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Cyber-Bullying: Has it gone too far?
 Bismarck.Bloodrose
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By Bismarck.Bloodrose 2013-04-14 06:36:40
http://ca.news.yahoo.com/blogs/pulseofcanada/yahoo-visitors-speak-handle-cyber-bullying-161316862.htmlProsecute them, publicly shame them, teach them and forgive them. The possible ways to handle the growing issue of cyber-bullying are varied and often conflict one another. But one thing is clear, Canadians are upset and passionate about the latest scourge to afflict our country’s youth.
Nova Scotia teen Rehtaeh Parsons took her own life after being sexually abused while drunk and then cyber-bullied over pictures posted online. She was teased, mocked and isolated. And now she is dead. Another young Canadian whose life was ruined by the cruelty of others.
Prime Minister Stephen Harper said it was beyond time we took cyber-bullying more seriously, telling reporters, “Bullying to me has a kind of connotation … of kids misbehaving. What we are dealing with in some of these circumstances is simply criminal activity.”
Canadians, it seems, agree. In a discussion this week, Yahoo! Canada News readers offered constructive suggestions on how to address cyber-bullying. It is too late for Retaeh Parsons, but here are some ideas that could stop it from happening again.
For some, the issue comes right down to a lack of respect and appreciation for one another. Taqrin says parents are not doing enough to teach their children respect. “Problem is, parents are not teaching their kids the meaning of RESPECT and without respect for your fellow man you have nothing,” Taqrin wrote. “Treat others the way you would want them to treat you. With respect.”
Ron P. couldn’t agree more, saying, “Simple: Do unto others as you would have them do unto you. It's a tough enough world out there. Try just giving someone a smile.”
Many more commentators agreed. However, West had another tilt on the issue of parenting, saying boundaries needed to be defined for children:
Quote: When my sister and I were kids, we had at least 1 parent home with us 95% of the time. I wasn't allowed to play video games that were rated R, or adult, ditto for watching movies. There were kids we weren't allowed to hang around, there were places we weren't allowed to go.
Parents these days are trying too hard to be the cool parent, not enough of them realize how much harm it can do to be cool parents.
Anna attempted to put herself in the place of parents whose children commit cyber-bullying. She had a tough time:
Quote: My boys ever treat another human the way these two young girls were treated they will know they are embarking down a path their father and I will not support. They will know this through a few of the many, many, many talks we will have with them as they grow up.
I keep coming back to how disappointed I would be in them. I wonder what the parents of the four accused boys are thinking about all of this?
Others joined the online debate more interested in how to deal with acts of cyber-bullying than how to avoid future ones.
Lisa wrote that the justice system was too light on bullies. “Start charging those bullies with manslaughter in some form,” she wrote. “Or have them spend their remaining days going from school to school telling their story to other students of how they bullied someone to death and that bullying is no laughing matter....I was bullied to!”
Elaine agreed, saying, “Put some ‘teeth’ into the law. Cyber-bullying is more than just playing malicious pranks. If a suicide results from the bullying then charge the perpetrators with murder.”
Not everyone was about the justice system. Tnarg felt it was better to handle things personally, writing, “Bullies are always cowards. The best thing to do is to smash them in the face. Then they will leave you alone.”
Of course, in the age of cyber-bullying there are other ways to attack bullies than with violence. Elle sided with the online hackers “Anonymous,” who threatened to release the identities of Parsons’ attackers:
Quote: I've never heard of this ‘Anonymous’ group, but I love you, whomever you are. I say do it, release those cowards’ names. Too many kids are KILLING THEMSELVES over cyber-bullying. Maybe if there's some sort of fear of retaliation for the bullies, they won't bully in the first place. I thought bullying was supposed to be a criminal offence now... what the hell happened to that?
Stiffer penalties, physical violence and online retribution may bring sufferers some immediate gratification, but some question whether it is more than a temporary reprieve from the issue. Will it actually cause cyber-bullying to go away?
Neil doesn’t think so. In his post, he said the only way to address bullying is to understand that something has caused those people to lash out.
He writes:
Quote: Bullying will never end. That is a fact, harsh but true. And the more rules and regulations that are created to stop it will only serve to further enslave us... and they won’t stop the bullying.
In most cases a bully was bullied themselves, and by their very own parents. Try and imagine what it’s like to go home where you’re supposed to feel safe and you get beat up by your drunk father. Or verbally abused. Such a child feels powerless in a hostile environment and they seek to regain that power and sense of security in any way and any place they can.
What I am getting at is that the true cause of bullying goes much deeper than just "bad kids that need to be punished". Because of this you cannot get rid of or treat the problem with rules against bullying. A bully by their very nature is a rule breaker so it won’t help the real problem. Any rules or regulations will only serve as revenge for hurt families... knowing that their injustice is not going without punishment. Who among us dares to look deeper to the cause of bullying? If you do you will see that it will never be abolished... to wish to abolish it is to want to make the world a perfect place and the more you try to control it and manipulate it with rules the less perfect it becomes.
Underneath is my yahoo response (which for w/e reason wouldn't be posted) Quote: Personally, i think Neil is full of ***. I was bullied by my father, even beaten. Some of these kids grow up with a silver spoon up their ***, believing that because they are far superior, they can belittle and demean anyone in any shape or form, without repurcussions. As a victim of bullying, and having done bullying myself, for which i have apologized - you feel helpless. Sometimes the people around you feel helpless and act on survival instincts in a social setting.
I do believe that Harper is half right - there is a negative connotation, but it's not as simple as misbehaving. Bullies instinctively pick out who they percieve to be the weakest target - primarily someone who already has extremely little confidence, or someone who "looks like a victim" before they are a victim. Now, before anyoone gets on me about blaming the victim: Don't bother, because i am not blaming the victim. Victims may not be completely powerless, but what happens with bullying is that they are made to feel powerless infront of their agitators. It could be as simple as wearing your hair a specific way, wearing something that feels good, but looks different.Based on my observations and experiences from both sides of the coin, Bullies tend to be afraid of change more than anyone. They do everything they can to get a reaction, a result, to ridicule, torment, and so forth, in order to keep things the same - They stay on top of the social food chain. The responses by schools with their "Zero Tolerance" policies to bullying is pure garbage - atleast with how it's implimented and acted on. A student who is forced to fight back physically is often seen as "violent" or has "Anger Problems", despite the administration knowing full well that other students with societal behavior problems were involved, and doing the agitating. I mean seriously, wouldn't YOU be upset off as well if someone was degrading you, humiliating you, and NO ONE stepped in to help, when they know they could have?
By Quiznor 2013-04-14 06:42:17
Not a week goes by without someone killing themselves here over cyber bullying. Cops wont step it. Government BARELY steps. Schools wont step it
By Artemicion 2013-04-14 06:53:15
It's a difficult subject to address as it has many variables within that often lack context, or knowledge of scenario and circumstance therein. It is also difficult to "draw the line" between unreasonable prosecution for simply being a jerk, and giving leeway for victims with what can ultimately be summed up as a "Deal with it."
What conditions must be met for bullying to be considered tangible criminal activity? Are people going to be held indirectly responsible for the actions of another based on the possibility of their inability to cope with subsequent teasing and/or bullying? What can local or federal authorities do to enact on such an obscure and vague medium of communication, where anonymity is rampant?
All I can say for sure is we desperately need to tackle this problem at the roots. Teach our sons and daughters better; to have compassion and empathy for their fellow human beings. And while it may sound insincere or a cop-out on a very serious matter, it is the only tangible answer I can give without hesitation or repercussions.
We need to create our future generations with the knowledge, understanding, and respect for everyone around them.
While there will always be exceptions and anecdotal cases, we cannot abandon the fight for the possibility of peace between one another.
 Valefor.Sehachan
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By Valefor.Sehachan 2013-04-14 06:55:23
Most of the time I don't understand what people expect out of those being bullied. I was bullied throughout highschool and telling the teachers resulted in "grow up" or "learn to fight your fights and make them respect you", etc. But if people are bullying me, it means they don't give a damn about my oratory. One of my favourite is "ignore them and they'll give up", they *** don't, they see you as an even easier target, and often if you don't react they start getting physical, or that's what happened to me.
So, how are you supposed to fight a bully? You either retort to violence(and you succumb anyway if it's a group), or you can ask for help...and what people tell you is to stop being a baby.
Of course victims of bullying get depressed, no one *** cares. People that haven't received that treatment think it's an insignificant thing, no big deal. But it is if it affects your daily life.
Sorry about the rant.
 Quetzalcoatl.Tealsic
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By Quetzalcoatl.Tealsic 2013-04-14 07:06:05
I had to go to the gym, and work my arse off to stop the bullying. Now I spend most my time trying to help others from the bullying. Not many people will continue to run their mouth at the little guys when someone much much bigger stands in the way. I hate this cyber bully sh**. Life isn't FFXI, and your computer isn't an Ochain.
Bismarck.Bloodrose
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By Bismarck.Bloodrose 2013-04-14 07:07:44
In this particular case of Rehteah Parsons, and that of Amanda Todd, there were obvious forms of criminal activity going along with the bullying - Slander, Defemation of Character, Libel (or is it Lible?) amongst the horrid and cruel public harassment, the photographed gang-rape, which was posted on facebook, then redistributed by friends and others to more sites, etc.
AS Artemicion, and others have said, this is a very fine line. We need a way to clearly define what is "acceptable" (meaning the stuff we will never, ever get rid of, or for doing something blatantly stupid despite knowing better and being called a dumb-*** for), and criminal activity. Some people are defending these boys' actions as "boys will be boys", or "she was drunk and passed out, so she was asking for it" etc.
Granted, there have been some better responses, and some of them resound similarly to the biblical addage of "Do unto others as You would have them do unto You" - the again, others have noted that many parents try to be the cool laid back parent, like best friends, unable to give a deserved punishment for their actions because it's "brutal, unacceptable, mean-spirited, and detrimental" to their "positive growth" by experts like Dr. Phil. Many teens now have their parents by the balls. They can't or don't know how to effectively teach a child responsibility.
One commenter actually blamed crime dramas like CSI and Law and Order: SVU for sensationalizing the behavior (which they don't, as they pertain to dramatically portray the legal processes involved with dealing out punishments to offenders.)
Of course the best solutions aren't always simple - which is what people want, a quick fix to a complex problem. One person may have rightly pointed out that it's gradually complex in nature ranging from the parent(s) to the teachers, school officials, other parents, friends, family, and different levels of government.
Some people really do need to be burned badly before they learn to stop playing with fire.
Bismarck.Bloodrose
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By Bismarck.Bloodrose 2013-04-14 07:09:10
Quetzalcoatl.Tealsic said: »I had to go to the gym, and work my arse off to stop the bullying. Now I spend most my time trying to help others from the bullying. Not many people will continue to run their mouth at the little guys when someone much much bigger stands in the way. I hate this cyber bully sh**. Life isn't FFXI, and your computer isn't an Ochain. Probably one of the best analogies towards bullying ever.
Valefor.Sehachan
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By Valefor.Sehachan 2013-04-14 07:12:31
Quetzalcoatl.Tealsic said: »I had to go to the gym, and work my arse off to stop the bullying. Now I spend most my time trying to help others from the bullying. Not many people will continue to run their mouth at the little guys when someone much much bigger stands in the way. I hate this cyber bully sh**. Life isn't FFXI, and your computer isn't an Ochain. I wish I could look intimidating, but I'm tall 5 feet and an apple, weight less than my shoes and overall look like a child...when I glare at people they think I'm cute instead of intimidating...enemies don't take me seriously.
Quetzalcoatl.Tealsic
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By Quetzalcoatl.Tealsic 2013-04-14 07:13:38
And Bloodrose....My bully was a rish kid whos dad owned the local newspaper, owned huge amounts of land, and never raised a hand to his child.
By Artemicion 2013-04-14 07:15:20
While it would likely be effective, I don't believe in the solution of "making an example" of someone, unless it was absolutely warranted.
Otherwise we undermine our already pathetic judicial system with scare tactics, which in the long run will prove ineffective to the underlying problem at hand.
While the comment sections in forums and relevant articles aren't the best example, one proper step to creating a solution, is understanding that the problem is a complicated and complex one. One with many variables and subjective relevance and consequence to the outcome of these scenarios. Otherwise, we end up ineffectively passing blame, and eluding responsibility for a tragedy and resolve nothing.
Also while I'd love to see law enforcement crack down on cases of severe slander, libel, etc., it would be too much, too late in these frequent cases of victim suicide. We need to approach this with preventive measures rather than subsequently.
Bismarck.Bloodrose
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By Bismarck.Bloodrose 2013-04-14 07:17:25
Most of the time I don't understand what people expect out of those being bullied. I was bullied throughout highschool and telling the teachers resulted in "grow up" or "learn to fight your fights and make them respect you", etc. But if people are bullying me, it means they don't give a damn about my oratory. One of my favourite is "ignore them and they'll give up", they *** don't, they see you as an even easier target, and often if you don't react they start getting physical, or that's what happened to me.
So, how are you supposed to fight a bully? You either retort to violence(and you succumb anyway if it's a group), or you can ask for help...and what people tell you is to stop being a baby.
Of course victims of bullying get depressed, no one *** cares. People that haven't received that treatment think it's an insignificant thing, no big deal. But it is if it affects your daily life.
Sorry about the rant. No worries about the rant. This is a serious thread, and having some serious perspective is a good thing.
Personally i am a big guy. 6'3" big, size 18 feet big, palm a basketball by age 14 big, 414 at high school grad big. All of my high school life i was bullied or beaten up by small kids trying to make a name for themselves. I have been told by countless admins and teachers to "grow up", "tell a teacher/someone who cares" so many times in a single day, i became numb to the idea. Seha's right - bullies will do whatever they can to get a reaction, and it gets progressively worse towards physical altercations - which is criminal. Being the big guy, i was often the one suspended and eventually expelled from schools because of the damage i *could* have caused, and even sent through to numerous "anger management programs" and even 3 different schools for behavioral problems. One of my teachers in grade 5 told my mother i was schizophrenic because i had enough of the bullying and the Zero Tolerance policy which allowed teachers to do absolutely nothing. I was forced to see a schoolboard mandated psychologist because of it - and surprisingly enough - i wasn't crazy. Schoolboard didn't give a *** - they sent me to a behavioral school immediately anyways - even when they knew the offending students had a LOOOOONG history of bullying others, even being violent with them.
Quetzalcoatl.Tealsic
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By Quetzalcoatl.Tealsic 2013-04-14 07:17:29
I wish I could look intimidating, but I'm tall 5 feet and an apple, weight less than my shoes and overall look like a child...when I glare at people they think I'm cute instead of intimidating...enemies don't take me seriously. YouTube Video Placeholder
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Bismarck.Bloodrose
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By Bismarck.Bloodrose 2013-04-14 07:23:19
While it would likely be effective, I don't believe in the solution of "making an example" of someone, unless it was absolutely warranted.
Otherwise we undermine our already pathetic judicial system with scare tactics, which in the long run will prove ineffective to the underlying problem at hand.
While the comment sections in forums and relevant articles aren't the best example, one proper step to creating a solution, is understanding that the problem is a complicated and complex one. One with many variables and subjective relevance and consequence to the outcome of these scenarios. Otherwise, we end up ineffectively passing blame, and eluding responsibility for a tragedy and resolve nothing.
Also while I'd love to see law enforcement crack down on cases of severe slander, libel, etc., it would be too much, too late in these frequent cases of victim suicide. We need to approach this with preventive measures rather than subsequently.
I do agree with most of your last paragraph, but if we believe in the "too little/too late" excuse for not dealing with something, it's really much of the same in letting people off the hook. Closure and resolution isn't given to the victim, and the offenders are still free to go about it without consequence - other than people on forums blatantly saying sweet words that have no kick.
The preventative measures are probably the most complicated part, because it relies on people and their individual as well as mass moral codes. I'm not sure how many people notice a pattern, but while someone decries something on a social medium like forums or facebook, their individual morals may differ slighly to radically.
Bismarck.Bloodrose
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By Bismarck.Bloodrose 2013-04-14 07:25:56
Quetzalcoatl.Tealsic said: »I had to go to the gym, and work my arse off to stop the bullying. Now I spend most my time trying to help others from the bullying. Not many people will continue to run their mouth at the little guys when someone much much bigger stands in the way. I hate this cyber bully sh**. Life isn't FFXI, and your computer isn't an Ochain. I wish I could look intimidating, but I'm tall 5 feet and an apple, weight less than my shoes and overall look like a child...when I glare at people they think I'm cute instead of intimidating...enemies don't take me seriously.
There are two types of people i've learned to watch out for when it comes to being bullied: The small ones, and the quiet ones. You can easily predict the actions (to a point) of the Big n Loud (which i mean people trying to look big, as opposed to those they try to make look small and timid) because you honestly never know what they will do.
By Artemicion 2013-04-14 07:28:35
By no means did I intend to interpret that statement as a means of letting people off the hook. On the contrary, an ideal solution is to further define local and federal law of such cases, so when properly investigated, will have individuals be held accountable for their actions, despite the potential outcome.
Perhaps in combination with sensitivity encouragement in future upbringing, we can wane the alarming frequency of these suicide by bulling cases... But alas, I'm drowning my pragmatism with optimism.
By Zyla 2013-04-14 07:55:31
i already know that a ton of ppl are going to disagree with me, but this is my own opinion and nobody is obligated to do so anyways.
in cases of bullying (and almost every violent crime) i am 150% completely in favor of capital punishment. it boils down to this: if nobody does anything about it, bullies are always gonna look at it like "ain't nobody gonna do ***, it'll be a slap on the wrist, and we'll just pound on the dude again tomorrow".
i say let the punishment fit the crime. a bunch of kids gang up on a guy? hows about gatherin up that group in a public setting and lettin that poor kid put a 2x4 to each one of their faces one good time. in more dire cases where the victims life has been forfeit then the same should be done as well, a public execution would be fitting of the crime.
again just my opinion and i'm well aware ppl will think me a bad person because of it, but it doesn't change the fact that w/o severe consequences to deter offenders bullying will never, ever stop...
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Quetzalcoatl.Tealsic
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By Quetzalcoatl.Tealsic 2013-04-14 07:58:53
i already know that a ton of ppl are going to disagree with me, but this is my own opinion and nobody is obligated to do so anyways.
in cases of bullying (and almost every violent crime) i am 150% completely in favor of capital punishment. it boils down to this: if nobody does anything about it, bullies are always gonna look at it like "ain't nobody gonna do ***, it'll be a slap on the wrist, and we'll just pound on the dude again tomorrow".
i say let the punishment fit the crime. a bunch of kids gang up on a guy? hows about gatherin up that group in a public setting and lettin that poor kid put a 2x4 to each one of their faces one good time. in more dire cases where the victims life has been forfeit then the same should be done as well, a public execution would be fitting of the crime.
again just my opinion and i'm well aware ppl will think me a bad person because of it, but it doesn't change the fact that w/o severe consequences to deter offenders bullying will never, ever stop...
What about a makeshift "Restraining order" type solution on any friends the bully does have? In my case my bully had a friend that, when with him, would make him "untouchable" only because nobody wanted to piss his friend off. Get rid of THEIR back up, and I think they are nothing.
Bismarck.Bloodrose
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By Bismarck.Bloodrose 2013-04-14 08:29:22
When i was in the beginning of grade 8, a bully of mine from Grade 7 made a decision to gather all his friends, their friends, and some of their brothers and even one kid's sister, and encircled me in a forced fight with him. My school's Guidance Councilor happened to walk by, and not say a word - She happened to be monitoring the hallways during lunch break when it occurred. Anyways, things progressed since i refused to fight, and tried to make my way out of the circle, only to be pushed back in over and over again. Some of the kids involved actually admitted this when it was "investigated", but i'll explain that later.
Some threats were made by this kid who wanted to fight me, to prove how "tough" he was when everyone was looking. He threw a few punches at me, one of them connected giving me a nice shiner a few days later. It was at this point i had to grab him by the scruff of the neck, and knee'd the *** in the stomache - right when the guidance councilor was coming back down that hallway. Immediately she recommended to the Assistant principal that i be expelled for violent behavior, and a "severe anger problem". She had also been counciling me the previous year on how to deal with bullies, particularly this one, with such feeble lines like "Oh, well just ignore him" "But he gets worse, he's thrown rocks at me" "so tell someone you trust, an advisor or councilor" "but i just told you - it happened 10 minutea go!" and the ever favorite "well, you gotta grow up and deal with these kinds of things your whole life - no one will ever leave you alone" - This last quote was actually said by a former math teacher turned school administrator.
Back to the story - I had just finished putting my knee into this kids stomache when the councilor came back, and while i was sitting in the office, and this kid in the school nurse's office, the guidance councilor called the police, trying to have me arrested, even skewing the facts to the officer who came by. She decided to gather the facts herself, which several of the kids who pushed me back into the circled abandoned their friend, and told the truth. The officer told the schoolboard i had every conceivable right to fight back - because i was in a liable position to fight for my life. And this was in Grade 8.
A ton of the victims will continue to say that the biggest problem they face isn't the bullies. It's the people who stand by and do nothing, or pretend their hands are tied, or even worse, pretend they have no power at all.
If your hands are tied, go kicking and screaming. Don't just tell someone you trust, tell EVERYONE you trust. A lot of people will say "Ignore it", "let it slide," or "but high school doesn't last forever" or any variation of. Talking about bullying quietly means it will be dealt with quietly, when it's such a loud problem.
I personally think that some of Zyla's approach to dealing out punishments is a bit extreme, but there does need to be adequate punishment, and adequate power for those involved to discipline for such actions.
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Phoenix.Degs
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By Phoenix.Degs 2013-04-14 09:07:50
I've told my boys from the beginning, that if kids are teasing you.. ignore it... words don't mean ***. I encourage them to be the bigger man and not sink to their level. With that said.... If it gets physical, and they know not to start the fight... but to finish it if it gets to that point. They know that I will support them no matter what if they have to defend themselves and end up getting in trouble.
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Cerberus.Robmelee
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By Cerberus.Robmelee 2013-04-14 09:08:19
Bullying is a classic epidemic problem with lasting mental proportions if left unchecked with children, can result to later abnormal emotional problems as adults.
The problem with bullying is... We all have built-in individual traits and unique ways that we observe and perceive information. Naturally we as people want to do right and feel like that action taken was the "right" one especially amongst children when trying to find there fitting and place of so-call "acceptance" in there respective environments.
Ordinarily this notion would be fine in a leveled playing field. Which sadly isn't the case today. The world as we know it, being violent by many years of having the mentality to "Divide and Conquer" bullying is only a natural inevitable by-product of what we allowed as a people.
If you think about it, Bullying is assumed to be a mechanism to measure bravery and to reveal cowardice. In fact it does neither, what it does is ruin the already perfectly naturally established minds of good people and transform them to inevitable violent individuals they may later evolve to be.
You see we all start off fine as children, provided there is a positive family(like) environment that gives all the basic elements needed to keep us moving forward. Which we all know isn't always the case. Seriously no child brings weapons to school UNLESS something triggered them to do so.
In the end, everything is Causality. Action...Reaction...Cause, and Effect!
I was raised to only FIGHT unless someone hits me first. I was punished if I ever started a fight, but was forgiven if I defended myself. Which is the way it ought to be. But boy did I endure a lot of verbal abuse in school. Fortunately once I was ever in a fight I was able to end them quickly and hospitalize my bullies and I wasn't bothered for the rest of a given school year. I was no prize fighter by no means. I fought very dirty, I took advantage of my environment and did whatever I had to, to "end" the fight. I wasn't interesting in traded punches I was only aimed at having my bully on the ground and made an example of. >:)
Just to point something out, hurting another person NEVER entered my heart and mind, until the ideology of someone else wishing and attempting to do harm to me actually occurred first. I guess when the animal side within us takes over, sorry to say... anything goes!
What's funny is school administration don't see that, and both kids are automatically suspended regardless to whom started it and the circumstances of the victim. That precedent alone establishes the schools really don't care for the kids being bullied which seems to results to children bringing weapons to schools or killing there selves and school admins sit there wondering why?
Ultimately is seems to be a lack of due care overall from all sides. For once this one actually isn't solely on the parents. Parents can only do so much in guiding there kids, in the end we all have to be involved in a community effort, even if its just in a small way, because believe it or not that can make all the difference in mental security of a child.
In today's reality, In truth... no one really gives a damn which is why Bullying exists and will continue to exist in this world as we know it.
Bismarck.Bloodrose
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By Bismarck.Bloodrose 2013-04-14 09:11:39
AS much as i applaud the second part of that Degs, i have to say i don't agree with the first part, since ignoring it is a huge part of the problem - which allows it to get to the physical part. Sometimes the bullying starts at being pushed down to look like a fool.
And that's a problem - it's easy to ignore something that doesn't touch us physically, but it's much more dangerous to let it be ignored when we do have the power to stop it before reaching that point.
As i said, when your hands are tied, it's best to go kicking and screaming.
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Valefor.Sehachan
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By Valefor.Sehachan 2013-04-14 09:18:05
words don't mean ***. I encourage them to be the bigger man and not sink to their level. You can not show to the bully that you're hurt, but no one's a robot, emotional damage exists if it goes on for long, and more importantly if it involves public humiliation. Words might be just words, but if the bully(ies) make a clown out of you, like hell you can shrug it off. Even non physical bullying can cause a lot of damage to a person.
Phoenix.Degs
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By Phoenix.Degs 2013-04-14 09:19:52
Bismarck.Bloodrose said: »AS much as i applaud the second part of that Degs, i have to say i don't agree with the first part, since ignoring it is a huge part of the problem - which allows it to get to the physical part. Sometimes the bullying starts at being pushed down to look like a fool.
And that's a problem - it's easy to ignore something that doesn't touch us physically, but it's much more dangerous to let it be ignored when we do have the power to stop it before reaching that point.
As i said, when your hands are tied, it's best to go kicking and screaming. I have said that they should stick up for themselves verbally also, but within reason and in certain moments... gotta pick your battles so to speak. alot of the time, if you are getting teased for whatever reason, if you dont let it bother you, and even make the joke back fire on them... they lose interest... Im not saying this happens all the time, but it can. Personally if someone were to cuss me out and make fun of my family or myself... i would come back with something just as much... but it depends on the situation and depends on what is said... alot of crap i would suggest let go.
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Posts: 62
By Bismarck.Nahhhhhhhhhhhhh 2013-04-14 09:27:41
Everyone in this thread has a major chip on their shoulder and I think need to find some peace in their lives.
Seriously, most of the people that "bullied" you or whatever are probably losers now. I regularly run into people that would make fun of me or whatever when I was in middle school, etc. and they're always the ones asking me which pump I'm parked at so they can push the little button to let out the gas.
I feel bad for them, because they probably only did it due to something they lacked in their own personal lives.
Quetzalcoatl.Tealsic said: »I had to go to the gym, and work my arse off to stop the bullying. Now I spend most my time trying to help others from the bullying. Not many people will continue to run their mouth at the little guys when someone much much bigger stands in the way. I hate this cyber bully sh**. Life isn't FFXI, and your computer isn't an Ochain. This post made me cringe. You sound like you're a bigger douche than you seem to realize.
-You talk about going to the gym and how you stand in for people all the time now.
-You imply that people that you are stopping are always smaller than you.
-You imply again that someone that is talking to you on a computer is somehow always physically inferior to you.
Sounds to me like you are the bully or at the very least a bit delusional. I'm not picking on you, but really man you need to look at how you're speaking because you are just like the people you are talking about.
Valefor.Sehachan
Server: Valefor
Game: FFXI
Posts: 24219
By Valefor.Sehachan 2013-04-14 09:30:57
Bullies being lower individuals than me does not matter at all to me. Once they've ruined my life where they are now is of 0 importance to me, I care about myself, not if karma got them back.
My dad always said, if someone pick on you remember you're better than them. That's cool, but it does absolutely nothing to help me in practice.
Phoenix.Degs
Server: Phoenix
Game: FFXI
Posts: 2448
By Phoenix.Degs 2013-04-14 09:32:46
When I was in middle school in the early 90s you never heard of someone killing themselves over being bullied... I think the biggest problem is social media... things like forums, facebook, cell phones/texting... and so on. There is no escape from it.... My son was getting bullied and we took away texting on his phone and restricted his facebook to protect him from this crap... things have gotten alot better. The most important thing a parent can do is listen to what their kids are saying, and use common sense judgement to protect them.
 Bahamut.Genevie
Server: Bahamut
Game: FFXI
Posts: 415
By Bahamut.Genevie 2013-04-14 09:33:22
HOW does he sound like a bully.Your criticism isn't in the least bit constructive. 'I'm not picking on you, but'..............
Server: Bismarck
Game: FFXI
Posts: 62
By Bismarck.Nahhhhhhhhhhhhh 2013-04-14 09:35:40
Bullies being lower individuals than me does not matter at all to me. Once they've ruined my life where they are now is of 0 importance to me, I care about myself, not if karma got them back.
My dad always said, if someone pick on you remember you're better than them. That's cool, but it does absolutely nothing to help me in practice. How did it ruin your life? Why would you still let it affect you now?
I'm curious because I'm married now and have a kid on the way and could really care less. I think I've had bigger problems than some *** in the 5th grade that had his friends hold me down while he threw a ball at my face.
Bismarck.Bloodrose
Server: Bismarck
Game: FFXI
Posts: 4322
By Bismarck.Bloodrose 2013-04-14 09:36:31
I wanted to save this for later on, but i think it's important to address now.
Anger Management. Unfortunately don't mean Charlie Sheen's newest sitcom, but being forced into Anger Management Programs for standing up for yourself, having constant bullying shrugged off, and so on. To me, this is a pretty severe case of isolating the victim, another form of bullying by administrators, and furthers the impressions that it was the victim's fault for being a victim.
They don't offer anything constructive in ways to deal with bullying. They simply tell you to ignore it and "hope" it eventually goes away, but if it doesn't, to tell someone who cares. Which not enough people do, otherwise you wouldn't be isolated with other victims of bullying in an anger management course, from the rest of the kids.
Even when they tell you to shrug it off, they don't bother to tell you how, except with a "Oh just don't let them get under your skin". I came up with ways that i used to personally shrug off bullies, but i didn't realize what it was until i had already graduated. Granted, my ways won't work for everyone else, and may not even work for anyone else.
Every anger management course i went through, the more i realized that they were using something called "Complacency Tactics" - tactics used to lull victims into a sense of complacency that maybe they do care, because they spoil us with games to pass the time, and even order pizza to make us feel special, but after the course topics were covered, we never talked about what was actually wrong. We filled out blind studies, and the results were staggering. We were still blamed for being victims, we were still isolated, and quite honestly, that makes you feel alone. Would you be royally pissed off if you were continually bullied, harrassed, and then ignored by the people who are supposed to be responsible for you until the time you return home (or to a care provider's residence)?
Which brings up something else, if these schools, teachers, and administrators are supposed to be responsible for students and their wellbeing from the time they arrive at school, til the time they return home, why do so many teachers claim to have their hands tied, why do they claim powerlessness to stop, handle, or prevent such extreme bullying? Many teachers will try to cite the law, but in reality, the law is actually on their side in these matters. What isn't, is internal policy, but that's also superceded by the law as well. I have discovered teachers using methods to prevent, stop, and handle bullying without the need to lay a hand on a student, as they so claim will put them in jail, or risk their employment. They aren't punished either, and some have gone on to win teaching awards for this alone, despite being mediocre at teaching.
http://ca.news.yahoo.com/blogs/pulseofcanada/yahoo-visitors-speak-handle-cyber-bullying-161316862.htmlProsecute them, publicly shame them, teach them and forgive them. The possible ways to handle the growing issue of cyber-bullying are varied and often conflict one another. But one thing is clear, Canadians are upset and passionate about the latest scourge to afflict our country’s youth.
Nova Scotia teen Rehtaeh Parsons took her own life after being sexually abused while drunk and then cyber-bullied over pictures posted online. She was teased, mocked and isolated. And now she is dead. Another young Canadian whose life was ruined by the cruelty of others.
Prime Minister Stephen Harper said it was beyond time we took cyber-bullying more seriously, telling reporters, “Bullying to me has a kind of connotation … of kids misbehaving. What we are dealing with in some of these circumstances is simply criminal activity.”
Canadians, it seems, agree. In a discussion this week, Yahoo! Canada News readers offered constructive suggestions on how to address cyber-bullying. It is too late for Retaeh Parsons, but here are some ideas that could stop it from happening again.
For some, the issue comes right down to a lack of respect and appreciation for one another. Taqrin says parents are not doing enough to teach their children respect. “Problem is, parents are not teaching their kids the meaning of RESPECT and without respect for your fellow man you have nothing,” Taqrin wrote. “Treat others the way you would want them to treat you. With respect.”
Ron P. couldn’t agree more, saying, “Simple: Do unto others as you would have them do unto you. It's a tough enough world out there. Try just giving someone a smile.”
Many more commentators agreed. However, West had another tilt on the issue of parenting, saying boundaries needed to be defined for children:
Quote: When my sister and I were kids, we had at least 1 parent home with us 95% of the time. I wasn't allowed to play video games that were rated R, or adult, ditto for watching movies. There were kids we weren't allowed to hang around, there were places we weren't allowed to go.
Parents these days are trying too hard to be the cool parent, not enough of them realize how much harm it can do to be cool parents.
Anna attempted to put herself in the place of parents whose children commit cyber-bullying. She had a tough time:
Quote: My boys ever treat another human the way these two young girls were treated they will know they are embarking down a path their father and I will not support. They will know this through a few of the many, many, many talks we will have with them as they grow up.
I keep coming back to how disappointed I would be in them. I wonder what the parents of the four accused boys are thinking about all of this?
Others joined the online debate more interested in how to deal with acts of cyber-bullying than how to avoid future ones.
Lisa wrote that the justice system was too light on bullies. “Start charging those bullies with manslaughter in some form,” she wrote. “Or have them spend their remaining days going from school to school telling their story to other students of how they bullied someone to death and that bullying is no laughing matter....I was bullied to!”
Elaine agreed, saying, “Put some ‘teeth’ into the law. Cyber-bullying is more than just playing malicious pranks. If a suicide results from the bullying then charge the perpetrators with murder.”
Not everyone was about the justice system. Tnarg felt it was better to handle things personally, writing, “Bullies are always cowards. The best thing to do is to smash them in the face. Then they will leave you alone.”
Of course, in the age of cyber-bullying there are other ways to attack bullies than with violence. Elle sided with the online hackers “Anonymous,” who threatened to release the identities of Parsons’ attackers:
Quote: I've never heard of this ‘Anonymous’ group, but I love you, whomever you are. I say do it, release those cowards’ names. Too many kids are KILLING THEMSELVES over cyber-bullying. Maybe if there's some sort of fear of retaliation for the bullies, they won't bully in the first place. I thought bullying was supposed to be a criminal offence now... what the hell happened to that?
Stiffer penalties, physical violence and online retribution may bring sufferers some immediate gratification, but some question whether it is more than a temporary reprieve from the issue. Will it actually cause cyber-bullying to go away?
Neil doesn’t think so. In his post, he said the only way to address bullying is to understand that something has caused those people to lash out.
He writes:
Quote: Bullying will never end. That is a fact, harsh but true. And the more rules and regulations that are created to stop it will only serve to further enslave us... and they won’t stop the bullying.
In most cases a bully was bullied themselves, and by their very own parents. Try and imagine what it’s like to go home where you’re supposed to feel safe and you get beat up by your drunk father. Or verbally abused. Such a child feels powerless in a hostile environment and they seek to regain that power and sense of security in any way and any place they can.
What I am getting at is that the true cause of bullying goes much deeper than just "bad kids that need to be punished". Because of this you cannot get rid of or treat the problem with rules against bullying. A bully by their very nature is a rule breaker so it won’t help the real problem. Any rules or regulations will only serve as revenge for hurt families... knowing that their injustice is not going without punishment. Who among us dares to look deeper to the cause of bullying? If you do you will see that it will never be abolished... to wish to abolish it is to want to make the world a perfect place and the more you try to control it and manipulate it with rules the less perfect it becomes.
Underneath is my yahoo response (which for w/e reason wouldn't be posted) Quote: Personally, i think Neil is full of shit. I was bullied by my father, even beaten. Some of these kids grow up with a silver spoon up their ***, believing that because they are far superior, they can belittle and demean anyone in any shape or form, without repurcussions. As a victim of bullying, and having done bullying myself, for which i have apologized - you feel helpless. Sometimes the people around you feel helpless and act on survival instincts in a social setting.
I do believe that Harper is half right - there is a negative connotation, but it's not as simple as misbehaving. Bullies instinctively pick out who they percieve to be the weakest target - primarily someone who already has extremely little confidence, or someone who "looks like a victim" before they are a victim. Now, before anyoone gets on me about blaming the victim: Don't bother, because i am not blaming the victim. Victims may not be completely powerless, but what happens with bullying is that they are made to feel powerless infront of their agitators. It could be as simple as wearing your hair a specific way, wearing something that feels good, but looks different.Based on my observations and experiences from both sides of the coin, Bullies tend to be afraid of change more than anyone. They do everything they can to get a reaction, a result, to ridicule, torment, and so forth, in order to keep things the same - They stay on top of the social food chain. The responses by schools with their "Zero Tolerance" policies to bullying is pure garbage - atleast with how it's implimented and acted on. A student who is forced to fight back physically is often seen as "violent" or has "Anger Problems", despite the administration knowing full well that other students with societal behavior problems were involved, and doing the agitating. I mean seriously, wouldn't YOU be upset off as well if someone was degrading you, humiliating you, and NO ONE stepped in to help, when they know they could have?
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