Surely anyone who post is then asking for a response, thus validating his response in the first place. However, you telling him not to tell people how to do something is hypocritical.
one shouldn't have to explain how circular arguments are fallacies.
He didn't respond to anyone, he started in without being provoked, inaccurately I might add, which is another reason your argument is flawed.
Me telling somebody not to but in and telling other people what to do is not equal, It's ludicrous to think it is.
here's what i don't like about the situation, SE committed themselves to the system 10 or so years ago and even tho most of those players have either moved to a different system (xbox, PC) some still play on the PS2 because of either money issues or some other reason and now SE says we want to +1 this 10 year old game. Frankly myself I don't care that the new expansion is not being supported on the PS2 because I now play on PC. I have an Xbox I have 2 Laptops that I can easily play on. the way i see it if you commit to something you stick with it 100% all the way through. the player base on the PS2 may have dwindled, but it's still *** up. that's my 2 gil, either way i'm excited to see this new expansion coming up. i'm most definitely excited about harvest moon FFXI edition. and i'm disappointed in the direction that they want to take geomancer...
If you're afraid that your console is about to reach obsolescence from a manufacturer's and a content producer's point of view, become a better informed consumer, next time.
Now spare us from these rationalizations involving cheating.
I’d like to take a moment to clarify which platform Seekers of Adoulin will be available on for those that have been asking. We will continue to support North American FINAL FANTASY XI players on the PlayStation 2, Xbox 360 and PC (Windows) platforms. However, FINAL FANTASY XI: Seekers of Adoulin will only be available on the Xbox 360 and Windows platforms in North America when it is released in 2013.
About damn time what? About damn time you break free of your chains and think for yourself. What will this change for you, what would dropping ps2 support ever have done for you? Lol, the only different it'd make is less people to play with, the game mechanics and graphics will never change. DO people think they're cool, picking on people for playing the game on ps2, the original platform the game was designed to play on? I just don't get the mentality of, I'm sorry to say, most people, when it comes to PS2 support. Get off your high horses, and think for yourself please. Letting windower and other programs play for you does not make you a better player. I'm very sorry the majority of you will never understand the fulfillment of tweaking your macros just right, with limited #'s of lines, and too few macros in a block, to be able to play your jobs with 60+ pieces of equipment.
His comment makes no sense as JP PS2 version will still get the expansion.
Your comments also are extremely nonsensical. From my understanding, dropping PS2 support completely would at least allow a lot more variety in armor designs, as well as introducing more mob types instead of simple reskins. Also leaves room for other assets like new foliage, ship designs, light sources (lamps and torches), and stuff of that nature. I doubt even if PS2 was dropped that SE would really update the graphics much, but I could see them introducing newer models with higher polygon counts, as well as minor tweaks here and there to really polish up older stuff. Even if they didn't though, I'm pretty sure it's not the engine holding them back from introducing new armor designs (and the other things I listed) but the actual memory of the PS2.
That being said, I cannot understand why they will not at least release the PS2 version through digital distribution, even if it would take hours or even days to download on a PS2. The option should at least be there for those few on the console in NA. They have options, they're just cutting corners for cost, it seems.
Quote:
Again, where do you get your facts? This game is coded based on ps2, they are not going to recode the entire game, this is no positive mood to please a larger # of the player base. It's merely a problem downloading so much content onto the HDD, and not worth their time, apparently, when such a small portion of the NA playerbase is PS2.
There's a difference in the game itself, the engine and whatnot, being maxed out and holding the game back or the PS2's actual space being maxed out and holding the game back.
Yes, the game was developed for the PS2, we all realize that. However, the PS2's actual limited storage space is what people are talking about when they say it's holding the game back. The PS2 can only hold so much information. Even though the engine was built for the PS2, when used on systems with more storage space available, such as the Xbox360 and the PC, more things could be added.
and i'm disappointed in the direction that they want to take geomancer...
How exactly, based on what they said, it's a new BRD, and let's face it, after seeing what happend to PUP anything else probably wouldn't have worked out to well.
it isn't like we needed another nuker or healer in the game. what else would have made sense. COR, BRD, and SCH have buffs that not a single DD will turn away. i am actually glad when i heard that it was a new support job.
So you can just get a PC and the game is on the PC? I cant imagine SE is just throwing out free copies.
Nope, but it's relatively easy to find on the internet.
So yea you still have to buy the game I thought so.
Pirating is awesome.
Pretty sure if you own an actual legit copy of the game, downloading a copy of it for free is not illegal. However, one could argue that if you bought the PS2/360 version and download the PC that it's a different version than you one you bought. Not 100% clear on that though, especially since the PC version is a port of the PS2 version.
EDIT: I know you didn't claim it was illegal, just saw the comment with the back and forth from Justhetip and figured I'd throw that out there for the "Downloading is illegal!11!!!" crowd that tends to claim that when making excuses for not moving from PS2 to PC.
Quote:
I can't tell all these UI updates and stuff people want is being blocked by PS2 being with the game is what has been said on this forum. People wanna force the style of gaming they use on others. I wonder how us PC users would act if they switched it around and took the PC out.
Highly irritated, because that scenario actually makes no sense. Phasing out the PS2 version (which isn't actually happening since the JP PS2 will get the expansion) DOES make sense. Phasing out the PC to go backwards with technology makes no sense.
1- The business model for the PS2 release of FFXI requires that a disc are used to install expansion data. It's possible that Square Enix are bound to this business model for the PS2 platform by a contract with SONY. And that could prevent the release of full expansions as digital only content.
2- PS2 discs with DNAS have microscopic holes cut on them with laser at the factory which make each copy unique. The PS2 is made to be capable of reading these marks. And the software within the game will send that data back to the server during the install for authentication. Basically, with this, they're able to tell how many PS2s had copies installed from each disc, for example.
3- To be able to serve the expansion as a digital download for the PS2 platform, they would need to modify their contract with SONY and their PlayOnline viewer program, making the download possible.
4- Square Enix itself as a company might be uncomfortable with the concept of selling the expansion as digital only content and have it downloadable through the service thinking it might encourage piracy of the client. Still if they make it available for the PS2 they should make it available at least for PC, too, don't you think so ?
Surely anyone who post is then asking for a response, thus validating his response in the first place. However, you telling him not to tell people how to do something is hypocritical.
one shouldn't have to explain how circular arguments are fallacies.
He didn't respond to anyone, he started in without being provoked, inaccurately I might add, which is another reason your argument is flawed.
Me telling somebody not to but in and telling other people what to do is not equal, It's ludicrous to think it is.
It is not a circular argument, thus it is not fallicious.
His response was provoked by the thread in general, i.e. the theme of "PS2 no longer supported.
It could well be argued that his post was more advice as opposed to 'telling someone what to do'
Your response however, was directly telling him not to 'tell someone what to do'.
So, to lay it out plain and simple:
Author made a statement. Call it advice, call it a direction, it matters not.
If the act of 'telling someone to do something' is (A)
You told the author to do something, but at the same time, the thing which you told them to do, is to not do what it is you are claiming.
Thus, you did (A) while claiming you should not (A).
The only circular fallacy is that which you preach. Sir.
Still, it was unrealistic to expect support be continued for a platform which is no longer at the top of the gaming tables, and for an MMO which requires constant updates and new materials to keep the game going.
I'm sure its just a matter of statistics, I mean to go through the publishing process for a PS2 version if their is only 10,000 NA PS2 players (not all of which will necessarily even buy the expansion) -- that's a lot of work.
Especially when the game is so accessible to NA players on PC/360. I just hope there is a 360 disc to buy -- which it sounds like there will be.
I'm sure it's been said in the previous dozen pages but why not just sell it directly from the SE shop so they don't get stuck with tons of unsold copies(like the PS2 Vana 08 collection)?
It's obviously a numbers game and has nothing to do with intentionally screwing the fanbase. At least, I hope not. lol
I'm sure it's been said in the previous dozen pages but why not just sell it directly from the SE shop so they don't get stuck with tons of unsold copies(like the PS2 Vana 08 collection)?
It's obviously a numbers game and has nothing to do with intentionally screwing the fanbase. At least, I hope not. lol
1- The business model for the PS2 release of FFXI requires that a disc are used to install expansion data. It's possible that Square Enix are bound to this business model for the PS2 platform by a contract with SONY. And that could prevent the release of full expansions as digital only content.
2- PS2 discs with DNAS have microscopic holes cut on them with laser at the factory which make each copy unique. The PS2 is made to be capable of reading these marks. And the software within the game will send that data back to the server during the install for authentication. Basically, with this, they're able to tell how many PS2s had copies installed from each disc, for example.
3- To be able to serve the expansion as a digital download for the PS2 platform, they would need to modify their contract with SONY and their PlayOnline viewer program, making the download possible.
4- Square Enix itself as a company might be uncomfortable with the concept of selling the expansion as digital only content and have it downloadable through the service thinking it might encourage piracy of the client. Still if they make it available for the PS2 they should make it available at least for PC, too, don't you think so ?
Even if the expansion was a digital download, you'd still have to purchase the installation code from them the same way you do if you download the game from any other means. Piracy wouldn't be an issue.
As far as them being "forced" to sell the expansion as a disk because of a contract with Sony. What's the difference between an Abyssea "Add-on" and an "Expansion"? It's just a subjective term that doesn't really mean anything. If Sony had no problem with Abyssea and the other add-ons being digital downloads, they shouldn't have a problem with one more.
I have a Japanese PS2, will need the expansion activation code since my account is JP so I will have to buy a PS2 copy no matter what. -_-;
Why does having a JP account require you to buy a PS2 copy >_>?
Because I need the Japanese code ... And I can buy a Japanese copy of the game at some game shop such as NCSX or PlayAsia. And you know once you have a code you're free to use the PC version from, well anywhere ...
So buying a PC version if I can buy a (DRM'ed) PS2 version for about the same value and have the disc and code is more in line with my idea of "optimal", since I plan to continue using the PS2 even if only in Japanese.
I’d like to take a moment to clarify which platform Seekers of Adoulin will be available on for those that have been asking. We will continue to support North American FINAL FANTASY XI players on the PlayStation 2, Xbox 360 and PC (Windows) platforms. However, FINAL FANTASY XI: Seekers of Adoulin will only be available on the Xbox 360 and Windows platforms in North America when it is released in 2013.
