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Matsui: "Don't throw away your R/M/E weapons yet"
 Lakshmi.ByrthVIP
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By Lakshmi.Byrth 2013-05-09 10:10:12
I hope for the same things that I always hope for (expand relic access, rework relic WSs, allow stats from RMEs to work in the offhand, etc.), but otherwise I am satisfied. I hope that 99ing a RMEC unlocks the weapon, not just for coin weapons. Apoc, Anni, and Yoichi would be even more useful then.
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 Bismarck.KelhorAdministrator
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By Bismarck.Kelhor 2013-05-09 10:16:53
So I originally was of the mindset that there would be some sort of trial to upgrade these, which I was totally cool with. But think about it - what's easier, upgrading existing weapons in place, or adding 96 new trials (48 non shield/instrument RMEs, and you need an afterglow/non-afterglow path)? Hasn't SE always proven they'll take the easier path, that involves less development time?
I'm really thinking it's just going to be in-place upgrade now. Good news for both of you who are halfway through afterglowing your Claustrum, anyway.
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Carbuncle.Shokox
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By Carbuncle.Shokox 2013-05-09 10:18:42
Oho, spamming CdC with Tizona or Burtgang? For the love of god, make this possible.
Woop woop, swag swag and all that.
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Phoenix.Kojo
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By Phoenix.Kojo 2013-05-09 10:19:55
So I originally was of the mindset that there would be some sort of trial to upgrade these, which I was totally cool with. But think about it - what's easier, upgrading existing weapons in place, or adding 96 new trials (48 non shield/instrument RMEs, and you need an afterglow/non-afterglow path)? Hasn't SE always proven they'll take the easier path, that involves less development time?
I'm really thinking it's just going to be in-place upgrade now. Good news for both of you who are halfway through afterglowing your Claustrum, anyway.
Now I can make a SWEET Full Swing build for MN- Oh, wait...
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By Odin.Registry 2013-05-09 10:20:55
This isn't nearly as bad as I thought it would be, hell, because of that I might even be happy about those adjustments lol.
The only thing I'm somewhat curious about is if they plan on adding more content after delve (I'd hope so...) and when. Since if Delve had this big of an impact on things then new content may release even better gear, again surpassing Relics, Empyreans, and Mythics.
By fillerbunny9 2013-05-09 10:22:23
so..... I can either struggle to get my horns back, or I can lol through building a WoE weapon to get Smite back. hmm.
HMMM.
yeah, I think I am going to suffer through building a coin weapon and camping those NMs a THIRD time. (STR path before I had a group to make my Emp. and Emp itself.)
I may hold off a little to see if VW makes a comeback, but at this point if you're on Shiva and not Delving, you're AFK or one of those poor souls who didn't get their KI.
 Valefor.Sehachan
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By Valefor.Sehachan 2013-05-09 10:22:29
I must win Bonanza now! I really need that DP!
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Lakshmi.Byrth
VIP
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By Lakshmi.Byrth 2013-05-09 10:24:51
I must win Bonanza now! I really need that DP!
<obligatory joke>
I'm pretty excited about this. One of my weapons will be somewhat useless (assuming I ever get Izhiikoh), but the other three will survive okay.
<pre-emptive Prothescar high-five>
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Carbuncle.Shokox
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By Carbuncle.Shokox 2013-05-09 10:27:18
But to be honest and real, I bet this is Matsui's way of quelling the storm for the next 6 months to a year when he reveals SoA relics... relics will completely invalidate everything henceforth.
You'll see in one year! Mark my words!
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Cerberus.Taint
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By Cerberus.Taint 2013-05-09 10:31:13
But to be honest and real, I bet this is Matsui's way of quelling the storm for the next 6 months to a year when he reveals SoA relics... relics will completely invalidate everything henceforth.
You'll see in one year! Mark my words!
I think everyone would be cool with that. PWNage new weapons that require REM type effort for their reward.
Not the Ugu GKT that dropped off a moth that was killed in 10 minutes that PWNs my Amano.
Siren.Mosin
By Siren.Mosin 2013-05-09 10:31:57
But to be honest and real, I bet this is Matsui's way of quelling the storm for the next 6 months to a year when he reveals SoA relics... relics will completely invalidate everything henceforth. You'll see in one year! Mark my words!
I don't think a 4th R/M/E would ruffle anyone's feathers. as long as it doesn't drop of a NM....
>.>
Valefor.Sehachan
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By Valefor.Sehachan 2013-05-09 10:31:57
I'm ok with a new line of legendary weapons going on top. I just disliked the ah/augments weapons obliterating the existing legendaries.
 Asura.Ina
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By Asura.Ina 2013-05-09 10:32:11
But to be honest and real, I bet this is Matsui's way of quelling the storm for the next 6 months to a year when he reveals SoA relics... relics will completely invalidate everything henceforth.
You'll see in one year! Mark my words! He seems pretty adament on his teired content so I would expect the next big release of items to crush what we just got... the question will be if he keeps updating R/E/M with them.
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Asura.Ina
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By Asura.Ina 2013-05-09 10:34:38
For now at least though
Valefor.Sehachan
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By Valefor.Sehachan 2013-05-09 10:35:23
Slycer's translation for those who missed it.
Server: Cerberus
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By Cerberus.Demonsgate 2013-05-09 10:36:18
so they are uping dmg on R/E/M weapons but also giving all the ws to other weapons if you have a 99 version of R/E/M?
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By Odin.Tsuneo 2013-05-09 10:36:59
Looks like WoE weapons will be the only ones with unlockable WS's.
Valefor.Sehachan
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Posts: 24219
By Valefor.Sehachan 2013-05-09 10:38:59
Looks like WoE weapons will be the only ones with unlockable WS's. This is so stupid. I'll hope till the end that empies will unlock the ws as well.
Server: Leviathan
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Posts: 6052
By Leviathan.Comeatmebro 2013-05-09 10:40:18
yea, seems a bit silly.. why should a woe weapon be better than a 90 emp? or for that matter, why should a woe weapon be better than a 99 emp(in the case you also have a better weapon for the job and want ws)?
Server: Cerberus
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By Cerberus.Demonsgate 2013-05-09 10:40:59
well dam time to get on that 99 coin weapon and redo rigor to path A lol
 Ragnarok.Daffel
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By Ragnarok.Daffel 2013-05-09 10:41:07
"The equipment to be added later in Adoulin will of course be equippable at level 99, but the level of the equipment parameters would be even higher to match the content level"
Cerberus.Corphish
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By Cerberus.Corphish 2013-05-09 10:42:12
233 Excalibur!?
C'monnnnnn 250~ Mjollnir!
Lakshmi.Feint
Server: Lakshmi
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Posts: 332
By Lakshmi.Feint 2013-05-09 10:43:02
Thanks :D
Well it looks like I'll be working on making a amano or 99ing my masa.
Ragnarok.Daffel
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By Ragnarok.Daffel 2013-05-09 10:43:59
Cerberus.Corphish said: »233 Excalibur!?
C'monnnnnn 250~ Mjollnir!
Mjollnir has (in the past) always been the highest damage 1 handed weapon.
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Phoenix.Kojo
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By Phoenix.Kojo 2013-05-09 10:44:02
Cerberus.Corphish said: »233 Excalibur!?
C'monnnnnn 250~ Mjollnir!
That's Delay.
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By kenshynofshiva 2013-05-09 10:46:17
Looks like WoE weapons will be the only ones with unlockable WS's.
Guess my full stacks of all the coins are gonna be quite a nice little nest egg!!!!!!!!
Cerberus.Corphish
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By Cerberus.Corphish 2013-05-09 10:46:30
...Oh darn... yey 150.....
Phoenix.Kojo
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By Phoenix.Kojo 2013-05-09 10:46:33
Wonder if JP are still fighting for Relic superiority..
Ragnarok.Daffel
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By Ragnarok.Daffel 2013-05-09 10:47:27
Looks like WoE weapons will be the only ones with unlockable WS's.
Guess my full stacks of all the coins are gonna be quite a nice little nest egg!!!!!!!!
*** this planet, probably worth more (at the moment then) than my stacks of HMPs. /hurtbutt
Leviathan.Mckeag
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By Leviathan.Mckeag 2013-05-09 10:47:45
At least they did something about it
| 04-26-2013 12:52 PM | | Akihiko Matsui | | Dev Team |  |
| | I'd like to deeply apologize for mentioning "Don’t throw away your relic, mythic, and empyrean weapons" during an interview. Relic, mythic, and empyrean (below R/M/E weapons) take a great deal of time and difficulty to obtain, and this expression was extremely lacking in consideration for all of the players who tried so hard to complete them.
What I wished to convey was that we will be implementing a system to build on R/M/E weapons, so please have them in your possession, and there was no other meaning intended.
In regards to this system, the outline has been finished; however, we have yet to test if what we have planned can be realized and if we can secure the proper amount of manpower to continue it. We are at a point in time right now where it's difficult to explain the details, so please allow us to discuss this another day.
For the Adoulin end-game content aimed at the top players, where they can obtain high level equipment as well, we will gradually make adjustments to difficulty so that once new end-game content is released you'll be able to obtain these items if you put in a bit of effort.
Also, we will similarly be adjusting content in existing areas, though it may take some time and be a limited time event. | |
| 05-09-2013 10:15 AM | | Slycer | | BG Translator |  |
| | Matsui: Follow up on Level 99 Relic, Mythic, Empyrean, and Coin Weapons
Hello, it's Matsui. Thank you for all of your opinions about Relic, Mythic, Empyrean, and Coin weapons (hereafter, RMEC). They were very helpful.
After reading all of the varied opinions, we have decided that rather than unlocking the weapon skills specific to each weapon, a reworking of RME weapons would be more effective (for coin weapons, more information will be provided later, but we plan to allow these to unlock the dedicated weapon skills).
I have written and reorganized this in various ways and it has become quite lengthy with examples. After you have gotten a chance to look over it, please let us know if you have any further opinions.
Content Level
We received many questions about the parameters of Adoulin equipment. Because this is an important part in order to be able to understand the reworking of RME so you can provide your opinion, please allow me to repeat the explanation for content level and growth in Seekers of Adoulin.
In Adoulin, the basic design is a repeated play cycle where players become stronger and stronger as they align themselves with equipment obtained from challenging content which, in turn, allows them to take on even more challenging content.
By aligning themselves with this equipment, players will continue to grow even without leveling up.
The content level of Adoulin content is set as follows:
[[Info below is much better formatted in a table on the original post.]]
20: Delve (Boss Monsters) (Current)
17: Wildskeeper Reive (New Additions) (Next Version Update)
14: Delve NMs (Tier 2) (Current)
13: Skirmish (New Additions) (Next Version Update)
11: Delve NMs (Tier 1) (Current)
6-9: Colonization / Lair Reives (New Additions) (Next Version Update)
7: Wildskeeper Reive (Current)
6: Skirmish (Current)
1-5: Colonization/Lair Reives (Current)
The strength of the equipment that can be obtained, rather than the level of the equipment, will be dependent on the content level. The equipment to be added later in Adoulin will of course be equippable at level 99, but the level of the equipment parameters would be even higher to match the content level (for example, similar to what level 110 or 120 equipment might look like).
While the strength of the monsters which appear is determined to match the content level, in order to fill out the hierarchy between content to some extent, we have designed monsters of variable strength. The parameters of the equipment that can be obtained in Adoulin is set by determining the parameters that would be necessary to compete with those monsters.
The level of current and planned content is set to minimize the gaps between content level, but we may also insert additional intermediate content if the jump between levels remains too high.
In some cases, content variations will cause content to cover multiple levels. We also plan to enhance the amount of content available horizontally at individual levels, rather than just vertically over the content level range.
The content in the next version update will be added with this in mind.
Referencing the "next version update" items above, it will be possible to add new colonization and lair reive equipment purchasable for Bayld in the level 6~9 range (which currently includes Skirmish and Wildskeeper Reives). In addition, we will be inserting new content at levels 13 and 17.
Also, one part of smoothing out the content level will be adjusted in a maintenance to be carried out of the end of this week: we will be adding a fixed probability to obtain the items needed to enter Skirmishes (Simulacrum Segments) from Lair and Colonization Reives. (This adjustment is unrelated to the current rules associated with coalition assignments, gathering, and Soul Pyres.)
By making this adjustment, the assumed progression will be:
1. First, take on lair and colonization reives.
2. As a result of those battles, obtain Simulacrum Segments.
3. Combine the segments in order to enter Skirmishes.
Reworking RMEC
Please excuse my lengthy explanation above. I'll now return to the topic at hand.
First off, since it is necessary for the development staff to further consider the implementation, we cannot guarantee the timeframe as far as whether it will be included in the next version update.
Regarding the types of parameters that would be reworked, special abilities such as Aftermath and Afterglow will remain, while parameters such as the DMG rating, attack, and accuracy will be set to match the content level post-rework.
Since the parameters will be reworked to become aligned with high content difficulty, we do not intend to rework it in small intervals such as with the previous method of Trial of the Magians.
Prior to now, RME were considered the strongest weapons, so I think there will need to be some change to this viewpoint. For those who have RME, you may not require the other weapons, but there now be a choice among other comparable weapons.
If you are worried about how these weapons will be able to be used, for example, against Delve boss monsters, here are some parameters which we are looking at for the reworking. This is just for RME one-handed swords as an example:
Excalibur
DMG:73 Delay:233 Attack+40
"Knights of Round"
Additional effect: Damage varies with HP
to
DMG:121 Delay:233 Attack+60 Accuracy+20
"Knights of Round"
Additional effect: Damage varies with HP
Burtgang
DMG:73 Delay:264 Enmity+18
Physical damage taken-18% Reduces Enmity decrease when taking damage
"Atonement"
Aftermath: Increases Acc./Atk./Occ. attacks twice or thrice
to
DMG:131 Delay:264 Attack+20 Accuracy+20 Enmity+18
Physical damage taken-18% Reduces Enmity decrease when taking damage
"Atonement"
Aftermath: Increases Acc./Atk./Occ. attacks twice or thrice
Almace
DMG:70 Delay:224 DEX+20
"Chant du Cygne"
Aftermath: Occ. deals double damage
to
DMG:114 Delay:224 Attack+20 Accuracy+20 DEX+20
"Chant du Cygne"
Aftermath: Occ. deals double damage
Since coin weapons were originally just intended to be used for Empyrean weapon skills, based on the concept, I believe that instead of reworking them, they can be used to open the dedicated weapon skills (with certain level and job restrictions). We are currently considering the adjustment procedures necessary for this..
In conclusion
I've gone on for a while, so considering the reworking for level 99 Relic, Mythic, and Empyrean weapons as well as the unlocking of dedicated weapon skills via Coin weapons, please let us know your opinions. We will read through your thoughts one by one to make sure we understand your point of view.
Note that this is a large departure from the original plan. Considering the feasibility of scheduling this change, the development may take some time.
I apologize for keeping you waiting on my response.
Thanks in advance!
Translated by: Slycer | |
| 05-09-2013 2:19 PM | | Akihiko Matsui | | Dev Team | |
| | Follow-up: Level 99 Relic, Mythic, Empyrean, and Walk of Echoes Weapons
Matsui here.
Thank you all so much for the feedback on relic, mythic, empyrean, and Walk of Echoes weapons. It has helped out tremendously.
After reading over all of your feedback, instead of continuing the growth of these weapons by unlocking the weapon skills that are tied to each of the weapons, I feel it would be better to perform a revamp on RME weapons. (Regarding Walk of Echoes weapons, I will talk about this below, but they will be involved with unlocking the specialized weapon skills.)
I've been reworking a lot, and writing it all up, but it seems the post turned out rather lengthy, so once you have been able to read through it all and digest it we'd love to hear your feedback.
Content Level
We've received a lot of questions about the stats on Adoulin equipment, and I'd like to once again explain about growth and content levels in Seekers of Adoulin as this is a critical aspect in order to receive feedback on the revamps for RME weapons.
The content in Adoulin has been designed with a repeating play-cycle where you challenge content that you are able to at that moment in time, gather equipment, become stronger, and then take on higher tier content which will allow you to gather even stronger equipment.
It's through the procurement of equipment that will allow players to grow and level up.
We've established content levels for Adoulin content as a means to objectively display difficulty benchmarks. The below is a concrete illustration of these content levels.
| 20 |
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Delve (Boss monsters) |
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| 19 |
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| 18 |
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| 17 |
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New Additions to Wildskeeper Reives |
| 16 |
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| 15 |
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| 14 |
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Delve (NM group 2) |
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| 13 |
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New additions to Skirmish |
| 12 |
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| 11 |
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Delve (NM group 1) |
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| 10 |
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| 9 |
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New additions to Colonization/Lair Reives |
| 8 |
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| 7 |
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Wildskeeper Reives |
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| 6 |
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Skirmish |
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| 5 |
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Colonization/Lair Reives |
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| 4 |
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| 3 |
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| 2 |
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| 1 |
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| Content Level |
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Up to April 2013 |
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Next version update (currently adjusting) |
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Equipment strength is dependent on the level of the content you need to challenge in order to obtain the equipment, not the level in which it can be equipped. With the gear that is released in Adoulin from here on out, they can be equipped at level 99; however, instead of considering these to be level 99 pieces of equipment, it would be better for you to think of their level in terms of the content level (for example, level 110 or level 120).
The strength of the monsters that will be introduced are matched to that of the content level, but since there is somewhat of a solidified hierarchy between content, it's been setup so that the strength can be felt with even one level difference in content level. Oppositely, the parameters on Adoulin equipment have been calculated and set in order to deal with these monsters.
Fundamentally we will be making it so that the content level for content to come in the future continues to become higher, but there may be cases where we fill in areas where there is a large jump in content level as needed.
Also, in order to make it so there are various types of content sprawled across a single content level, we are supplementing it with content variations. We've also designed plans to enable resting periods where we will expand laterally instead of vertically, because players may get burnt out going full steam ahead.
In the next version update we will be adding content focusing on filling in the gaps as well as supplementing with content variation.
In the above chart, please look at the “Next version update (currently adjusting)” column. For content levels 6-9 (Skirmish/Wildskeeper Reives), we will be adding equipment appropriate for these content levels that can be exchanged for Bayld along with new Colonization and Lair Reives. Additionally, we will be filling in content for levels 13 and 17.
For those players who are already able to take on Skirmish, Wildskeeper Reives, and Delve at this point in time, it will not be absolutely necessary to challenge this content, but we will be making the above adjustments in case you want to increase your success rate, or are feeling that the current situation is still a bit tough.
Also, as a plan to resolve the issue where Skirmish is not really connecting the content as was planned, we will be undergoing maintenance at the end of this week and making it so statue segments can be obtained from Colonization and Lair Reives at a set rate. (These adjustments are separate from the rules associated with obtaining these items via Coalition Assignments, HELM, and Soul Pyres.)
By performing these adjustments we envision the below flow:
Challenge Colonization and Lair Reives
Obtain statue segments by participating in these reives
Challenge Skirmish with the parts you have obtained
Weapon Revamps
Sorry, I got off track for a bit, but now I'd like to return to the topic at hand.
To start off, I still need to discuss the implementation period with the rest of the development team, so it will be a bit difficult to address this immediately in the next version update, and we cannot make any promises as to when this will take place.
In regards to the kind of stats that will be added when we revamp these weapons, fundamentally the afterglow and aftermath effects as well as the other special stats will carry over and we'll be setting damage values, attack, and accuracy stats to coincide with the content level.
While the stats will be quite strong, we do not plan on making it possible to continuously enhance them in short intervals like the original method of enhancing via Trial of the Magians.
However, RME weapons have been considered the ultimate weapons up until this point in time, but I feel that this needs to change a bit.
I would like to make a shift so that instead of having it so that other weapons aren't necessary if you have RME weapons, you have a choice. If you are happy with RME, then you can use RME, and for those who want other weapons you can use other weapons.
With that said, there may be players who are worried if these weapons will eventually become unusable, but to give an example we had the lead make some calculations for the stats needed to combat the Delve boss monsters, and the below is what the RME swords would look like:
Excalibur
DMG: 73 Delay: 233 Attack+40 "Knights of Round" Additional effect: Damage varies with HP |
DMG: 121 Delay: 233 Attack+60 Accuracy+20 "Knights of Round" Additional effect: Damage varies with HP |
Burtgang
DMG: 73 Delay: 264 Enmity+18 Physical damage taken -18% Reduces Enmity decrease when taking damage. "Atonement" Aftermath: Increases Acc./Atk./Occ. Attacks twice or thrice |
DMG: 131 Delay: 264 Attack+20 Accuracy+20 Enmity+18 Physical damage taken -18% Reduces Enmity decrease when taking damage. "Atonement" Aftermath: Increases Acc./Atk./Occ. Attacks twice or thrice |
Almace
DMG: 70 Delay: 224 DEX+20 "Chant du Cygne" Aftermath: Occ. deals double damage |
DMG: 114 Delay: 224 Attack+20 Accuracy+20 DEX+20 "Chant du Cygne" Aftermath: Occ. deals double damage |
In regards to Walk of Echoes weapons, these were implemented with the concept of allowing players to use the specialized empyrean weapon skills, so instead of revamping them we felt it more appropriate to have them serve to unlock the weapons skills (planning to have restrictions based on jobs and level). Also, we are looking into adjustments for the method to create Walk of Echoes weapons.
In conclusion…
Apologies that this post is so long, but based on all of the above we would love to hear your feedback on the revamps to level 99 RME weapons and unlocking weapon skills with Walk of Echoes weapons.
I will be sure to read over each and every comment you all post.
My thoughts and ideas have completely turned around the plans that were originally drawn up, and I had to sit and really discuss the idea with the rest of the development team, including the possibilities of making this happen.
I apologize that this response was late and that I made you all wait.
Thank you all very much. | |
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