[Dev] Shaper's Shawl

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[Dev] Shaper's Shawl
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 Valefor.Keikaichi
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By Valefor.Keikaichi 2012-07-30 20:40:52
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Bahamut.Serj said: »
Valefor.Keikaichi said: »
I'm sure the price will come down on these, probably to 100-250k range once the market starts to stock up a bit.

Won't happen. If prices even dip remotely low people won't fish them since it's a massive waste of time.

The point I was trying to make is partially in agreeance to what everyone bashing this has been saying. The item doesn't look like it will be worth a 30Million + gil investment. Many fishers who are fishing this will be fishing solely for themselves, so their only cost will be meatballs and time. Most fishers who sell this will be selling the leftovers after getting their item, then never going back to fishing it again. I can't see many people fishing this to make money off, it is just too time consuming and people won't pay huge sums for this item.

And if you are on my server and want to buy fish, I will probably sell my leftovers for 200k. I'm not greedy and I'm sure a few other fishers out there aren't either. But I won't know until after I get the item, if I will want to continue fishing Matsya afterwards.
 Ramuh.Jeyman
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By Ramuh.Jeyman 2012-07-30 20:42:13
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Awax said: »
And I had no idea ppl are paying that much for this damn fish. Fk that.
It can not drop below 1mil really. Doing so makes it hardly worth any fishers time.

Just do the math yourself. This has nothing to do with how well it works. Its price is based off the fact that we can NPC fish for more gil with zero walking/trading/crap bite rates if it dips beblow the 600k mark.

And that is the break even point, add on the extra 400k for all the other work/GP items/pain in the *** to fish we need to do.

Its really hard to see if from the fishers side, but that is the basic of why you wont see this really stay under 1mil long.

People just wont fish it otherwise.
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By Awax 2012-07-30 20:54:14
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Yes u are definitely right cus it takes me about 2-3days just to fish up about 300 bait for this fish. So the price is reasonable if u have the money to blow that is. Which I'm sure a lot of ppl do. But SE need to give us some correct % on the damn cape. That would probably help settle alot of this none sense.
 Bahamut.Serj
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By Bahamut.Serj 2012-07-30 21:01:13
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Avitori said: »
The only ones I see complaining are the ones who don't fish/non-ebisu owners. I don't see the problem here, level fishing or pay whatever price ebisu owners feel is worth their time. End of story.

I'm 105 fishing with Ebisu and I think it's a complete waste of an item to put it on Matsya as the costs to get one on average will very probably never outweigh the costs of leveling every single other craft to cap.

Edit: Your fishing is 60 so you yourself have no validity on your statement.
 
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 Bahamut.Serj
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By Bahamut.Serj 2012-07-30 21:05:56
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Valefor.Keikaichi said: »
And if you are on my server and want to buy fish, I will probably sell my leftovers for 200k. I'm not greedy and I'm sure a few other fishers out there aren't either.

Apparently being greedy is the equivalent of not wanting to waste time/money. I never knew.
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 Cerberus.Valmur
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By Cerberus.Valmur 2012-07-30 21:07:28
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0/42 so far and had enough screw you Zaldon ;;
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By Avitori 2012-07-30 21:30:32
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Bahamut.Serj said: »
Avitori said: »
The only ones I see complaining are the ones who don't fish/non-ebisu owners. I don't see the problem here, level fishing or pay whatever price ebisu owners feel is worth their time. End of story.

I'm 105 fishing with Ebisu and I think it's a complete waste of an item to put it on Matsya as the costs to get one on average will very probably never outweigh the costs of leveling every single other craft to cap.

Edit: Your fishing is 60 so you yourself have no validity on your statement.

For expensive crafts like Smithing and Goldsmithing where single synths can cost 500k-1m+ at high levels it might be, depending on how good the cape is. Nobody knows for sure how useful it is yet, but fishing interest has definitely increased on this server. See lots of new fishers and demand for Lushangs/moat carps. Obviously there are people more determined than you are to get the cape for skillup/trophy item purposes.

I started fishing at the beginning of this month and went from 5-60 during that time and know just as much as anyone else. Fishing 'aint that hard ;)
 Valefor.Keikaichi
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By Valefor.Keikaichi 2012-07-30 21:46:54
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Bahamut.Serj said: »
Valefor.Keikaichi said: »
And if you are on my server and want to buy fish, I will probably sell my leftovers for 200k. I'm not greedy and I'm sure a few other fishers out there aren't either.

Apparently being greedy is the equivalent of not wanting to waste time/money. I never knew.

I guess that depends on your perception. My time fishing is enjoyable when I do it. I don't do it as often as most but then again I don't play as often as most people. I don't think of it as time wasted, and I don't think of time wasting = money not made. I think if you play games for that reason alone your a little sad.
 Siren.Kalilla
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By Siren.Kalilla 2012-07-30 22:02:32
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I wouldn't say they are sad, they just play differently than you, which is fair.

I personally don't think wasting time is money lost either, but I can see why someone would especially if they are a player that makes relics / mythics frequently.

I personally do not take this game that seriously, and play just to have fun. I take some things very serious, like my whm, but I wouldn't ever say that my time fishing is a waste when I could be doing something to make gil 10 times faster. I know I could, but I enjoy fishing much more than those activities so I choose not to do them.
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 Valefor.Keikaichi
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By Valefor.Keikaichi 2012-07-30 22:12:29
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That is probably a fair statement to make. I just couldn't enjoy a game if it was all about the money and epeen. But I do have friends that have that mentality. I just can't appreciate it, it would considerably make my time more stressful.
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By esdain 2012-07-30 22:46:20
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Bismarck.Josiahfk said: »
Forcing a gamer to lvl fishing just to get an item for their craft?

That's like forcing us to lvl pld to 99 just to click an npc for a cutscene to get exp boosting gear.

They would never do that crap

http://wiki.ffxiclopedia.org/wiki/That_Which_Curdles_Blood

http://wiki.ffxiclopedia.org/wiki/Padded_Box

I remember needing to level Woodworking to 6 and Alchemy to 10 to advance that quest on an alt. The items were Ex.
 Lye
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By Lye 2012-07-30 22:53:54
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Odin.Godofgods said: »
Let me first just say... OMG! After like 100 different thread topics, the Dev's actually responded to one of mine! (now if they would just take the helping tarus thread to heart)

Siren.Kalilla said: »
I don't even know what to say. Fishers have waited years for Matsya to be implemented in the "Inside the Belly" quest, and when it finally does players, most who haven't even picked up a fishing rod, feel the need to complain. Matsya finally got a reward worth doing in my opinion, and I see nothing wrong with it being for leveling other crafts faster.

Well i sure do.

I'm not complaining that fishers have something, just that this equipment is only obtainable by fishing. Fishing is not a traditional craft. And the traditional crafting skill+ item should be obtained by traditional crafts or guilds. Fishing is as much of a traditional craft as synergy is. Both may have their uses, and their money making potential, but their not traditional crafts. Hence the reason fishing and synergy skill caps are not related to traditional crafts caps.

As for ppl saying 'just go fish yourself or buy them.' That doesn't quite work. Their are a lot of crafters, including myself, that really hate fishing. So to that group, this item is just insulting. But to those that have no problem with it, leveling fishing from 1-100 or 110 and getting a Lu shang/ebshu just to get a crafting item is ludicrous. The time it would take to do that i could cap all traditional craft on all my mules faster then that.
Along the same line, buying them is just as insane. Prices on my server are starting at 1 mill per fish. Seriously? Were supposed to spend 5-10-20-50-100 mill to get a crafting item have a chance at getting a crafting item. I can tell you for sure, that iv capped all my crafts for cheaper then that.

Really, the only ppl this item is helping are those that already have high level fishing and ebshu. Not because they need the crafting item, but because they can sell the fish to the 'perfectionists' at such insanely high prices. (and wouldn't want to forget the gill buyers')

Id be willing to bet that noone saw this item and suddenly thought to themselves 'oh wow, i have to level all my crafts now!' For the most part the ppl that would be most interested in this item are those that already have most if not all their crafts leveled. That being said, if you already have most of it done, your not going to want to spend an eternity of time or money on an item that will provide minimal use.

Allow me to paraphrase:

"I don't want to fish or spend gil but I want a cape."

The END.
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 Bahamut.Serj
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By Bahamut.Serj 2012-07-30 23:01:20
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I honestly don't see how people are justifying themselves on the point that the cape's market price is going to be 30 mil and can *literally* never pay itself off.

And most of the people complaining about the complainers don't have fishing skilled or ebisu. Or can't grasp the concept that the cape won't give >30 mil in skillups.
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By Avitori 2012-07-30 23:17:40
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Bahamut.Serj said: »
Or can't grasp the concept that the cape won't give >30 mil in skillups.

How would you know, do you work for SE? No? Okay then.

--

Don't forget there is a new expansion coming out. They raised crafting cap to 110 already, there is a good chance they will do it again.
 Lye
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By Lye 2012-07-30 23:34:11
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Bahamut.Serj said: »
I honestly don't see how people are justifying themselves on the point that the cape's market price is going to be 30 mil and can *literally* never pay itself off.

Are you just being critical about ffxi players superstitions regarding skill ups while crafting?

OR

Are you COMPLETELY OBLIVIOUS to the idea that somethings "worth" is subjective?
 Bahamut.Serj
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By Bahamut.Serj 2012-07-30 23:48:14
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I'm done reiterating the same concept over and over again to idiots. You guys must be new to ffxi to understand the increases that SE adds to items like these.
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By Avitori 2012-07-31 00:01:21
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Bahamut.Serj said: »
I'm done reiterating the same concept over and over again to idiots. You guys must be new to ffxi to understand the increases that SE adds to items like these.

Acting high and mighty are we? Clearly everyone that doesn't agree with you must be "idiots" as you say.
 Odin.Eikechi
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By Odin.Eikechi 2012-07-31 00:45:42
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esdain said: »
Bismarck.Josiahfk said: »
Forcing a gamer to lvl fishing just to get an item for their craft?

That's like forcing us to lvl pld to 99 just to click an npc for a cutscene to get exp boosting gear.

They would never do that crap

http://wiki.ffxiclopedia.org/wiki/That_Which_Curdles_Blood

http://wiki.ffxiclopedia.org/wiki/Padded_Box

I remember needing to level Woodworking to 6 and Alchemy to 10 to advance that quest on an alt. The items were Ex.

Yes because 6 WW and 10 alchemy is equivalent or even remotely close to 1-100 fishing and ebisu. Inb4 "that's the joke"
 Fenrir.Sylow
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By Fenrir.Sylow 2012-07-31 00:58:47
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Shaper's Shawl looks like it could be a pretty clutch addition to my Town Idle sets.
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 Pandemonium.Tatsuki
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By Pandemonium.Tatsuki 2012-07-31 01:17:39
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This fish will probably average around 400k eventually after all fishermen have had their cap. Just give it time. I think 40mil(1/100) for this cape is a decent price considering some craft takes 3-4x+ to skill above 100 and who know if they'll raise the synth cap again :D

Anyways it's time to stop whinning and time to make some fishermen friends ;)
 Lakshmi.Rearden
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By Lakshmi.Rearden 2012-07-31 01:20:53
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Shaper's Shawl is great - my time to create a relic would have gone down from 18~19d to 9~10d.
 Cerberus.Clyne
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By Cerberus.Clyne 2012-07-31 02:36:00
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Bismarck.Altar said: »
Considering the prices that capped Smithers/Leathercrafters/Goldsmithers have been charging for the past however many years, y'all are bitching waaaaaaay too much about the price of matsyas


Shoulda locked the topic after this post, since it pretty much sums up the whole situation.

I don't *** and moan about having to drop millions on top end gear because I chose to level a consumables craft instead of a durables. I make my gil and buy the items when I can afford them. This is no different, and the fact that it comes from ItB quest may play into your favor, because many people will get it without paying the true "value" of the cape, which as others have laid out for the fisher's investment is really astronomical.
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 Odin.Godofgods
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By Odin.Godofgods 2012-07-31 10:07:31
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Lye said: »
Allow me to paraphrase: "I don't want to fish or spend gil but I want a cape." The END.

Not quite. I have no problem with the need to spend some gill on it. However i do have a problem with spending 1-100 mill on a piece with no guarantee you'll even get it. Plus i can cap all my craft for less then that which makes spending that kind gill on it rather counter productive.

And no, i don't want to fish. Its a crafting item. I want to craft for it. Just like every other GP item in history.
 Siren.Kalilla
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By Siren.Kalilla 2012-07-31 10:10:36
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Odin.Godofgods said: »
Lye said: »
Allow me to paraphrase: "I don't want to fish or spend gil but I want a cape." The END.

Not quite. I have no problem with the need to spend some gill on it. However i do have a problem with spending 1-100 mill on a piece with no guarantee you'll even get it. Plus i can cap all my craft for less then that which makes spending that kind gill on it rather counter productive.

And no, i don't want to fish. Its a crafting item. I want to craft for it. Just like every other GP item in history.
Actually, it's a fishing item now <.<!
 Lakshmi.Rearden
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By Lakshmi.Rearden 2012-07-31 10:30:15
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Odin.Godofgods said: »
Lye said: »
Allow me to paraphrase: "I don't want to fish or spend gil but I want a cape." The END.

Not quite. I have no problem with the need to spend some gill on it. However i do have a problem with spending 1-100 mill on a piece with no guarantee you'll even get it. Plus i can cap all my craft for less then that which makes spending that kind gill on it rather counter productive.

And no, i don't want to fish. Its a crafting item. I want to craft for it. Just like every other GP item in history.
What, you mean like the Rod required to fish the fish to get the item you're complaining about?
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By Lye 2012-07-31 11:08:06
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Odin.Godofgods said: »
Lye said: »
Allow me to paraphrase: "I don't want to fish or spend gil but I want a cape." The END.

Not quite. I have no problem with the need to spend some gill on it. However i do have a problem with spending 1-100 mill on a piece with no guarantee you'll even get it. Plus i can cap all my craft for less then that which makes spending that kind gill on it rather counter productive.

And no, i don't want to fish. Its a crafting item. I want to craft for it. Just like every other GP item in history.


If you've made it this far in ffxi getting rewards from things without ever having to do anything you didn't want to...

Quit now.
 Quetzalcoatl.Kouryuu
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By Quetzalcoatl.Kouryuu 2012-07-31 11:23:42
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I will go for this item. Time sync is what this game is all about. By time I get a cape I will probably have all my other crafts recapped but I see this as a personal challenge. People that are complaining about this are probably worried about how fishing will eat into their afk in Jueno time. If you don't have te time or patience to get your own ebisu stop worrying about how difficult this will be to obtain. Not everyone in this game does things just for Gil, some do things for personal achievement. When I get one and i will just hope that one day SE will let you take another craft to cap. If not, well, I will still have a worthless item that few people will. Mind you, I though that when I got my ebisu lol.
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By Bahamut.Krizz 2012-07-31 11:54:38
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All I ask is that it to be added to list of r/ex gear that can be muled.
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By Ifrit.Phlow 2012-07-31 12:03:13
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I'm angry that Mythic Weapons are difficult.
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