IiPunch - Monk Guide

Wait does footwork still even work with those ws the same? Would make since when they stop making it force kick attacks that it wouldn't anymore

Footwork changed the damage used for Tornado Kick and Dragon Kick to use kick DMG instead of normal DMG. It's a separate effect from "force kick attacks" aspect it used to have.

It was clearly stated in their old, previous Footwork adjustment (when they turned it from a stance to a moderate DPS cooldown) and it was tested by multiple people after that, among which Byrth.
Results are in this thread, many pages ago.

What about the CURRENT Footwork though, of course, I don't know.
It's just that 197 additional damage on kicks during footwork sounds way too good to be true, imo.

qft

Subtle Blow II matters. Although the increase in MNK H2H delay / base damage is a modest buff at best, it should make Monk's damage/TP fed ratio even better.



also ftr footwork adding weapon damage to feet doesn't necessarily mean that it adds the base damage of your weapon to your feet (although it could). Footwork has always added 18 or 20 weapon damage to feet, and they seem to be indicating that they increased it. It is the "footwork bonus" I was talking about here:
http://www.ffxiah.com/forum/topic/36705/iipunch-monk-guide/113/#3184650

Ingenious

I know what it did. But semantics aside how different are they? Both are instances of forcing you to use Kick dmg instead of normal and used to give increased tp gain. It's not illogical that change to one effected the other. More so given limited testimony suggesting footwork didn't change the dmg

Ah ok. Wasn't really paying attention to mnk back then. So guess it actually gimped those ws before this update and now it does nothing?

I will say that what they did in regards to non-ja's was a step in the right direction. I hope they take a look at changing other abilities in the future (mantra)and obviously fixing whatever is not working with the current form of boost.

Because you can use the +80/85 DMG to kick attack feet on them during it, it moderately buffed them before, and if it still works properly, significantly buffs them now.

For example, with Godhands and Sokushitsu Sune-ate, Footwork should give kick attacks (including Tornado Kick and Dragon Kick) +282 DMG and ~+25% attack.

The most laughable part of the update to me is that PUP got a bigger buff than MNK with all of the H2H weapon dmg/delay changes, since those appear to be more significant than the MNK JA adjustments. Unless I'm totally missing something about the MNK JAs, a decent puppet adds far more DPS than MNK's hodgepodge of weird JAs that may or may not even be working correctly. Pair that with the master getting basically the same buff to weapons that MNK did = an equally well geared/played PUP is a better DD than MNK. Perhaps enough of a buff now to make PUP more viable compared to other non-H2H DDs (and further taking potential slots from MNK).

Now, I'm a PUP too so I'm OK accepting a pretty solid buff to that job. But I don't think it was the right way to go for MNK by any means. Before this change everyone just clamored to give H2H WS or damage calculation some adjustment to buff it, but I thought that could potentially make PUP too powerful. Thought S-E saw that too and were on the right track adjusting MNK-exclusive JAs (if they make stuff like Boost, Impetus, Focus really good for MNK main, that's a buff just to MNK - which they SHOULD get). But nope, the more significant buff seems to have been the H2H weapons... even including PUP exclusive ones like Kenkonken and Ohtas, and all of the other stuff that's MNK/PUP (basically every relevant H2H weapon except Spharai and Glanz).

I'm scratching my head as a MNK. But I really need to take out my Kenkonken (a far better Mythic than MNK's, because OA2-3x works on master AND more importantly on pet) and see how well I can get PUP to perform as a DD now.

I guess MNK has that Subtle Blow II and higher delay now though, for reduced TP feed? LMAO at being in 2017 and seriously having MNK's seemingly only valid justification be "we should stop giving the mob so much TP, guys". I'm not even saying Penance/Subtle Blow are useless - but that's not enough.

Well, being a mediocre DD that doesn't feed TP is more of a niche than being a slightly less mediocre DD.

While the DMG/Delay changes helped both Monk and PUP, it's fairly minor, and unless the PUP is using Kenkonken, MNK gets better use out of it since it means their innate martial arts from traits and gifts aren't nerfing them at capped gear + magic haste anymore.

or even if Shijin Spiral plague effect actually did stuff. the -5TP plague does nothing against mobs with stupid regain etc

If these changes make Kenkonken not hurtful to PUPs, that's cool. A buff should never be a nerf.

...Are you listening SE?
A buff should never be a nerf.
A buff should never be a nerf.
A buff should never be a nerf.

It is crazy to me that it was easier for SE to update every H2H weapon in the game through some twisted formula than it was to fix MNK itself.
The decreased durations and increased delay just leave MNK less dynamic than it has ever been. Not only is it's DPS (still) poor, they've neglected the entire concept of the job and left it less fun to play than ever before.

MA change is a win for PUP too, a Master MNK and Master PUP have almost the same MA. MNK gets MA+210 (200, 10 from gift), PUP gets MA+205 (160 from trait, 40 from JPs, 5 from gift).

Even if we take Kenkonken out of the equation (which is the best PUP DPS weapon thanks to OA2-3x on the puppet, even if having to contend with excess MA), they can just equip the same damn weapons. PUP with Godhands/Vere versus MNK with Godhands/Vere? I can't see a good automaton adding less from a damage perspective than MNK's JAs.

I mean, perhaps there's a use case for MNK as the master of subtle blow and some defense with Mantra and whatnot. But it stings a bit that the other H2H job got most of the same benefit from an offensive perspective. MNK is still undeniably worse than PUP for pure damage. Maybe PUP got enough of a buff to hang with other DDs though (so even if MNK got better, they didn't pass PUP). And if the buff isn't enough to make either H2H user worth taking in a DPS slot, PUP still falls back on the niche of being an excellent tank on tons of content.


I don't agree with everything you say, Cherry. But THIS... oh yeah, on board 100%.

Why didn't they just make bigger buffs to the MNK-exclusive JAs? Why mess with H2H weapons so much as the more significant part of their "solution"???

ALl you mnks quitting, please donate ken+1 and moonbow+1 belt to azagarth on asura, thanks!

At the very least, MNK is better off now than it was 24 hours ago. I've just accepted the fact that SE truly has no idea what's wrong with MNK, and they might seriously believe this fix was it. That's kind of sad when you think about it from a development standpoint. They made all of these changes to Monk's abilities and it didn't significantly solve its issues from a dps perspective.

Maybe SE thinks Monk is reserved for something other than pure DPS and we're not seeing their vision.

Mnk requires an instruction manual.

I mean, it HAS to be what Comeatmebro has been saying - it's designed for defensive utility and "good enough" DPS. They wanted to give it enough more DPS to hit "good enough", and whether they got there is still up for debate but at least they did add something.

I just don't know if there are enough people willing to use it for that, or if it's truly justified to do so in the vast majority of cases.

The bizarre part is why bother reworking stuff for H2H across the board? Out of nowhere, PUP actually becomes a more viable DD that might warrant a party selection as a "real DD" for pure damage purposes (which neither PUP nor MNK really warranted before) - which is kinda what people wanted for MNK!

If they would play their own game...

It's pretty simple, either you're the best (even by 1 dps) or you're more fun than the best, or you're garbage.

That's the beginning and end of it.

all who were wishing on a prayer they could maybe just maybe main monk for a bunch of content; why is the official forum not flooded with complaints yet?

Or at least a single bug report about boost?

Another PUPDATE detected...

Great point Capuchin. I have a lot of respect for the tanking abilities of PUP.. ^_^

because it's not actually that bad and people are just whining about boost instead of looking at the whole picture

even before patch mnk wasn't unusable, now they've buff it significantly but failed to put it on the level of SAM and WAR and suddenly they're satan incarnate

we don't even know that boost is working as intended, there's a good possibility we will get an emergency maint this week to make it even better

We're all banned from it; and english posts accomplish jack and ***there

I'm going out to get ***faced with my friend Jack Daniels. I'll probably end up getting kicked out by the bartender eventually, but before that happens he's going to hear all about my MNK woes.
A L L A B O U T M Y M O N K W O E S
every damn detail. from KRT MNK pts, to Delve sales.. everything!

"[Morimar Basalt Fields][Looking for members][Monk]/tell"

"Hey, I'm game. I really need Oatixur's"

"Sorry man, but you have to have Oats to join."

"I don't have them yet. I'm needing this clear so that I can have a shot at getting them..."

"Sorry dude.. I need 2x Oats MNKs for this"

"So I'm expected to already have an item that drops from the very NM I need so that I CAN get the item you want your MNK(s) to have, but you wont give me the opportunity to get them. Got it"

This seems distant and somewhere deep inside me I'm slightly moved, I'll reread this in a couple of hours and some drinks and cry.

All that HQ, and still getting NQ drinks....shame...

Those were fun times; nothing identified a shitty mnk more than brotixurs. The worse you were the sooner you got them.