$14.5 B Tax Refunds Issued By "error"

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$14.5 B tax refunds issued by "error"
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 Asura.Kingnobody
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By Asura.Kingnobody 2014-12-18 16:49:12
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Quetzalcoatl.Taberif said: »
please feel free to feed me your best *** on how you would improve standard of living without effecting technology
Never said that. You stated that it is the "only" reason for an improved standard of living. I disagree with that statement, because it is not the "only" reason, but a contributing factor.
 
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 Bahamut.Alukat
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By Bahamut.Alukat 2014-12-18 16:55:34
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Asura.Kingnobody said: »
Bahamut.Alukat said: »
We need to set priorities. (living standard vs. gross national income) High GNI doesn't automatically lead to a high living standard for all people.
Yet, you admitted that a higher GDP (again, do you even know what the "D" stands for?) leads to better standards of living. You just get confused by the order that needs to be taken place.

LOL, now you are again talking about something totally different. I'm talking about the GNI, that's the summarized value of all goods and services within a period, GDP is something totally different..... so pls, stop your attempts of switching the subject......thx.

now i stop feeding the troll. so don't expect anymore answers.
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By Asura.Kingnobody 2014-12-18 16:57:42
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Bahamut.Alukat said: »
Asura.Kingnobody said: »
Bahamut.Alukat said: »
We need to set priorities. (living standard vs. gross national income) High GNI doesn't automatically lead to a high living standard for all people.
Yet, you admitted that a higher GDP (again, do you even know what the "D" stands for?) leads to better standards of living. You just get confused by the order that needs to be taken place.

LOL, now you are again talking about something totally different. I'm talking about the GNI, that's the summarized value of all goods and services within a period, GDP is something totally different..... so pls, stop your attempts of switching the subject......thx.
So, Gross National Income (as you stated before) is not the same as Gross Domestic Product?

Yeah, keep digging that hole. Pretty soon, you will reach China!

Bahamut.Alukat said: »
now i stop feeding the troll. so don't expect anymore answers.
I'm pretty sure that, if you stop posting in topics you have no understanding, you will not have to defend against your own idiocy.
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By Bahamut.Alukat 2014-12-18 17:04:39
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Quote:
The Gross national income (GNI) is the total domestic and foreign output claimed by residents of a country, consisting of gross domestic product (GDP) plus factor incomes earned by foreign residents, minus income earned in the domestic economy by nonresidents
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gross_national_income

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gross_domestic_product

go ahead, read and compare it.
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By Nazrious 2014-12-18 17:41:27
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Lakshmi.Zerowone said: »
Stop feeding the troll.

There be truth in them there post.
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By Asura.Kingnobody 2014-12-18 18:15:39
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Bahamut.Alukat said: »
Quote:
The Gross national income (GNI) is the total domestic and foreign output claimed by residents of a country, consisting of gross domestic product (GDP) plus factor incomes earned by foreign residents, minus income earned in the domestic economy by nonresidents
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gross_national_income

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gross_domestic_product

go ahead, read and compare it.
So, what's the difference between GDP and GNI again? A very minimal amount?

Unless you live in a country where a significant portion of your nationals earn their income overseas and/or a significant portion of your domestic product is made by foreigners, GDP and GNI are so close to each other that it's basically the same.

Since the only countries we are talking about are the US and Germany, I would hold it true that GDP = GNI. So, what's your problem again? Semantics?
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By Nazrious 2014-12-18 19:01:41
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Bahamut.Alukat said: »
...
now i stop feeding the troll. so don't expect anymore answers.

Always a smart course of action mate.
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By Asura.Kingnobody 2014-12-18 19:41:47
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Nazrious said: »
Bahamut.Alukat said: »
...
now i stop feeding the troll. so don't expect anymore answers.

Always a smart course of action mate.
Apparently he wasn't talking about me, because he responded 9 minutes after he stated that.
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By Siren.Lordgrim 2014-12-18 22:12:59
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Asura.Kingnobody said: »
Siren.Lordgrim said: »
for question number 1:
if you repealed the 16th amendment and established state banks like north Dakota , you would receive your full pay check with no federal income tax being taken out you would also being paying 40-30% less taxes then you currently are. This benefits companies and everyone in the state. This could create more jobs via town-city-state lvl. Currently with what we get now say you could only afford 1 nice car, well with that 16th amendment repealed you receive your hard earned money you could buy 2 new cars if you chose or 3 roughly for comparison. Your paychecks in general would go a long way per week, or bi weekly or salary.
Federal government does not specifically know what each state needs, the states themselves know better. But it is a obvious fact the 49 states inline with the federal reserve are in dire need of life support.

with all of that said, there was no point in there that i said taxes would increase or our national debt would increase. It would have the opposite effect, taxes would decrease significantly, and our national debt would shrink. Then finally we would have a simple tax code that makes sense and is equal across the board based on income.
Well, the federal government would collapse, but not the states.

See, you are assuming that all of the money in the country goes towards one person. If federal income tax was repealed, all that would do is destroy our national defense and welfare. While forcing people who can work to work is not a bad thing, destroying overall welfare is a very bad thing. You would have absolutely no support for food/gas/production and are looking at immediate hyperinflation right off the bat. Not to mention all of the riots going on from pretty much ever citizen in the nation at the same time, as everyone benefits from one way or another from government welfare (food support alone would be cause for riot).

But overall, states would benefit from additional support of the additional income, they lose the most precious aspects, which is national defense and interstate commerce.

Not at all a loss of anything besides a corrupt IRS and poisonous Federal reserve system, and legalized theft of hard earning american citizen wages thats the only thing that would be lost that i am sure everyone would want to lose those things it is in there best interest.

Note that each state has its own national guard. And our country as a whole has its own national military. Nothing changes there.

It would not effect interstate commerce at all trade would resume as normal.

All of this possible however if we stop voting for Republicans and Democrats. Restoring our Republic is not a bad thing, because it is representation for and by the people. It is not representation for big everything.

Edit: State Banking modeled after North Dakota's proves that any state could self fund it's own needs from within and invests solely in the citizens of that state and not wallstreet.
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By Siren.Lordgrim 2014-12-18 22:22:36
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No offense to you kingnobody, but in the United States we have known no central banking and prospered and federal government never collapsed, it remained it will always remain.
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By Asura.Kingnobody 2014-12-18 22:52:15
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Siren.Lordgrim said: »
Asura.Kingnobody said: »
Siren.Lordgrim said: »
for question number 1:
if you repealed the 16th amendment and established state banks like north Dakota , you would receive your full pay check with no federal income tax being taken out you would also being paying 40-30% less taxes then you currently are. This benefits companies and everyone in the state. This could create more jobs via town-city-state lvl. Currently with what we get now say you could only afford 1 nice car, well with that 16th amendment repealed you receive your hard earned money you could buy 2 new cars if you chose or 3 roughly for comparison. Your paychecks in general would go a long way per week, or bi weekly or salary.
Federal government does not specifically know what each state needs, the states themselves know better. But it is a obvious fact the 49 states inline with the federal reserve are in dire need of life support.

with all of that said, there was no point in there that i said taxes would increase or our national debt would increase. It would have the opposite effect, taxes would decrease significantly, and our national debt would shrink. Then finally we would have a simple tax code that makes sense and is equal across the board based on income.
Well, the federal government would collapse, but not the states.

See, you are assuming that all of the money in the country goes towards one person. If federal income tax was repealed, all that would do is destroy our national defense and welfare. While forcing people who can work to work is not a bad thing, destroying overall welfare is a very bad thing. You would have absolutely no support for food/gas/production and are looking at immediate hyperinflation right off the bat. Not to mention all of the riots going on from pretty much ever citizen in the nation at the same time, as everyone benefits from one way or another from government welfare (food support alone would be cause for riot).

But overall, states would benefit from additional support of the additional income, they lose the most precious aspects, which is national defense and interstate commerce.

Not at all a loss of anything besides a corrupt IRS and poisonous Federal reserve system, and legalized theft of hard earning american citizen wages thats the only thing that would be lost that i am sure everyone would want to lose those things it is in there best interest.

Note that each state has its own national guard. And our country as a whole has its own national military. Nothing changes there.

It would not effect interstate commerce at all trade would resume as normal.

All of this possible however if we stop voting for Republicans and Democrats. Restoring our Republic is not a bad thing, because it is representation for and by the people. It is not representation for big everything.

Edit: State Banking modeled after North Dakota's proves that any state could self fund it's own needs from within and invests solely in the citizens of that state and not wallstreet.
I don't know, I highly doubt that interstate commerce would survive without a centralized system.

As for defense, not every state can support a military, and the ones that do cannot maintain a level to protect the nation as a whole.

Getting rid of the IRS would leave us very vulnerable to foreign attacks.
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By Asura.Kingnobody 2014-12-18 22:53:12
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Siren.Lordgrim said: »
No offense to you kingnobody, but in the United States we have known no central banking and prospered and federal government never collapsed, it remained it will always remain.
We also didn't have the types of industries and globalization as we do today.

If you get rid of the Fed, you pretty much made the US undesirable for international trading.
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By Siren.Lordgrim 2014-12-19 00:42:23
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Asura.Kingnobody said: »
Siren.Lordgrim said: »
Asura.Kingnobody said: »
Siren.Lordgrim said: »
for question number 1:
if you repealed the 16th amendment and established state banks like north Dakota , you would receive your full pay check with no federal income tax being taken out you would also being paying 40-30% less taxes then you currently are. This benefits companies and everyone in the state. This could create more jobs via town-city-state lvl. Currently with what we get now say you could only afford 1 nice car, well with that 16th amendment repealed you receive your hard earned money you could buy 2 new cars if you chose or 3 roughly for comparison. Your paychecks in general would go a long way per week, or bi weekly or salary.
Federal government does not specifically know what each state needs, the states themselves know better. But it is a obvious fact the 49 states inline with the federal reserve are in dire need of life support.

with all of that said, there was no point in there that i said taxes would increase or our national debt would increase. It would have the opposite effect, taxes would decrease significantly, and our national debt would shrink. Then finally we would have a simple tax code that makes sense and is equal across the board based on income.
Well, the federal government would collapse, but not the states.

See, you are assuming that all of the money in the country goes towards one person. If federal income tax was repealed, all that would do is destroy our national defense and welfare. While forcing people who can work to work is not a bad thing, destroying overall welfare is a very bad thing. You would have absolutely no support for food/gas/production and are looking at immediate hyperinflation right off the bat. Not to mention all of the riots going on from pretty much ever citizen in the nation at the same time, as everyone benefits from one way or another from government welfare (food support alone would be cause for riot).

But overall, states would benefit from additional support of the additional income, they lose the most precious aspects, which is national defense and interstate commerce.

Not at all a loss of anything besides a corrupt IRS and poisonous Federal reserve system, and legalized theft of hard earning american citizen wages thats the only thing that would be lost that i am sure everyone would want to lose those things it is in there best interest.

Note that each state has its own national guard. And our country as a whole has its own national military. Nothing changes there.

It would not effect interstate commerce at all trade would resume as normal.

All of this possible however if we stop voting for Republicans and Democrats. Restoring our Republic is not a bad thing, because it is representation for and by the people. It is not representation for big everything.

Edit: State Banking modeled after North Dakota's proves that any state could self fund it's own needs from within and invests solely in the citizens of that state and not wallstreet.
I don't know, I highly doubt that interstate commerce would survive without a centralized system.

As for defense, not every state can support a military, and the ones that do cannot maintain a level to protect the nation as a whole.

Getting rid of the IRS would leave us very vulnerable to foreign attacks.

It has though kingnobody the United States biggest economic growth came right after the civil war up to before 1913 never forget that year.

That was all without a centralized banking institution known as the federal reserve.
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By Siren.Lordgrim 2014-12-19 00:45:26
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Any state can maintain its own national guard as they do now. And do not fear for american security. We have over 350 million armed American citizens.
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By Siren.Lordgrim 2014-12-19 00:54:18
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Asura.Kingnobody said: »
Siren.Lordgrim said: »
No offense to you kingnobody, but in the United States we have known no central banking and prospered and federal government never collapsed, it remained it will always remain.
We also didn't have the types of industries and globalization as we do today.

If you get rid of the Fed, you pretty much made the US undesirable for international trading.

Not at all if you see the pattern of sanctions being placed world wide and companies being banned from effected countries you would see where bad policy's have been made. Those jobs should of been in America instead of out of our borders. I have complete faith in America and her products and the rest of the world would also agree.
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By Siren.Lordgrim 2014-12-19 00:56:50
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Siren.Lordgrim said: »
Asura.Kingnobody said: »
Siren.Lordgrim said: »
No offense to you kingnobody, but in the United States we have known no central banking and prospered and federal government never collapsed, it remained it will always remain.
We also didn't have the types of industries and globalization as we do today.

If you get rid of the Fed, you pretty much made the US undesirable for international trading.

Not at all if you see the pattern of sanctions being placed world wide and companies being banned from effected countries you would see where bad policy's have been made. Those jobs should of been in America instead of out of our borders. I have complete faith in America and her products and the rest of the world would also agree.


Yes we did have the same industry's we have some very old corporations here. Not counting the new one's today.
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By Lakshmi.Aelius 2014-12-19 02:31:29
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Bahamut.Alukat said: »
Lakshmi.Zerowone said: »
Stop feeding the troll.
will do.

Asura.Kingnobody said: »
Nazrious said: »
Bahamut.Alukat said: »
...
now i stop feeding the troll. so don't expect anymore answers.

Always a smart course of action mate.
Apparently he wasn't talking about me



demaining this ***
[+]
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By Valefor.Endoq 2014-12-19 02:44:13
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I'm hungry :(
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By Cerberus.Pleebo 2014-12-19 02:55:33
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/feedsEndoq
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By Asura.Kingnobody 2014-12-19 07:25:35
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Siren.Lordgrim said: »
It has though kingnobody the United States biggest economic growth came right after the civil war up to before 1913 never forget that year.

That was all without a centralized banking institution known as the federal reserve.
When you go from $100 to $200 in a 5 year period, of course it seems like there was a lot of growth, percentage-wise. But if you go from $200 to $1000 in the next 5 year period, then your argument would say that there wasn't as large growth as before, even though the total amount of growth increased by 800%.

The USA's largest real economic growth was between 2001-2007. Back when we had a real leader in the White House who promoted such growth, and real leaders in Congress who passed legislation for growth.
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By Siren.Lordgrim 2014-12-19 07:56:35
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Asura.Kingnobody said: »
Siren.Lordgrim said: »
It has though kingnobody the United States biggest economic growth came right after the civil war up to before 1913 never forget that year.

That was all without a centralized banking institution known as the federal reserve.
When you go from $100 to $200 in a 5 year period, of course it seems like there was a lot of growth, percentage-wise. But if you go from $200 to $1000 in the next 5 year period, then your argument would say that there wasn't as large growth as before, even though the total amount of growth increased by 800%.

The USA's largest real economic growth was between 2001-2007. Back when we had a real leader in the White House who promoted such growth, and real leaders in Congress who passed legislation for growth.

wrong, i am sorry to say this to you, in 2001-2007 we was swimming in massive debt, which was part of the 101 years of Federal Reserve fractional reserve banking we was also under extreme unemployment rating as well. If you think growth of debt is a good thing you must be crazy, no debt is good and to put that on future generations is absolutely wrong and should be a capital crime as it is considered a Odious Debt.
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By Ragnarok.Nausi 2014-12-19 08:37:58
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Bahamut.Alukat said: »
Ragnarok.Nausi said: »
Can someone sum up Alukat's views in a single post?

Preferable Alukat.

We need to set priorities. (living standard vs. gross national income) High GNI doesn't automatically lead to a high living standard for all people.

We need to consider short term solutions to minimize damages/prevent more problems untill the long-term solutions are having an effect.

I'm prefering a hybrid of capitalism and socialism.

"The cake is a lie" (the "wealth for all" capitalism lie)

the way money is being created is a scam and will always lead to economical crisises.

i guess this summary will do the job ^^

The cake is not a lie. The idea that we live under capitalism and a free market now is the lie.

The liberal machine currently running the country has it's fingers in every major economic sector to the degree that in order for the sector to evolve, it requires massive participation by government.

This is not capitalism, this is not a free market.
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By Asura.Kingnobody 2014-12-19 08:48:05
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Siren.Lordgrim said: »
Asura.Kingnobody said: »
Siren.Lordgrim said: »
It has though kingnobody the United States biggest economic growth came right after the civil war up to before 1913 never forget that year.

That was all without a centralized banking institution known as the federal reserve.
When you go from $100 to $200 in a 5 year period, of course it seems like there was a lot of growth, percentage-wise. But if you go from $200 to $1000 in the next 5 year period, then your argument would say that there wasn't as large growth as before, even though the total amount of growth increased by 800%.

The USA's largest real economic growth was between 2001-2007. Back when we had a real leader in the White House who promoted such growth, and real leaders in Congress who passed legislation for growth.

wrong, i am sorry to say this to you, in 2001-2007 we was swimming in massive debt, which was part of the 101 years of Federal Reserve fractional reserve banking we was also under extreme unemployment rating as well. If you think growth of debt is a good thing you must be crazy, no debt is good and to put that on future generations is absolutely wrong and should be a capital crime as it is considered a Odious Debt.
As a nation or are you talking about governmental debt?

Besides, I was talking about economic growth. You don't add debt to the calculation of overall economic growth. That's only production.

Also, unemployment was roughly between 4.4 to 5.8% during the 2004-2007 timeframe. That's not extreme unemployment, that's nominal unemployment.

This is unemployment that you can never get rid of, because people change jobs all the time, plus there are seasonal workers and those who choose to remain unemployed, which BLS tracks.



Yes, this doesn't track actual unemployment due to people working or not, but the labor participation rate was constant up until 2009.



I don't think massive debt is a good thing, but debt that you incur and have the ability to repay is not a bad thing at all.
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By Asura.Kingnobody 2014-12-19 08:49:56
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Ragnarok.Nausi said: »
Bahamut.Alukat said: »
Ragnarok.Nausi said: »
Can someone sum up Alukat's views in a single post?

Preferable Alukat.

We need to set priorities. (living standard vs. gross national income) High GNI doesn't automatically lead to a high living standard for all people.

We need to consider short term solutions to minimize damages/prevent more problems untill the long-term solutions are having an effect.

I'm prefering a hybrid of capitalism and socialism.

"The cake is a lie" (the "wealth for all" capitalism lie)

the way money is being created is a scam and will always lead to economical crisises.

i guess this summary will do the job ^^

The cake is not a lie. The idea that we live under capitalism and a free market now is the lie.

The liberal machine currently running the country has it's fingers in every major economic sector to the degree that in order for the sector to evolve, it requires massive participation by government.

This is not capitalism, this is not a free market.
Don't listen to him, he believes that socialism is the way to go, and that the only way to create economic growth is to increase wages without increasing production.

It is a very good thing that no country does that, except France, and we all know how well they are doing economic and socialistic wise.
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By Siren.Lordgrim 2014-12-19 09:14:43
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See there is a problem " They " as in the republicans and democrats do not wish to repay or even have the discussion of using any ability to repay with anything about the debt. Shockingly no matter which gets put into officer they either add more to the national and governmental debt, or go to war to create debt as well.

You know your system of government is bad when you are born into this world 50,000 in the hole automatically put on you with no choice or say in the matter. People who never been in debt there whole lives in America are lied to. They are also in debt even without touching a credit card or owing a mortgage.

That graph you showed of January was grossly wrong as well. In 2013 of January US unemployment rating of american citizens that were of working age and without a job and could work was roughly 90 million if you round up.

The cold hard facts is America needs jobs. As of 2014 in social media we see new talks of lowering the unemployment rating by the obama administration. But little do they tell you the reason there is less folks signing up for unemployment is not because of jobs. It is because they made policy's to restrict unemployment benefits to 6 months trying to make it seem they are making a change in helping America work. Millions could not qualify to receive any assistance. YET big everything gets all the assistance they want off of hard working honest american citizens who pay there taxes faithfully.
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By Jetackuu 2014-12-19 10:25:50
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Lakshmi.Aelius said: »

poor table
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By Asura.Kingnobody 2014-12-19 10:30:28
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Siren.Lordgrim said: »
See there is a problem " They " as in the republicans and democrats do not wish to repay or even have the discussion of using any ability to repay with anything about the debt. Shockingly no matter which gets put into officer they either add more to the national and governmental debt, or go to war to create debt as well
You are only using the last 2 administrations as an example.

You forget about the 106th US Congress, which was during Clinton's last 2 years. The leaders of that specific Congress developed bills that accelerated the 105th US Congress bills to curve spending, and created an actual surplus of federal funds, which enabled our national debt to go down.

This is from recent history. Republicans and Democrats haven't really changed that much since then, not like the Rs and Ds back in 1960s to today.
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By Jetackuu 2014-12-19 10:32:00
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Oh like the Gramm-Leach-Bliley act of 1999 which repealed Glass-Steagall, which enabled the housing bubble which led to our economic collapse?

yeah...
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