Going to go ahead and start the thread and update it as I have more data to add. Passed this point I won't list anything but the stat I've currently increased, which will be either DEX or STR (doing DEX first), everything else will remain the same for the duration of the testing. This might take me a couple of days to get done, there's no way I can sit here mindlessly swinging away and recording every single hit constantly, or I'll go insane <_<. This time around I'm also differentiating between an attack being Evaded or Missed. Also, since I'm unable to kill these, both Rank and Physical Level will remain the same (not leaving the area until I'm done either) Weapon will be repaired when I increase point values, that's about the best I can do for consistency on weapon damage. Jewelry has been removed as well. Also this is for normal attacks only, it doesn't include enhanced attacks (Rampage, Bloodbath, etc) or Weapon Skills.
Rank 26MRD, Physical Level 35.
Stats: 20STR, 80VIT, 20DEX, INT14, MND18, PIE17
Gear: Bronze Spiked Labrys, Bronze Barbut, Bronze Haubergeon, Leather Tool Belt, Sheepskin Skirt, Bronze Sollerets, Reinforced Bronze Mitt Guantlets.
Testing on Yellow Aldgoat Billies near Nophica's Well (Aethryte gate from Camp Horizon)
My STR And DEX Testing
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My STR and DEX testing
Baseline done, I'm only doing 200 attempts per go, should be enough to establish a trend, if there is one.
Baseline results Hit: 126 times (63%) Missed: 30 times (15%) Evaded: 44 times (22%) Not exactly encouraging for an argument that DEX = ACC, considering my DEX is currently sitting at 20, and that the mobs I'm fighting are yellow to a rank 26. I'll continue to just update this post as I go, check back for updates as you wish.. Once I'm done with my testing I'll bump this thread up again. 30 DEX results. (10 point increase) Hit: 130 times (65%) Missed: 28 times (14%) Evaded: 42 times (21%) Maybe there is something to this, still requires more testing, but it seems ACC has increased slightly. As a side note, I've noticed that I'm not really scoring any critical hits.. I've read that DEX effects CRIT hits here, but I'm not testing for it, just thought I'd add that in there.. Also, the results I got from raising VIT I recorded just out of curiosity, an increase of 1VIT gave me 12HP, 10VIT gave me 123HP and 20VIT gave me 245HP.. 40 DEX results. (10 point increase) Hit: 128 times (64%) Missed: 26 times (13%) Evaded: 46 times (23%) 50 DEX results. (10 point increase) Hit: 134 times (67%) Missed: 18 times (9%) Evaded: 48 times (24%) 60 DEX results. (10 point increase) Hit: 126 times (63%) Missed: 23 times (11.5%) Evaded: 51 times (25.5%) Seems ACC just keeps jumping around, I'm back to thinking it plays little or no part into anything, by now we should have seen some clear difference 40 points is a good chunk. I had planned to keep increasing in increments of 10 until I reached an ACC cap, but when I first commenced testing and noticed I wasn't missing anymore than usual despite having taken my DEX down by 60+ points, I told myself I'd end this by 60 if there wasn't a clear and established trend. So that's what I'm going to do. Cheer! I already did my portion of testing, but this nice =)
yea i get atleast double evade to my misses it's pretty gay.
biggest question of the day? how can i crab in his shell evade you? Phoenix.Katori said: yea i get atleast double evade to my misses it's pretty gay. biggest question of the day? how can i crab in his shell evade you? YES! Calling an end to the DEX testing, details above.
Going to test STR on ATT power, and also going to see if it's a damage reduction. Going to record the damage from about 50 hits, and average them out, then raise and retest. Did evasion change noticeably during the testing?
Valefor.Shaone said: Did evasion change noticeably during the testing? how were critical hits affected?
Carbuncle.Kyofooyo said: how were critical hits affected? Valefor.Slipispsycho said: As a side note, I've noticed that I'm not really scoring any critical hits.. I've read that DEX effects CRIT hits here, but I'm not testing for it, just thought I'd add that in there.. STR is done. I went in increments of 20 this time, just to expedite the process along, you can draw whatever conclusions from all this data you want, I mostly did the testing so I'd know what I should spend my points on, and I think I've narrowed it down to focusing primarily on STR and VIT.. The values listed below are averages out of 50 hits (Damage Dealt), this is for normal hits, I did record what few crits I got for each test, but there really isn't enough of them to draw anything from them, so I'll put them in, but shouldn't be used as the basis for anything. I also took notes to see if there was any correlation between STR and DEF (Damage Received)
Baseline results. (20 STR) Damage Dealt: 107HP Damage Received: 179HP Critical: 142HP 40 STR results. (20 point increase) Damage Dealt: 115HP Damage Received: 197HP Critical: 154HP 60 STR results. (20 point increase) Damage Dealt: 119HP Damage Received: 205HP Critical: 150HP 80 STR results. (20 point increase) Damage Dealt: 129HP Damage Received: 197HP Critical: 168HP 100 STR results. (20 point increase) Damage Dealt: 138HP Damage Received: 201HP Critical: 161HP Valefor.Shaone said: Carbuncle.Kyofooyo said: how were critical hits affected? Valefor.Slipispsycho said: As a side note, I've noticed that I'm not really scoring any critical hits.. I've read that DEX effects CRIT hits here, but I'm not testing for it, just thought I'd add that in there.. oh oops, my bad! =O Congrats on your STR / DEX testing Slip. I'm proud of you. Good to see another person testing things as well. I mentioned in a previous post here that if you did testing you would find that what I said was true. It looks as tho you have. I'm glad for that for 2 reasons.
1. You took it upon yourself to actually test it, and help bring something to the community. and... 2. You're finally in agreement with me on the borked *** stats. On a side note, I noticed in your DEF testing that you were testing STR as damage mitigation. In actuality VIT is damage mitigation. This is actually stated in the "Call of the Adventurer" within the game. I've also tested this stat in reference to this particular claim. It does indeed mitigate damage; however, I've also noticed that VIT from gear does NOT effect your HP in any way. No matter what gear you test with. Seems only the VIT you put into your char from the point allotment screen is all we get, and it's capped (soft and hard). I'm currently working on an exact mathematical function to determine both caps, but can't get anything concrete as of yet. Here is what I have so far. 2 points of VIT per rank, with a cap of 30 at rank 1. At every rank above 10 that is divisible by 4, you get an extra 2. Why the hell this is I have no idea, but it's working. Ex: Lv.10 > 50 Lv.11 > 52 Lv.12 > 56 Lv.13 > 58 Lv.14 > 60 Lv.15 > 62 Lv.16 > 66 etc. Try this and see if you get the same result. Leave it to SE to overly complicate something simple.
Nice so DEX has no noticeable correlation on ACC. That's what I thought looking at all these tests out there.
Good Job!! Garuda.Ezell said: Nice so DEX has no noticeable correlation on ACC. That's what I thought looking at all these tests out there. Good Job!! My best guess is evasion, but I'm not concerned enough with building up my evasion to go back and retest and see if it's worth me putting a focus on DEX like I was... I shall leave that to someone else... <.< Of course it's entirely possible, knowing SE, that DEX does indeed only effect critical hits, and some WSs. i havent done any serious testing, but i've been pooring most of my stats into dex since the start. rank 19 archer phy 32 with 95 dex. i've noticed that i useally crit 1/3 of the time. i rarely evaide things around my level but when im leveling up rank 10 jobs i dodge most of the time.
All this testing is really impressive, and I'm glad to see someone's gone out and figured this out. You stated that you saw ACC jump around a lot. For the number of tests you did, there's actually a fairly large margin of error, so the variance you saw in percentage is acceptable. A good conclusion to make is that accuracy isn't being affected at all.
cptgoldie said: i havent done any serious testing, but i've been pooring most of my stats into dex since the start. rank 19 archer phy 32 with 95 dex. i've noticed that i useally crit 1/3 of the time. i rarely evaide things around my level but when im leveling up rank 10 jobs i dodge most of the time. This touches on one thing I'd like to note: A friend quoted to me that maximum stat that benefits your level is [( job level * 2) + 32]. If this is so, then anything above 70DEX does nothing for your Archer. This is also something that should be considered when doing tests, as you may be throwing unnecessary points in your stat pool. My own tests (link below) showed something similar, but with a slightly stronger correlation between DEX and ACC. All of my tests were done on the same mob, so there would be no variance between their stats.
Regardless, the link between DEX and ACC is so weak that if it exists at all, it's incredibly hard to verify. It's quite possible that the effect is currently just bugged (ex., a .1 multiplier instead of a 1.0 multiplier, etc). http://ffxiv.zam.com/forum.html?forum=152&mid=1288505576253253837 Lakshmi.Angina said: This touches on one thing I'd like to note: A friend quoted to me that maximum stat that benefits your level is [( job level * 2) + 32]. If this is so, then anything above 70DEX does nothing for your Archer. Your friend is incorrect. If that were true, then the max VIT for level 10 would be 52. When in actuality it is 50. There is no consistent formula that you can arrive at using such a simple method as it seems that on some levels (I've found that it is levels divisible by 4 beyond rank 10) you can actually allocate 4 stat points (8 if > 40, 12 if > 85, 16 if > 125? (can't remember that last cap)) to your stats and still receive benefits etc. SE have just come out and said DEX affects acc:
Lodestone post edit: And it states that all stats have caps beyond which there is no effect. But the testing so far still does seem to indicate that DEX isn't having a dramatic effect, so there must be another factor in play. Perhaps there is a lower limit on acc and on the mobs being tested capped dex is still below the lower limit, so increasing is having no effect. I'd like to see testing against level 1 mobs from a high level char, but I don't want to pull out all my dex and test myself as my primary craft is goldsmith. Quote: Q. I allocated all of my bonus points to STR, but it did not increase my damage output nearly as much as I had hoped. Why? A. Each attribute has an upper limit, or "cap," that rises whenever a character's class rank goes up. Therefore, even if a player allots all of his or her bonus points to a single attribute such as STR, it is not the case that this will yield overly dramatic results. Distributing bonus points across several attributes rather than concentrating on a single one will result in a much more well-balanced character. That's an interesting faq (bookmarked for later reference), but I have another solution as to why DEX doesn't seem to be doing anything for acc, even though SE state that it does.
It's broken. Odin.Blazza said: That's an interesting faq (bookmarked for later reference), but I have another solution as to why DEX doesn't seem to be doing anything for acc, even though SE state that it does. It's broken. Maybe you'd only see the ACC increase on mobs that are high enough that they require a party to take down, but that poses a problem.. You'd have to get a bunch of people together that would be willing to help you in testing, that's something I don't believe I can do.. The STR = ATT certainly showed itself in my testing, the DEX however, did not. So I'm not really sure, maybe it is broken, but without strenuous testing on mobs of all types and levels, it's pretty hard to say one way or another. Odin.Blazza said: That's an interesting faq (bookmarked for later reference), but I have another solution as to why DEX doesn't seem to be doing anything for acc, even though SE state that it does. It's broken. Aside from what feels like you trying to troll on ever post you make, have you ever considered that it just doesn't show the accuracy being adjusted on the attributes page, but it actually does work? Not scientific testing, just eyeballing, but I was in a party on yarzons in the mines near camp bald knoll (or whatever it is called) and I noticed my acc, in particular WS acc, was horrid. I was just stacking strength and vitality as I was of the mindset dex was broken (was at 50 at the start of the party). Feeling gimp, I reassigned points during some downtime to increase dex up to ~65 and there was a noticeable difference in WS acc and regular attacks were landing more as I always seemed to have TP ready to use.
I am wondering if the effects will be more noticeable on higher level mobs for party play. Obviously further testing is needed. Side note, this is a great 20-25 camp and fighting buccaneers was fun! This is pure conjecture, but could minimum hit rate be ~65%? Is there any testing showing a lower hit rate than that?
Valefor.Shaone said: This is pure conjecture, but could minimum hit rate be ~65%? Is there any testing showing a lower hit rate than that? I wasn't trying to get concrete, irrefutable evidence for what ACC % was at any given DEX, just trying to see if raising DEX actually increased ACC. I suspect 1 of 3 things now that SE has stated that DEX = ACC, and that is either A. ACC, even at minimum stats is too high to be noticed on solo-able mobs. B. The benefit is very minimal, and more extensive testing would've shown ~1% ACC or so for every 10 DEX added C. The system is broken, or isn't functioning the way it should be. Done some testing, I'll post more details/gear etc tomorrow and try increasing dex more.
Used Pseudo's FFXIV Log Parser. Between each group logged to force a new log file, and repaired weapon (Brass Knuckles) to full. Captures were done by copying logs between each group into a new sub folder and running report on those. Target was Cassiopeia mobs in Cassiopeia Hollow, tested with green and blue checks on pug21. Killed a small set of yellow check mobs at 66 dex and initial indications were that acc was around 65% which was too low for what I wanted to test. Dex 66 71 90 101 Blue Acc 74.39 77.28 79.77 Green Acc 70.11 73.58 74.58 78.57 Sample sizes: Blue Dex 66 sample size 371 Blue Dex 71 sample size 176 Blue Dex 90 sample size 89 Green Dex 66 sample size 639 Green Dex 71 sample size 405 Green Dex 90 sample size 417 Green Dex 101 sample size 238 Total 2335 Accuracy is on y axis, current dex on x. Lines are marked for blue check and green check mobs.  Obviously not conclusive tests, but certainly seems to show a trend. But, but Blazza said DEX is broken, in multiple threads!
Edit: SHAONE I like the avatar XD Do you have a friend EmDeFive? |
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