Manibozho Jerking V Anch. Cyclas +1

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Manibozho Jerking v Anch. Cyclas +1
 Sylph.Tigerwoods
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By Sylph.Tigerwoods 2013-12-30 21:43:09
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Asura.Squishytaru said: »
manikin
I got the special one of a kind brand :D

http://www.amazon.com/Darice-16-Inch-Sectioned-Wood-Manikin/dp/B004GXBYUC/ref=sr_1_4?s=arts-crafts&ie=UTF8&qid=1388461356&sr=1-4
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By 2013-12-30 21:46:08
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 Fenrir.Motenten
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By Fenrir.Motenten 2013-12-30 21:55:36
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Diff

Anchorite+1:
+8 str (+2 fStr)
+10 dex
-9.5 acc
-27 att

For Smite, 8 Str (assuming not capped on fStr) is worth about 6 base damage, which is maybe about +2% damage, and corresponds to anywhere from maybe 12 to 24 attack, depending on mob defense (higher def mobs need more attack to get the same value).

So on the highest def stuff, the difference in damage is basically tied to how much crit rate you get from the dex, as the str and att pretty much cancel. For more middling stuff the attack will outweigh the str, though you're also more likely to get more value out of the dex, so again it's a wash. For the weakest stuff, the attack won't matter (though neither will fSTr), and you're likely to be over-capped on dDex, so Anchorite's just gets a small edge from the extra str.

Summary: mostly a wash regardless of target, when you think about probable stat differences. Anchorite's gives you more def stats during weaponskill, of course, if that's a concern.
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 Sylph.Tigerwoods
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By Sylph.Tigerwoods 2013-12-30 22:16:22
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So Togi+1 and Haramaki are no longer viable options?!?

I'm glad I unsubbed!
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 Odin.Cyprias
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By Odin.Cyprias 2013-12-31 00:56:49
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Asura.Squishytaru said: »
Makes a thread seeking the opinion of what obviously will be from educated people (if it has any weight), AKA elitists. Listens to the guy saying to ignore the elitists.
Giving too much credit for elementary algebra lol.
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By Selindrile 2013-12-31 05:01:01
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On one hand, I do understand the business of asking questions, why bother doing the math myself when it's already been done by more skilled people who have considered more variables than I would. I'd rather play another game in the meantime and just ask a question of someone who is better at the math and takes some joy in doing it and answering questions. (Though then to reject the ideas they set forth after asking, is rather stupid.)

On the other hand, I don't think a shell with like 20 melee whms can be considered elitist. >.>

Also pretty sure there's a Last Airbender joke in there somewhere to be made about the monk being an X element based class.
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By Pantafernando 2013-12-31 06:03:30
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Selindrile said: »
On one hand, I do understand the business of asking questions, why bother doing the math myself when it's already been done by more skilled people who have considered more variables than I would. I'd rather play another game in the meantime and just ask a question of someone who is better at the math and takes some joy in doing it and answering questions. (Though then to reject the ideas they set forth after asking, is rather stupid.)

On the other hand, I don't think a shell with like 20 melee whms can be considered elitist. >.>

Also pretty sure there's a Last Airbender joke in there somewhere to be made about the monk being an X element based class.

I would say more that the equations arent readly available, needing to go in page to page in wikia to find what each factor mean, how its calculated.
Dmg calculations isnt widely spread, as well ws and its specific characteristics.
But it must be emphatized that every equations is just a aproximation of reality, and due its a multi variable equation (that required an input of players str, att, mob vit, def, plus the effect of critical hits and special defenses), there isnt a numerical solution just knowing player stats. Human dont have the capacity of solving multi variable problem with a single equation, so assumptions need to be made, those will be the north of any conclusion.
Each diferent case would require more imput of mobs stats, one thing that guides cant be based because it would be an infinite vomit sets from optimal set for first worm in gustamberg till an optimal set to when you fight tojil in the condition when hes partially debuffed.
Good thing the minor changes in str or att low affect final dmg output, so aproching the best gear for a situation you dont consider your actual situation still wont have a visible diference, due to gears in adoulin being almost the same.
Talking about my practice, from what i see, a capped att normal hit dmg would be somewhere near 600 a mnk with oatixur. If your dmg is too bellow that, most likely you will need more att factor in your gear. If its near that, prob str will do more for dmg in ws.
 Shiva.Onorgul
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By Shiva.Onorgul 2013-12-31 06:26:03
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Pantafernando said: »
I would say more that the equations arent readly available, needing to go in page to page in wikia to find what each factor mean, how its calculated.
Dmg calculations isnt widely spread, as well ws and its specific characteristics.
It would take a moment to collect and collate all the data you need to figure it out, but most damage mechanics are readily available on BGWiki. FFXIclopedia (Wikia) has been spotty about updating and sorting data for years now.

In practice, if you spend a little time learning how the equations work (which I'll freely admit is not how an MMO ought to be programmed -- it really should be upfront and straightforward), you can intuit the conclusion that Motenten provided, namely, that nominal differences in stats make nominal differences in performance. I love looking at people shoving gearsets into spreadsheets to find that if they tweak hardcore and collect some obscure niche items, they'll do an extra 10 damage on average with Victory Smite! That kind of neurosis needs medication.
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By Selindrile 2013-12-31 06:45:48
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Shiva.Onorgul said: »
It would take a moment to collect and collate all the data you need to figure it out, but most damage mechanics are readily available on BGWiki. FFXIclopedia (Wikia) has been spotty about updating and sorting data for years now.

While true, it's also likely true that someone has already done the calculation or something very similar that you're after, and accounted for more variables than you, like Prothescar, Motenten, etc, the people who do use the spreadsheet or who wrote them. Also even learning the equations don't make it always so easy to intuit the right answer, but you're right in that most endgame gear choices are marginal upgrades, but these things add up altogether.

Shiva.Onorgul said: »
I love looking at people shoving gearsets into spreadsheets to find that if they tweak hardcore and collect some obscure niche items, they'll do an extra 10 damage on average with Victory Smite! That kind of neurosis needs medication.

Some people get enjoyment out of such things, I might say that anyone who is actively discussing a topic such as this on an internet forum and trying to assert some sort of superiority there is sign of an equally medication-worthy mental illness.
 
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By 2013-12-31 10:29:29
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 Shiva.Onorgul
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By Shiva.Onorgul 2014-01-01 14:05:32
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Asura.Squishytaru said: »
It's not neurosis. It's just taking the right tool for the job. I own and carry a few different Leatherman every day, but I always want nice specialty tools. Gear swaps are like a nice Kobalt 227 set.
The difference being that you're accomplishing something in real life that will affect other people. If less than 1% damage in a video game meaningfully affects that video game and yours and others enjoyment of it, that suggests a game that is too tightly tuned or a group that is behind by a lot more than <1%.

Put another way, I'm not suggesting that it is ok to use Imperial wrenches to fix your metric device (all bicycles, f'rinstance), but if you have a choice of three different brands of metric wrench and the only meaningful difference is the red-colored on costs 50 cents more, you're better off not bloody bothering either way.
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 Valefor.Prothescar
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By Valefor.Prothescar 2014-01-01 14:13:21
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I used to have all of the maths for XI compiled in one place, but it didn't belong where I had it. Have considered making a sort of standalone directory/compilation for it otherwise, but meh. Not many people actually care about the maths or want to do it themselves, they either

A) Ignore it, stating that those who do the maths are elitist ***

B) Are too incompetent to understand what they're being told and misunderstand/argue against the factual evidence

C) Just let someone else do it for them anyway and thus don't need the help doing it themselves


Odds are, if someone cares about the maths of XI, they know it all already.


Selindrile said: »
Also pretty sure there's a Last Airbender joke in there somewhere to be made about the monk being an X element based class.

Nope. Long live Madawc
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By Selindrile 2014-01-01 23:28:27
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Prothescar: Even usually as a member of C.) I would definitely enjoy a place where all the equations are together and some conclusions drawn from it either a page on the wiki, or a sticky on FFXIAH, for the times when I can't find an answer to what I'm asking, even if you find that project more trouble than it's worth, I'm appreciative of the number crunching you guys do, just wanted to say thanks for that in general.
 Sylph.Rafaras
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By Sylph.Rafaras 2014-01-02 08:52:35
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FFXI = The only place were you use Real Math.
 Odin.Cyprias
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By Odin.Cyprias 2014-01-04 01:57:48
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Sylph.Rafaras said: »
FFXI = The only place were you use Real Math.
Said no one ever.

Real Mathematics involve theories, lemmas, conjectures, and depending how you use the word "Real," dimensions. >_>
 Fenrir.Sylow
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By Fenrir.Sylow 2014-01-04 02:00:20
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It's not real math unless the one proof you really need to see is left as an exercise.
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By Pantafernando 2014-01-04 02:24:11
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Math math just works with base theories and solving till you get an exact equation after hipothesys.
Conclusions in ffxi that player base have access are find based in experimental evidences and through long tests and observations, and equations deduced to fit a set of known responses.
What we manipulate in ffxi is more a engineering than a mathematic work.
 Odin.Cyprias
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By Odin.Cyprias 2014-01-04 22:55:18
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Fenrir.Sylow said: »
It's not real math unless the one proof you really need to see is left as an exercise.
Hah! Ain't that the truth.
 Shiva.Onorgul
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By Shiva.Onorgul 2014-01-05 00:23:53
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He meant arithmetic, you nerds. And he's right: unless you happen to be an engineer or mathematician or similar, the average person uses mathematics never and arithmetic with surprising rarity. We don't even have to balance checking accounts these days owing to near-instantaneous updates to online-accessible bank accounts.
 Sylph.Peldin
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By Sylph.Peldin 2014-01-05 01:14:56
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There was a statistician that drowned crossing a river...

It was 3 feet deep on average.
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By Selindrile 2014-01-06 11:31:40
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A statistician walked into a bar...

He wondered if it was mean.

*rimshot*
 Cerberus.Senkyuutai
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By Cerberus.Senkyuutai 2014-01-06 11:59:41
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Fenrir.Sylow said: »
MNK is a fire-based job.


I missed you, prince of the Dark Knights and high ranked mathematician of our times.
 Fenrir.Sylow
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By Fenrir.Sylow 2014-01-06 12:43:48
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Cerberus.Senkyuutai said: »
Fenrir.Sylow said: »
MNK is a fire-based job.
I missed you, princess of the Dark Knights and high ranked mathematician of our times.

fixed

also DRK is terrible ;-;
 Fenrir.Sylow
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By Fenrir.Sylow 2014-01-06 12:48:27
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Also now that I can see the image, I really don't get it!!
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By cervelo84 2014-02-02 10:56:27
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Asura.Emoneaone said: »
Looking them both over, using a 15/15 Mani, path A, I'd have to go with the Anchorite in general. More STR, far more Def. Your main loss is the 17 accuracy and 32 attack, which is only slightly offset by the boosted STR and DEX.

I can understand your wanting a simple answer, as usually it's as you pointed out, "... Ice day, facing NW, wind from the east at 15 knots..."

Just ignore the elitest snobs we get on these forums. Since IRL they are unimportant slugs with no real life, they have to come across as if they are high and mighty here, where no one can reach out and slap them.


This guy owned all you! GOod post. ty for info
 Valefor.Sehachan
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By Valefor.Sehachan 2014-02-02 11:02:00
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Yeah, such greatness. So blown away.
 Bismarck.Llewelyn
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By Bismarck.Llewelyn 2014-02-02 11:05:00
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cervelo84 said: »
This guy owned all you! GOod post. ty for info