either way 200+ hours is a huge chunk of time to invest into ANYTHING (let alone a *** game they charge me for). If you took my working value/hour and applied it to this it would cost you $ 10,150 to have me farm you an Apocalypse on the clock. That's a bit extruded obviously but time IS valuable. When I've only got an average of 700,800 hours on this planet (and only half of those are "good") I kind of expect a return on my investment.

Now you're telling me that someone can get something that shits all over my investment with (assuming luck) less than a days worth of work? Yeah *** that. This isn't WOW. This isn't another MMO. The concept of "everything will be obsolete eventually" was never understood here. If I ever thought this ***would be EASILY replaced I wouldn't have spent the time on it... simple as that.

I also am NOT required to play this game. I do pay for it (in case you weren't aware). I don't use my parents credit card to pay for this account. Being that it is a commodity, or product, it is their job to please me.... in essence I am entitled to demand what I want from this game because they charge me to play it. They stop fulfilling their side of the bargain and guess what:

Everyone with their HURPEDY DURPEDY, CHANGE R GUD MAN. I THINK WE SHUD GET 10 MIN WORK WEAPON BECUZ WOW DOZ IT is *** ignorant. If I wanted that I would have played a different MMO. I vote with my dollar. That's my entitlement. If you change my *** Coke, and I don't like it; I go buy pepsi (or just drink water, etc).

It's not their "whim" to make this game. It is their JOB to make content that pleases people and draws them business. A large portion of the playerbase saying "*** it, im out" is NOT good for continuing to work. If you think new people are going to run out and buy FFXI after 13 years because of 300 D weapons, you're beyond help.

tl;dr keep the majority happy and stop trying to reinvent the wheel. You're not going to attract new players after a decede being like WOW because if they wanted that they'd go play WOW instead long ago.

Best post.... ever.

Ya these 2 posts cover everything.
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 Fenrir.Sylow
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By Fenrir.Sylow 2013-05-02 11:55:07
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They think that their "Stepping Stone / Training Wheels" content idea is going to work

In reality we have COR RNG SMN and BLM and immortal PLDs

Sure they can put a time limit on things but if it begins requiring too many "Stepping Stones" most people just won't do the content until they nerf it (which they already openly admitted they would do eventually)
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By Phoenix.Dramatica 2013-05-02 11:57:21
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Removal of rage and 3x ??? would be ideal... Surely they can fit them in SOMEWHERE.
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By Quetzalcoatl.Xueye 2013-05-02 12:00:02
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In all seriousness, I think I'm also going to unsubscribe.

It's just not worth being charged to have my ***made obsolete at every turn. I could have an extra beer each Monday with that money.

FFXI is a story of "Congratulations, now go *** yourself"; it's always been that way, and I think that the model is no longer scalable.

The world has moved on, and as usual, SE has forgotten to move with it.
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